To think friendship is hard for childless/childfree women

[Percypiggz]

Especially in your 30s, or maybe its just the friends I've had. My school friends mostly have children now and I last saw them in December. I travel to them every time, they have never been to where I live, I always go to soft play etc and accommodate them, I get 0 back. If I don't contact them, nothing will happen, but I know the ones with kids do meet up themselves still.

Join a club is the usual suggestion, and it can be useful but it's not a guarantee. I went to a women's only group called 'girlsonthego' and was the only person not in the 18-25 bracket. I do an evening class which i enjoy, there are 5 of us and I am the only person not over 60/still in full-time work.

I've been to groups suggested on the 'meetup' app, but unfortunately some men saw it as a dating opportunity even though I am married and obviously not looking, I wasn't comfortable being approached by them.

So I feel a bit lost really, I do have friends but all very casual. Sometimes I feel it's better that way because I don't get pressure to do expensive things, friends who aren't real friends, who are in competition with you, insecure, talk behind your back and so on. But it is harder if you aren't a parent, anyone got any tips? I work Saturdays so I can't do parkruns

Disagree, it sounds a bit aggressive to me. Unnecessary!

I can see both sides. I have child free (by choice) friends who I cherish. I absolutely love seeing them, I go away on holiday with one of them and I make an effort to make space in my schedule for them. It's not always easy as I do have children and a)I also want to spend time with my kids, and my DH without my kids and b) we live quite far apart but she also has a full and varied life with her own commitments. But I value the friendship and we both work to maintain it.

Equally, she recognises I'm not always able to drop stuff at short notice in a way she can and I have additional things to juggle.

But I've never let having kids stop us being really good friends.

YANBU
I was the last to have kids and spent time with my friends with and without their kids. They were usually glad of a break!
From reading your post I think the issue is distance? Not sure how far you are from them. We all live close so it's not so much of an issue i.e went for coffee when they were in bed etc.

I feel as if I owe an apology to all my child free friends from when I was in my late 30s/early 40s. We’ve reconnected again now but I honestly don’t think I was a good friend. At the time I thought they don’t understand how hard it is getting out of the house with a young child, or child care when your DH works long hours/shifts. But honestly, looking back I could have made more effort.

Even worse, there were a couple of people I had made friends with in my late 20s/early 30s as many of my older friends had DC earlier than I did and I had more in common with those who also didn’t have DC at this point.

It’s always worse being the outsider.

All your friends are Childfree or not ready to have kids. Now you’re saddled with a baby or toddler. Friends all meet up together having fun and you’re stuck at home. They aren’t interested in hearing about your life as it’s dull in comparison.

Or all your friends have young kids. You can still come along to soft play or the park but it’s seriously boring, they can’t or won’t travel to meet you, and they all meet up together with their children.

One thing my friend finds difficult, is the ones who had kids with feckless men who won't do any parenting.

I think this was a snark but I will answer it.

I have / had several interests but a) not many of them were conducive to friendships and b) a lot of them are very difficult to keep up with little children, although I will be getting back into them. One of my big passions was nature - it still is, I love the changing seasons, the wildlife and the natural world. I read books about it and watch documentaries about it, I walk in it, I love just being immersed in it. Is that an acceptable interest? I’d say so. Is it one that lends itself easily to friendship? No, not really; maybe if you’re specifically into bird watching or something but I’m not.

If your interest is a team sport or playing a musical instrument in an orchestra fair enough but for most people an interest isn’t enough to sustain a friendship.

I'm 37 and childfree. I'm also self-employed and work alone.

I've made a lot friendships via my dog - I have to walk him everyday, and if you do the same routes at the same times, you meet the same people and get chatting - dogs are an easy "conversation starter" and if you meet someone else with a dog, you already know you have something in common.

I have friends with children and friends without. No issues at all.

I didn't read it as aggressive or unnecessary - frustrated maybe, and I understood her!

Being a mum is already a neverending cycle of having to consider everybody else before yourself, and now we have to consider what more we can do for our child free friends?? It's honestly harder for us having to say no all the time. We already feel like shit friends, trust me 🤣

I think it’s very similar for anyone without children in their 30-50s. BIL is childfree and he’s really struggling now that the last of his close friends has had a baby. I think there are a few things here. I think many adults this age are closest to their partners and still old school and uni friends. If you don’t have a partner and you haven’t held on to those long term friendships, then it’s hard to meet new people.

Secondly, it’s a time when friendships change. BIL is struggling because friends no longer want to stay out late getting drunk and doing mushrooms. 🙄 People don’t want to do that at 40. You need to adjust to inviting people over for lunch or a cup of tea.

I think where friendships do develop at this age, it’s very organically through shared interests over time. I’ve met lovely people through hobbies and groups I go to. But not like I went one time and made a friend, more like it’s something I enjoy I did it for years and over those years, I’ve gotten close to people. It didn’t happen overnight and I didn’t do it to find friends. I actually have little interest in making new friends! But over time, you get to know people and it happens. It sounds to me like you need to adjust your expectations and not put so much pressure on yourself.

To be honest, when I experienced the parent friendship drift in my 30s (as the child-free one), when I was told this it didn't help - it made me think, our brilliant social group and/or my friendship with you was apparently so boring that you chose a life like that instead?

The thing that helped most is that I'm not in a social group where everyone was becoming children. DH was, and that was tough for him, but I have plenty of child-free friends and a social group with a healthy disregard for the conventional marriage-and-kids route that I never felt like the odd one out.

In terms of the parent friends who did drift from me, there were some cases where it was evident very soon that the friendship was over, because they entered such a weird mummy/daddy bubble and made it so clear that nothing outside it held any interest for them any more. But a lot of others didn't do that, and while we might not have had time to meet as often as we used to, we kept the friendship going on a more sporadic basis. And after about five years... so many of those friends are back on the socialising, with half a decade of pent-up desire to party to let out. It's been a lot of fun having them back!

I also got through it all without setting foot in a soft play thing or doing any child-focused activities. The reason I'm child-free is so I don't have to do any of that.

Im childless and disabled so no hope for me!!
I have friends with and without children. Some I have lost to their children as they seem to have no other interests except the children and I am just not as interested in their child as they are.
But some who do have children but have supportive partners are easier to do things with, and have interests outside of their kids.
But I have also lost childless or child free friends to pets or distance too.
Lots of things can end a friendship
It is hard op, I understand. Unfortunately most people our age seem to have young children and not much of a social life. And I am definitely looked upon with suspicion, accused of hating children, etc because I don't have any. So that hurts when I am not childfree by choice.
It's a minefield for us women. Dh gets nowhere near as much grief as I do.

I’m late 40s and child free. I have a core group of friends from pre kids scattered around the country who now have kids. It’s been an effort to keep things going on both sides but as their kids are now teenagers they are beginning to emerge and have more time. I agree that a key part of this has been that they have all married decent men who actively parent their own child and enable them to spend time with me.

Meeting new people outside of work has been hard. As with others my hobbies are mostly solo. I don’t see being childfree as part of my personality so would be reluctant to form a friendship based just on that.

I've lost a lot of my child-free friends or friends with older children since having mine during covid.

What I would have loved is for them to understand I was struggling and to make effort with me and want to get to know my child. Which is what I did when my sisters or friends had children before me. Some of my friends absolutely did that and we're still friends now. Others couldn't handle not being centered in my world anymore and the time I did manage to give to them wasn't enough and some friends I guess it was just me who maintained the friendship so they naturally fell away.

I wouldn't underestimate how much your visits might mean to your friends with children. They're probably much looked forward to and valued.

OMG! Your friends should make an effort. Good friends are hard to find and should appreciate each other! I just listened to a brilliant song about good friends by Erica Badu. Have you thought about joining an interest club? Book club? Sports team? Knit and natter? Etc. Can be a great way to find your people. Good Luck with this!

If it helps (it probably won't) once you're about 50 they'll come looking for you as they have less childcare stuff.

I found child free friends online in my 30's, somehow, but they were never people I could see weekly or anything because the geography was random.

Now I'm nearly 60 I have loads of friends as people my age no longer have young children. Some have grandchildren. And many now don't work full-time so more time (and money) available.

The thing is, if those that made v little effort come knocking later on I wouldn't have open arms tbh. I'd feel a bit used.

I’ve never had kids but most of my freinds have. I did do nearly 100% of the keeping friendships going when they had kids as I was never going to be their first priority. I babysat to give them time if they wanted and did soft play etc etc. All the kids are grown up now and friendship has reverted back to as it was before. Sometimes the adult children join us for socials as well which is lovley.

it’s worth making the effort as a lot of new parents struggle.

I'm childfree by choice, in my sixties and don't recognise the problem you describe.

In my thirties my circle was a mix of career driven people, some with children, some without. We were all buys, had our own priorities and our friendships ebbed and flowed but were always strong and that has been the same all through my life.

One thing that made friendships work for me was that we knew each other via work - so worked and socialised around that together, or we knew each other from various hobby groups which we all prioritised as they were keen interests e.g. five aside football, art classes.

My closest friend had two children in her twenties. I sort of fell in love with her children as I had her and spending time together was a pleasure. I'd often babysit so she could do her own thing. A lot of give and take and a lot of fun for all of us.

Now she's older, her children are grown and we are still like peas in a pod still and in a different way.

Also key is that when my friends had kids we were all aging. They didn't want to be up all night dancing - but neither did I - we grew up together in different ways.

I'd suggest adapting to rather than resisting change OP. Also, to join hobby groups you enjoy rather than just to make friends. That way you'll enjoy the group even if you don't make friends but you're more likely to make friends with people with whom you share interests.

@Percypiggz there is a mumsnetters without children board which you might find useful to visit xx

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/childfree-mumsnetters

I’m really sorry for some of the responses you’ve had to your post OP. I have kids, and yes they can be hard work especially in the early days but there are some really defensive replies here from people who have clearly chosen to make themselves total martyrs to their children, to housework and I suspect to their husbands, who are probably getting a lot more free time than they are.

Mothers who are not struggling financially, are not single parents and don’t have SEN kids, should be able to make time for their child free friends. Men can look after kids, and so can babysitters. If they are good/proper friends, have you tried talking to them about how you feel? It’s possibly just busy lives and thoughtlessness and a chat would make them consider your feelings more.

My children are teenagers now and a lot of my friends who sacrificed literally everything for their kids in the early years are looking around and thinking ‘what next?’ So I think you may find the boot is on the other foot in 10 years time. But in the meantime, I’d do as others have suggested here - just take any and all socialising opportunities to gradually build your circle.

Cut off your nose to spite your face if you want.

I quite like having more time with friends now who had their time taken up for a couple of decades by family stuff. It's not as if they could just ignore their kids.

As another bonus, many are also going through divorces!

I have a tight circle of friends that includes of a number of gay men. These are friends that I made when I was single. No competition. No one hitting on me. Expendable income. They had and have my back. None had children.

Now they are my husband’s friends, too.

Bonus because the straight people in this group are good people, too.

I'm not sure that's cutting your nose off to spite your face.

Having kids isn't a reason not to bother with your friends.

I know this doesn't help you right now, but they do come back! In my friendship group, there are mums and non-mums and - just as you describe - the mums drop off the social scene or stick to themselves when their kids are young. But when the kids get a bit more self sufficient, in my experience, the mums are raring to meet up with their friends and have grown-up social time after several years of exclusively mum activities.