Dh says the U.K is f***** and he never wants to go back

[Chippednailtoepolish]

These were his words this morning.

We live abroad in a place where a lot of people are coming to live, escaping the uk and America.
He says with everything on the news, the way it's going and what the people coming to where we are tell him, that we'd be mad to return.
Is he being realistic? I want to return to be with family desperately and have a strange feeling that I need to do it soon

Would we be mad to return at this time? If yes, then when!

Is there some kind of incentive/carrot for Americans to live in Spain, such as taxation on pensions, buy a house for €1 and do it up, and so on? Surely they need a residence or work visa? I think Portugal has pension taxation incentives.

Maybe Spain has remote working tax incentives I don't know. I do know that if a person is a US citizen they have to file taxes in the US and in the country they are living in, no way out of double taxation for them! But there are credit agreements in place in many countries, maybe Spain is one of them.

Was DD born in the UK? Is she British?

The problem is that our news is often very UK focussed. Lots of countries are experiencing similar problems. Nowhere is paradise. If you want to be with family and friends, and they are in the UK, don’t hesitate. It’s been bad before. The 70’s weren’t great. We all survive.

I wouldn’t want to live anywhere other than the UK, but there are certainly parts of it that I’m glad I’m not living in - Middlesbrough is currently top of that list.

It’s really strange to me how there’s been a rash of posts and articles along this type of theme. I don’t live in the UK anymore but all my family and a great deal of friends and colleagues do. Honestly, apart from healthcare which is hit and miss, none of these are concerns for any of them. This is from people living all over from London and SE, rural SW to major northern cities. None of them are unhappy or projecting to leave even though most have good jobs and could look to go elsewhere.

What a weird thing to say, to wish unpleasantness for others and be gleeful about the idea. I’m sorry you’re so unhappy with yourself and your life.

Why?

Agreed. And what "fallout"?

Where in the U.K. would you be moving to OP? I think that makes a difference to what your experience will be like.

I used to live in London but now I live near the Cotswolds. It’s like chalk and cheese - while government policy is obviously the same across the country, my lifestyle and surroundings are completely different. People are different here too.

I love the U.K. and wouldn’t ever want to move - my brother has lived in lots of countries around the world and while there have been elements in each which are better than the U.K., there’s always also been elements that are much worse too. It’s not an easy time anywhere right now; dickheads like Trump and Putin affect us all. But overall I’d much rather be here than anywhere else and I don’t think it’s anything like how the news portrays.

Is your DH British too?

Ow, now, he’s an ‘expat’ don’t you know, can’t be labelling middle class Brit’s with dirty words such as ‘immigrant’!

After walking down the main street in the town centre of my Midlands town today, I have to agree with him.

I think the NHS has improved massively in the last few years. I've had really prompt treatment for a couple of issues lately. And I'm fortunate enough to live in a low crime area (small town in a mainly rural county).

My only concern about going out after dark is falling over thanks to our low-energy and woefully inadequate street lighting.

It's clearly not the same everywhere even within the UK.

I live very happily in the UK but I believe in paying my taxes, the NHS and the welfare state.
I would hate to live in somewhere like Dubai. So really it depends on what you want and your belief system

Agree that crime is an odd thing to worry about and not something at the forefront of most people’s minds. Of course this will depend on your area. I moved here 17 years ago and have lived in 2 out of the top 3 biggest cities, now live in a small city. I have never experienced a crime. I know that’s fortunate but also surely indicates it’s not happening at a high enough rate to be a huge concern?

Agree taxes are crap. Part of what keeps me in the UK (other than enjoying the history and countryside) is the terror I have of not having the NHS to rely on. The idea that I would need to go back to paying for private health insurance - which you can very easily lose if you lose your job or become very ill would keep me up at night.

EDIT to add: people who say the nhs isn’t really there for them perhaps don’t appreciate the baseline level of care they receive. In my previous country (US) you quite literally get nothing for free and equally stuck in waiting rooms for 5-10 hours waiting for treatment. It’s MUCH better here. It’s also such a relief knowing my children have the NHS too.

What is tri national? Is it like being Jason Bourne?

Come back. Its a great place to live but leave your grumpy husband behind

Are you deliberately being obtuse?
Assuming you ever lived in the UK, you will obviously know that people's experiences differ wildly. Some people will live in areas with low crime good school and a good NHS trust. Others will live near or in high crime areas, poverty, obscene waiting lists for any services and generally feel pretty downtrodden. Then there's everywhere in between. 🤷🏼‍♂️

The USA and Spain have had a DTA since 1990, and it was recently updated. It prevents double taxation on the same income.

Spain is also a country that runs a golden visa in exchange for investment program, as well as generous tax and cash incentives to attract digital nomads as well as residents on a more permanent basis.

Wow, that's nothing like where I am, also in the SE.
Everything opposite!

I wonder if the OP has ever travelled around Spain, the country they live in, as it’s vastly different there too from one area to the next and the people have wide-ranging opinions as well.

What I wonder about is what will happen to people living in places like Dubai in a generation or two if they aren't able to earn money (perhaps through disability/mental health etc). Is there a welfare state that would apply to them? I guess they would try to come to the uk if they still had the right to do that. Is your county safe for your child if they become unwell after you havd died?

Yes. I've travelled the world. I understand people having different outlooks according to which part they're in, but surely they visit the worse parts or have some idea of the reality of the country as a whole?

I remember regular power cuts, interest rates at 15%, race riots, IRA bombs, unemployment through the roof, strikes and so on. Id say that was a lot worse.

Not if they don’t travel there, no, they may not have a full understanding. I can’t afford to travel around at the moment so I can’t tell you what it’s like in Middlesbrough. And a lot of us do know what it’s like elsewhere but are saying that our part is okay and giving our view. To say you are shocked there is a wide ranging view on one country is naive at best. That will happen anywhere and everywhere.

Not everyone can afford to travel, even within their own country. You are extremely fortunate to have had that privilege.

this! Obviously the news is not going to be 'and today the worst thing that happened is that Gladys and Doris from Ruralsville parish council had a minor tiff over a scone recipe' because that isn't newsworthy! It sounds like both you and your DH need some critical thinking skills OP. You seem to be relying on very biased sources - people who deliberately leave a country aren't going to be the ones who think it's wonderful!

The UK certainly isn't perfect but you need to think about what you as a family need/want from it and what your particular worries/circumstances would be if you moved back. In terms of crime your experiences are going to be very different if you moved to Tower Hamlets vs Harrogate. In terms of how far your money will stretch it will be very different if you want to live in Knightsbridge or Northumberland. But there will be actual, verifiable, stats on everything including crime rates, average wages and houseprices etc. easily available, so you don't have to rely on 'My friend's cousin's husband said....'