Another Christmas one - am AIBU, or my husband or my parents?

[Donostiera]

Sorry. Very long and just so boring, though causing me huge misery. My parents live very far away (as far as possible in the UK), a bugger of a journey and expensive. I'm an only child and love them but they are quite problematic; child-rearing probably wasn't their forte and they are getting old and selfish now. We aren't one of those close families that can't imagine not seeing each other at every opportunity, and it's frequently difficult when we do. My husband's parents are both deceased. We have one daughter. Anyway, normally they come to us every second year for Christmas and we visit them for New Year in the other years. Everything was on course for that to happen as normal when my mother sent an email saying 'don't worry if you all can't face the awful journey, we won't mind if you don't come especially as we'll be seeing you in October' (my daughter and I are meeting up with them for a few days at a point midway between us). So I made the fatal error of taking that to be the truth and actually thought maybe Mum couldn't face the catering etc, as she's just had a second hip replacement. So said we aren't going, husband mightily relieved and me too as he is always awful to me when they are around (tension between daughter and wife roles that he just doesn't seem to have it in him to deal with, so I normally end up peacekeeping in public and crying a lot in private). Spoke to mum a week later and she was very huffy but said nothing. Spoke to dad the next week and he 'just had to tell me' that she is devastated, has been crying into the Christmas pudding mix, can't bear the idea of having no-one visit; furthermore I should be modelling to my daughter that one should be dutiful towards grandparents (bear in mind I never saw either of mine more than once a year when I was a kid and I have taken her to see them twice this year already). So of course I feel dreadful and think we should make the trip after all, but also really cross at being emotionally blackmailed. Husband can't see past the emotional blackmail and goes on about my 'guilt' as if it's a negative trait, whereas I see it as conscience - I've upset them and have it in my power to be the bigger person by changing my mind (even though I and husband will then have a shit time). And I feel there's a strong element of duty there; they won't be around forever and they have been and are generous to me / us in their somewhat controlling way, though never exactly emotionally supportive. If Mum hadn't sent that email we'd just have arranged to go as normal, because we 'ought'. Now husband is saying I want to prioritise being at their beck and call over our relationship which 'always suffers when we visit them'. The latter is true but we can't very well never go and see them again and he would have put up with it if the normal arrangement hadn't been called into question. And they live somewhere where it would be insane to visit for less than 4 days. My daughter is happy to visit them and we more or less manage to keep the tension private (she's 15 so not completely oblivious). So what on earth is the right thing to do? My vision of New Year in Lanzarote obviously isn't going to happen as parents know we don't have alternative plans and to make some now, knowing of their upset, just seems too mean. They won't come to us or meet midway, though they are happy to have two winter sun holidays in November and January so travel is not off the table per se.

This really could be me. Thank you for sharing. I think you meant 'why'? As I said, they have two holidays booked, in November and January so refusing to travel to us is not rational. Once they've got as far as somewhere they could fly from for their holidays it's only a few hours on a direct train to us.

I know I’ll probably be tarred and feathered for saying this but it must be jarring to be expected to do a ‘difficult’ journey to see family that chose to be so far away. When you say it’s the furthest in the UK you can go is it up in the North of Scotland? I understand the journey up to the far reaches is particularly treacherous but people move there then expect family to visit them at the click of a finger. DH parents are elderly and moved back to Ireland 30 years ago. It’s where they’re from originally. They’re ok people but emotionally cold. They weren’t the most supportive mum and dad to DH but he does what’s right for his conscience, albeit not very often. Someone I know’s Ds has moved his family from the South to the tip of Scotland. The grandkids etc. No connection to the place whatsoever. I see it as firmly making sure no one they left behind can call in on a whim; the journey takes two days. In your situation OP I wouldn’t go. They’ve made their life there and yours is elsewhere x

This is partly true (outer isles) except they've been there all my life, and a decade before that. They left their own families behind and have never had close or frequent contact with them so that's the model I saw in my childhood. They did what they had to as their parents got old / infirm and eventually incapable, but so will I (and it's going to be f-ing difficult)

I wouldn’t be manipulated by my mother like that but I’d also be having strong words with dh that I know it’s shit but him making it even worse doesn’t help anybody at all least of all your daughter.

I get he is probably fed up of the dramatics from your mother and you always caving but silent and grumpy doesn’t fix anything.

Id stop visits being over big key events. Less pressure if it’s just a week randomly rather than the big Christmas or new year trip.

This. Go to Lanzerote. Go and visit another time when there isn't the pressure of a huge celebration for anyone to cater and don't take your husband because he's'busy.' It will be a nicer visit for you without DH.

They'll either come round or continue to sulk. I think if you give into this emotional blackmail, you'll be in it for the long haul. Explain you took them at their word and have made other plans but you and DD would love to come at this time, if welcome.

Life is too short to be dutiful but crying and you never know where DD will find herself in a few short years so enjoy New Year in Lanzarote before she gets a better offer from some mates. Go on, OP. Just this once. Enjoy yourself. You sound like an absolute saint. You deserve it.

Oh so they moved to the outer isles to distance themselves from their own parents? Reap and sow are coming to mind. All you can do is what’s right for you xx

He sounds awful. Selfish, mean spirited, nasty and childish. I think you’d be better off without him personally, there are so many red flags in all this; the anger at you for being treated badly by your parents, inability to support you, doesn’t pull his weight, your daughter doesn’t like his behaviour and he’s emotionally abusive. There is nothing good at all in this. And he won’t change.

Why isn't your family allowed a happy Christmas? Your daughter will look back on her childhood and wonder why her needs weren't priorities to you.

Make your decision and stick to it, and make it clear it is your decision, not your mothers or Dh's. To be honest I wouldn't go, give yourself a year off from parents and do as you please.

I cut the apron strings on the Christmas expectation after Covid. Two virtual christmases, then we decided to stay at home rather than do the obligatory hike to parents. My mother was livid, it’s taken 5 yrs for her to accept it. At some point you have to stick to your guns.

Your husband, however, needs to grow up and support you properly.

Joint holiday to Lanzarote staying in different hotel rooms? Neutral territory so less tension or parent child roles? Hubby can take himself off on day trips etc.?

bear in mind I never saw either of mine more than once a year when I was a kid and I have taken her to see them

You need to toughen up @Donostiera and put yourself first. What do you want to do?…really prefer, not what you should do!

There is obviously a back story where you don’t feel your parents put you first.

I am in a similar situation and at times when I might back down and give to them, I think about what they gave me, how they lived their life, how their choices have impacted now.
My parents weren’t actively involved with me as a child, weren’t particularly proud when I moved away to university, didn’t help me.

When I married and had children they didn’t become involved grandparents either, too much effort.

When my marriage ended, when I needed them most, they moved abroad. When they came back years later, a last minute change of mind meant they decided not to live near me and their three grandchildren.

I have never moaned about their choices. They are theirs to make.

But now that they require more support, I can’t help them often.
Now that they are in the UK for Christmas and other family celebrations I don’t spend it with them. They didn’t spend their time with me when we were all younger.
When they moan about not seeing very much of their grandchildren, I very carefully remind them that my children are not used to having them around.

I will not feel guilty about any of that as this is the impact of their own decisions.

God love you.
Manipulative parents and an abusive husband for many many years.

Do not think for one moment your daughter will not be absorbing this.

You need to speak to someone about your toxic life, surrounded by awful people.

Your mothers email was ridiculous.
Your husbands behaviour is really shocking.

I wouldn't want to be with sny of them.

You are a boiled frog" deep in FOG, fear, obligation and guilt.

Life is too short.
How can you love a man who treats you so poorly?

This is a really sad existence, you deserve more than this and your daughter deserves to have a better model for a happy, healthy, mutually respectful relationship where love is not a question.

Separate to the immediate question of the festive period, I really think you should reflect on your answer here and the dynamic of your relationship and what you want for you and what you hope your daughter one day has, and make the moves needed towards it, eg counselling (separate and / or couples), hard conversations, discussions with your daughter, etc.

What reason do they give for never coming to you?

Haven't rtft.

There's a difference between being kind to people who genuinely deserve your kindness, and completely deprioritising your needs for people who also only consider their own.

If you could throw away your sense of guilt completely and think, do I want to go, what would you say? Because that's your answer. If you want to go and see them then go for it. If you would much rather not have the agro it shows their behaviour over the years has caused issues and it's not your responsibility to swallow your feelings for their failings.

Them being your parents does not equate to you owing them something. Especially not if they make you miserable.

Everyone in your life is emotionally abuse. Your mum, dad (complict) and your husband. It sould like your being pulled and manipulated in all directions and that people ae only happy when you live a life of servitude and do as your told. Realistically, someone is always going to be dissatisfied. That doesnt mean they get to treat you like shit. I think you need to work on yourself because you are putting up with this shit to your own detriment.

Pretty much this op. I’m really sorry. Don’t put up with your parents shit. Just don’t. Or your husbands come to that…

You poor thing. Sounds like you're trying to keep everyone happy and they aren't behaving very well. You kind of expect older parents to come with these challenges (well I do anyway) but your husband is being a bit of a brat (maybe something to do with losing his own parents?). Anyway, I hope you can decide what you would prefer to do and do that. If you're disappointing your husband you could tell him life is mostly duty and he needs to step up and stop making it harder. If you're disappointing you mum, you could tell her you look forward to next year now she's been clear on her feelings, but this year won't work as you already began making other plans (even if they aren't booked yet).

Don't put up with this emotional blackmail shit.
Shove right back at them

Sounds like another covert narcissistic mum with enabler dad.

You’re right on schedule to waking up to this stuff . Do your own research and see if it resonates.

Tell them that's what happens when your loyalty is tested and that you'll never believe a word they say noe. Have the year off

Go away just you and you’re daughter ,leave everyone else to sort themselves out .

I would be very pissed off if my husband if he allowed his parents to dictate Christmas every year, then pandered to emotional blackmail. The whole set up sounds miserable.

Emotional manipulation is not a game you should be roped into with your Mum or Dad. You should just say based on her email, you have made alternative arrangements. I wouldn't want my teen, or my husband, or myself to be tied to a miserable Christmas, with miserable people. You do you, and feel no way!!