That it's a massive waste of time, effort, money, lives and we should just bring them over by coach and ferry.

[Ablondiebutagoody]

I have just watched the video from earlier today/yesterday of a migrant boat departing Boulogne. The one where the Dad (presumably) ditches his toddler in the sea in order to get onto the boat. The kid was instantly picked up by French emergency workers and it struck me that this whole situation is completely bizarre.

There were approximately half a dozen lifeguards around the boat on jet skis and paddle boards, probably also a load of police out of frame. The boat will then be shadowed by French coastguard vessels until halfway across the channel, at which point border force/RNLI will pick them up and bring them to the UK. They will then be greated by coaches, a couple of hundred riot police and some gammons before continuing to their destination.

AIBU to think that this is all a total farce and we should simply provide the coaches from the outset?

YABU - The current arrangement is best.

YANBU - Coach and ferry would be better for everyone.

Yes, fleeing the war torn third world country that we know as France 🙄 They were perfectly safe there and their actions put the people who save them at risk needlessly. If they want to risk their own lives leaving a safe country then that’s on them but they shouldn’t expect others to put themselves in danger because of their reckless behaviour.

Yeah, I’m always baffled by this

I haven’t been to France for many many years, but what is happening there that is so terrible they have to escape from it? You’d think we would know?!

OP- this thead will not end well. People who were unfortunate enough to be born into countries where just existing and surviving is a bloody lottery so try to leave and make a better life for themselves and their families- not new.

What is newish that certain people with an agenda have successfully politised this, created an imagined enemy and caused a massive disruption and distraction within UK policy and politics. Immigration has mainly benefitted the Uk. Most recently when we were part of the EU, but the austerity was the the fault of former communist block countries joining. David Cameron' s vanity project ended that and we are all worse off for that.

Now all the UK's problems are apparently down to 'small boats' and every person arriving in the UK this way is a rapist and a threat to women and girls and just having the best life because they just get given benefits, a council house etc ahead of 'British people'. Apparently sticking up tacky flags half way up a lamp post and protesting in balaclava make you a proper nationalist and defender of the UK.

This country is in the shit because for many reasons, but the comparatively small number of asylum seekers we take in is not the reason. As someone who has worked with asylum seekers (child protection- so not exclusive to this)- I am usually in awe of these people who have taken the huge step of leaving everything behind to make this journey. Doctor's, scientists etc People who have seen family members murdered because of their opinions etc. The narrative of they are just coming to the UK for any 'easy life' is so bloody disengious when people are literally using their whole family's wealth and risking their life often to try and escape persecution.

I am so fed up with people banging on about the UK being full whilst expecting the benefits of a global economy. Then those who make a big thing about being British but just happened to have been born here, just luck- no contribution or understanding of how immigration has been a massive part of the make-up or success of this country. There are so many factual studies on how the UK benefits from immigration it is really exhausting.

I’ve just watched it on The Telegraph app

The alternative is them not getting on the boat. Or stopping off in any of the other save countries.

Over 700 arrived today on small boats. How many of them are doctors and scientists I wonder? NHS waiting lists will be zero soon if they keep arriving at this rate and the scientists will eradicate illnesses and who knows what else.

@ItsOnlyMee1, just because we happen to be an Island? European countries take far more refugees than we do. We also colonised a lot of the world, therefore English is the 'world language' so it is understandable that those who use English and their second language want to settle here. Everyone bangs on about it being our benefits etc but compared to other countries these are really poor. People usually want to settle where they have family support but also where they speak the language. A lot of people fleeing persecution will have family in the UK and speak English. Many have family elsewhere and settle there, luckily other countries also use and speak English fluently. The narrative that the UK is some kind of Utopia amazes me, since Brexit we are a back water.

Ignorance isn't attractive.

I don’t think so re a backwater. But also most people even Labour seem to sell in reducing the crossings so it might be hard to do the opposite and get voters to switch to wanting more people to arrive.

Just because they're granted asylum, that doesn't mean thaf they aren't economic migrants.

I know that international law effectively stipulates that asylum seekers can claim asylum in whichever country they fancy most, as long as they can eventually make their way there; but it's just a legal fiction.

Any half-wit knows that leaving a place of safety for one that you like better is 100% a choice rather than a need. Just like genuine people who use a food bank do so because they can't afford the food they need from anywhere; there are no food banks out there that are dedicated to providing people with food from M&S because they don't reckon that the same food from Lidl that they can afford is good enough for them.

@moonraker0-and how does this really impact on you personally? In the whole massive scheme of things facing this country those people will not tip things over the edge. If you were born in Syria (for example) and needed to get yourself and your family out and spend everything you had and take that huge leap of faith that you and your family would be safe, not be at risk because you happened to be born where you were, what would you do? Because birth is a lottery. A lot of people coming to the UK are doing so because it is not safe where they live, and often our foreign policy has played a huge part in that. I cannot even begin to understand what is like be in that position, because as much as I deplore UK politics over the last decade, I am very privileged and this has never been the reality for my family.

You can find Charlotte Gill on Substack if the Twitter link scares you. Shes only up to £312 MILLION taxpayer funding on asylum and migration charities - shes got a few more thousand charities to go through.

x.com/CharlotteCGill/status/2102467900577652770

It would be better if we could have refugee / asylum assessment centres in France, and then give safe passage to those who qualified.

Unfortunately then, unless the French detained and deported them, the others would still attempt to cross by dinghy. But instead of calling the coastguard / border force once they enter British water they will proceed as clandestinely as possible and enter without anyone knowing who or where they are.

It’s interesting to me that you gave the example of Syria

They’re not even in the top 10 countries that claim asylum here

And they have access to an official resettlement scheme. So I’m curious why you chose to mention Syria.

if you have a look at the list and the reasons given, you may be surprised.

The top country is Pakistan, usually through the Visa overstaying route, and the numbers granted have declined since the home office started putting them under greater scrutiny.

@OffTheMap, unfortunately most people decide to misunderstand that there is no actual agreement that an asylum seekers must seek asylum in the first country they reach. I find it really upsetting that so many people have so much hatred towards some if the most vulnerable people on our planet, including women and children fleeing horrible regimes. Apparently all asylum seeking men are predatory rapists and a huge risk to myself and female children and relatives. As a woman who has been subjected to domestic abuse and rape from our home grown, white misogynists and who continues to experience misogynist abuse from the same in my day-to-day work, I find this media led narrative offensive and racist.

Absolutely not. Just as you and I have to go through the necessary procedures to enter another country, so should these illegal immigrants. Genuine refugees from war wiil have help in the form of the organisations which provide aid to those areas. It's all beyond a fucking joke and I am embarrassed and angry to be part of such a pathetically weak country that the world laughs at.

If I was fleeing from war I would be genuinely grateful to reach the 1st safe country. I wouldn't then travel through loads of other safe countries to then risk my own life and my children's lives by crossing the channel in an overcrowded dinghy.

The majority of the people coming across are young men. They are economic migrants. Occasionally you get women and families if they can get on the boats. I have seen news reports of them being pushed off the boats by these men.

The point is that it is illegal for them to enter our country and a large proportion of people don’t want them here.

It would be political suicide to bus them in. How would it deter others from coming?

YABU for giving 2 voting options that both involve bringing more people to an island whose resources are already under strain.

@EmeraldRoulette, just an example, no great mystery, did not realise I had to Google stats. I work with people from all over the middle east, Asia and parts of Africa and parts of europe etc. where genocide, cultural cleansing and capital punishment/systematic rape etc is ongoing. I have done so for over 20 years. Of course, you may not agree that people wanting to leave these regimes should be our responsibility. However as a senior nurse and now a senior social worker, many are working to prop up our services. When my brother was in ICU for 4 months last year, the care he received was amazing and the NHS at its best, only one nurse on the unit was not poached from the developing world. Birth is an absolute lottery, I feel very lucky that my DC have not been born into a country where their sexulity, political leanings or that of their family places their life at risk. Rather than take the view point 'they are just getting in small boats to fleece the UK', I would rather flip it or 'how bloody bad is it that we risk everything, including life to try for a better life'.

@Dameputtingonabraveface ”unfortunately most people decide to misunderstand that there is no actual agreement that an asylum seekers must seek asylum in the first country they reach.”

there there’s nothing under the refugee convention, but both the EU and the UK have made this part of their legislative framework.

As usual, I looked it up and found that the EU were actually doing a lot more of it than we are!

wrt your other point… I think most people would agree that legal immigrants are hugely important to support in both the NHS and care work. They aren’t really the subject of this thread though.

They ARE gammon, though

What do you mean?

@2dogsandabudgie, there is a very good reason why families send the young men. It is well documented outside the right wing press, which seems to be where everyone gets their 'factual eveidence' from. FYI, young men can also be at risk- even Albanian men, who every one is convinced are just here to commit benefit fraud and sexually abuse women and girls. It is all out there to read up on, unless you only only rely on the daily mail. It is all quite recent really but what these threads prove is very few people have an understanding/care about the world outside their class whatsapp group.