To think friendship is hard for childless/childfree women

[Percypiggz]

Especially in your 30s, or maybe its just the friends I've had. My school friends mostly have children now and I last saw them in December. I travel to them every time, they have never been to where I live, I always go to soft play etc and accommodate them, I get 0 back. If I don't contact them, nothing will happen, but I know the ones with kids do meet up themselves still.

Join a club is the usual suggestion, and it can be useful but it's not a guarantee. I went to a women's only group called 'girlsonthego' and was the only person not in the 18-25 bracket. I do an evening class which i enjoy, there are 5 of us and I am the only person not over 60/still in full-time work.

I've been to groups suggested on the 'meetup' app, but unfortunately some men saw it as a dating opportunity even though I am married and obviously not looking, I wasn't comfortable being approached by them.

So I feel a bit lost really, I do have friends but all very casual. Sometimes I feel it's better that way because I don't get pressure to do expensive things, friends who aren't real friends, who are in competition with you, insecure, talk behind your back and so on. But it is harder if you aren't a parent, anyone got any tips? I work Saturdays so I can't do parkruns

Awww, I'm so sorry @Percypiggz That's such a shame. I think many friendships do fall by the wayside when one of you has a baby, and the new mum ends up making new mummy friends.

I found my child free friends were the ones who deserted me when I had my first DC, 3 or 4 of them did, (so it was the other way around for me,) and it made me sad. They didn't want/didn't like children so lost interest in me. (Not all the child free ones, but a few.) I did make some new friends at baby groups though.

I can't suggest much more than you are doing really apart from socialising a bit more with child free people. Hopefully, some child free people may come and advise you. Just wanted to say I am sorry to hear that you're blue, and feeling let down.

You may want to report your thread, and ask Mumsnet to move it to the Child Free Mumsnetters board. You'll probably get more advice there

It’s frustrating when your friends with kids want to do kids based stuff but honestly it’s likely so they actually get to talk to you. If I go to a coffee shop with a friend and my kids I don’t get to chat because I’m blowing on hot chocolate, chasing a toddler, answering 2 millions questions, trying to keep them still and entertained, feeding them sandwiches etc etc. At a soft play, they will go and play and I can actually engage.

Do you invite your friends with children round to your house or your area and suggest things that they can actually do with children there realistically.

In an ideal world friends would leave the kids behind and be able to socialise with you, but honestly in reality that can be difficult to do and causes resentment, mum guilt and probably sacrificing other child free time somewhere else etc.

To meet other people without children, I would suggest maybe making more effort to socialise with colleagues at work outside the office, joining female only meet up groups so men aren’t there trying to date, keep checking out events in your local area and hope that if you persevere then you’ll click with someone similarly minded. Join a gym perhaps? I’ve recently done this and connected with lots more women.

I'm going to put it bluntly but it's only hard if you expect to still be the priority. That's exactly why romantic relationships fail after children too - the partner still expects to be a priority, and they're just not any more. If you're happy to be further down the pecking order then friendships/relationships can absolutely survive, you just have to compromise more.

I understand but I get absolutely nothing from them, having a child isn't an excuse for a friendship to become 100% one-sided.

What are you expecting to "get" from them? Don't you both get the pleasure of each other's company?

Not quite the same boat but as a 40 year old childfree by choice man it is also rather difficult to find friends.

I suspect there's other societal reasons beyond being childfree that make it a different challenge to being a woman but I empathise with you.

I slightly disagree OP and find @LikeWhoUsesTypewritersAnyway situation way more common, but I suppose it depends on where you are and how old you are.

As a child free, I could pick and choose my social options because I didn't have to hunt for babysitters, whereas my parented friends obviously did.

I had friends who were parents from their mid-teens, so they were friends with whoever never left to go travelling, studying, launching careers etc. So it was them that struggled the most and fell into friendships with other parents out of sheer necessity.

Are you me op?

I'm mid 30s child free and maintaining friendships feels like walking through treacle. I had a health scare last year and there was never an appropriate time to tell my friends as they never asked how I was doing. The danger has passed but I still feel a bit bereft that I didn't have any support.

No it literally is 🤣

I don't mean that offensively. But unfortunately once you have kids unless you have a 24/7 nanny and tons of family around to help all the time there is just no time or headspace for anything else. It gets a bit easier when they're older and at school if you're a sahm but otherwise kids completely 100% consume your life. Last week I had 9 unread WhatsApp messages that I just mentally and physically couldn't respond to. Let alone trying to figure out and make plans myself.
My best friend since the start of secondary school so almost 20 years of friendship got so sick of me cancelling or not being able to meet etc because of child related issues that she just ghosted me. And I don't even blame her.

It doesn't need to be that way. Many of my friends have children, we manage meet-ups with and without the kids (as the kids get older that gets easier). I also made some good friends in my workplace. It definitely demands more effort and flexibility from the childfree person when children are young and prone to catching every bug going, and some friends will inevitably fall by the wayside, but others endure and are very glad to have someone they can talk about something other than kids with.

@PercypiggzI totally get what you’re saying. As a woman in her early 40s who is childless not by choice, I find it so hard to maintain existing friendships and make new ones. I have always accommodated my friends with children. Like you, agreeing to tag along to soft play or a park visit so that I can catch up with old friends even though for me it has been awfully painful at times. Where do I place myself when making new friends? I’m not a mum of small kids, I’m not a mum with older kids. I’m too old for meet ups with 20 somethings but I’m not old enough to fit into the post menopausal groups of older women.
I have zero advice but I completely understand how you feel.

Hang in there, kids grow up and you'll get a semblance of your friend(s) back, it'll likely not be the same as before but it won't always revolve around soft play.

That's such a shame. I have lots of child-free friends who have great social lives but many of them have lots of friends who never had children, and so they were free to travel together, do creative projects together etc.

Could you set up a local FB group and a Meet Up groupd specifically for child-free women of your age group looking for friendship, not love?

Are you interested in any hobbies that might attract a more youthful crowd - rock climbing or triathlon training?

Honestly, I think the thing to do is to keep widening your circle in any way that you genuinely enjoy - fitness, volunteering, creativity, further education etc and gradually you will meet people you like. Some will have children. Some might be twice your age. Some will be close to you in age. Focus on what you like about the individuals, not how similar they are to you in age and circumstance.

In my early thirties, one of my closest friends was in her late fifties. Now I am in my sixties, one of my good friends is in her early forties. We had so many things in common.

I have managed to stay in touch with my friends with children (they live all over the country), but you have to accept that you are less important to your friends than they are to you. Also, remember to ask about the children, send Xmas and birthday presents, know what they're doing etc.
To be fair, I think those with kids do also like the chance to talk about topics other than children, and use their brains.
On the plus side, as the children grow up and leave home, you will find that your friendships strengthen again as your friends get more time to themselves. But be aware that you'll then have to start admiring photos of the grandchildren 😂

Personally I don’t find this true, I lost so many friends when I became a (single) parent and was no longer fun to them, I couldn’t go on nights out or holidays because of lack of child care and even spontaneous meet ups I couldn’t attend or they didn’t want my kids tagging along so friendships distanced. Cant attend groups or hobbies as again no child care for those and would mean paying sitters, and theres no guarantee you’ll become friends with your children’s friends parents (I found the school gates cliquey and unfriendly) but that’s just my experience but it seems easier to make friends if you don’t have children.

It’s true. I remember this and my thirties were very lonely as a result. this thread is an interesting read.

I actually totally understand where you are coming from. My best friend has 2 very young children and if I ever want to see her I have to drive to her house and sit there co-entertaining her children lol. I like her kids and I know it’s easier for me to drive to her but she will even say ‘can we meet up this week because it would be good to have backup for the kids’ 😅. I understand her perspective but it does make me wish she would prioritise one child free day out (ever!) as it’s very one sided. I know it’s natural as she has a lot on her plate but it’s a lot of hassle when you don’t live around the corner either! We see each other once a year now.

I’m lucky I have one childfree friend who I go on walks, picnics, and game nights with. I’ve known her since school, I’m lucky to have her tbh I’d find it really hard too. I have friends at work who are empty nesters and older than me (I’m 30s, they’re 50s) and I happily meet up with them too!). Sorry this wasn’t very helpful - I can only say I really sympathise!

it's only easier with kids if your other friends have kids. in lots of ways it's difficult but differently so. I don't say that as "ugh, I have it harder!!" but just as a reassurance that lots of women struggle with this, you future friends may or may not have them.

does it matter that in one of your groups your the oldest? if you're all adults without kids, then you have the similar freedoms and commitments as each other. possibly less so with the older group tho.

I honestly think your friends are the problem, not you or your situation. my longest lasting group of fitness, 2 don't have kids, 4 do from ages 6-11. we never do stuff with the kids and tho we don't meet up regularly due to distance, it's always a mutually agreeable place and it's about us all not just us Moms. I have a mix of fitness from 30s-60s with and without kids, it isn't a defining principle in my choice to be friends.

I'm just saying, keep putting yourself out there. don't limit yourself to "people exactly like me"

How easy do you think it is to travel to see you? I think you really don't get how difficult it is. Kids are full on 24/7, even with a partner. They can't just dump them to come see you. Aside from looking after their physical needs, kids do activities, have parties, get sick etc. This all needs to be accommodated and balanced. My friend has just moved counties - but if I want to see her I'll have to take my baby with me (I'll be breastfeeding for about 2 years). I'd still be leaving two more kids at home and will have worked out with my husband the best way of managing them whilst we're away.

You sound pretty difficult tbh. Parents have so much pressure (kids/partners/work/parents), that frankly someone stamping their foot and expecting some kind of 50/50 effort just isn't worth the mental and physical energy required.

The way you throw in "friends who aren't real friends, who are in competition with you, insecure, talk behind your back and so on" also makes me think you might be pretty hard work. Adults don't usually have this kind of teenage drama.

To meet other people without children, I would suggest maybe making more effort to socialise with colleagues at work outside the office,

Agree with this, I work in a large dept with a mix of parents & child free colleagues. The older (30s+) child free women are all very sociable & friendly with each other. Go away on weekend breaks/holidays too. Those with kids just don’t have the time & tend to only go to the Xmas night out! Make the effort & hopefully you can gain some friends at work. Good luck, I have few friends & often wish I had someone to do stuff with!

I would really disagree with that. If something is a priority for you of course you'll be able to have headspace for it! Personally, friendships are a priority for me so I need to be flexible and invested in keeping them alive just as much as my childfree friends.

@OP second the suggestion on setting up a meet up group that's perhaps aimed a little older? I was invited into a whatsapp group for one (didn't end up going) based on a monthly cocktail night and there were tons of members! Or could be running, books, whatever you are into?

If I didn't have kids I'd have a lot of spare money and would be on holiday/travelling as much as possible. I know people who have done group holidays and maintained friendships from them.

Depending on your job/career can you widen your involvement with other people through this (assuming its something you enjoy and are good at) through mentoring, organising social events, undertaking new training opportunities?

Volunteering is a good way to meet like minded people - some may have kids but presumably they are able to carve out time without them?----

Very angry post, sorry I must've hit a nerve?

How, HOW is she supposed to magic this one child free day just for you? And maintain her sanity? Because it's not just a day, it's the lead up and the organising, and the planning and the pressure.

Jesus Christ, if I had one child free day I'd book a hotel room and sit in absolute silence eating snacks and watching whatever I felt like or reading a book.

To everyone else- thank you for balanced answers!