AIBU to keep reporting my sister over concerns for her children?

[Pipiscoming2023]

I live the other side of the country to my brother and sister, but keep in touch regularly with my brother and his family. My sister, however, doesn’t reply to any of my texts, won’t see me whenever I’m that way visiting etc.

The issue is she’s an alcoholic and she’s constantly in trouble. Shes 28 and has 4 kids, one of which is a new baby, and she’s back on the drink (and my brother thinks drugs too).

I get screenshots sent to me by one of my cousins who also lives near them, of things my sister is saying, videos of her drunk and fighting, just all the worst things.

My biggest worry is for those children. Both our parents were addicts and ended up dead before we were teenagers. I know how this goes. But my sister is refusing any kind of support from me (I’ve offered to take her to meetings, drs, just sit and have a cup of tea and a chat, everything).

It all came to a head earlier this year when I’d heard she was blind drunk the day after taking her new baby home and I decided to anonymously report her via crime stoppers. I felt awful but social services came over and by the sounds of it nothing was done.

She has since been out almost every weekend, keeps dropping the baby off at random peoples houses (according to my brother - she won’t let him have her because he’s so judgy she said), and last weekend ended up in a fight in front of her kids that led to a split lip and black eye.

Would IBU to keep reporting her? I know I’m not the only one that has but nothing seems to be happening. There must be a huge case spanning years, so why aren’t social protecting those children? And what can I do?

@Pipiscoming2023

What practical help have you offered to your sister and to your nieces and nephews?

To be fair, it’s a constant theme that people are so, so, worried about the children… that they’ll only report anonymously through some non direct route.
I’m sure that feels “safer” than facing to up to the consequences of reporting but I do wonder why that matters if you’re that worried about children.

That’s up to them isn’t it? I can’t answer!

Didn't thresholds for neglect get raised recently? I may be wrong, but I thought neglect needed to reach proper safety issues above general neglect to reach CIN levels now. Below CIN, everything is only with parental agreement and Family First. I could well be wrong though, as this is just what I heard from an upset DSL who'd been pushing for involvement for a family we work with. She could have explained poorly. I know it's been harder and harder to get support for very obviously neglected children.

I've worked with lots of very chaotic families and came from one too. There never seems to be formal involvement before a child is deliberately hurt and even then, I've known beating with objects being signed of from social services after a couple of months and parenting advice (very recently too). That's not to say you should stop reporting, because without all the background and history social services definitely won't step in, just that you shouldn't expect that much either. It'll help having the prior reports if it gets worse for them though.

I used to wonder how I was left in the position I was as a child, then I started working in schools and saw the thresholds for state intervention. I was occasionally beaten (knocked out and bleeding beaten, not hit), emotionally neglected, surrounded by drugs, forgotten and not fed. In my 20s looking back that felt like it had warranted social services help! I was upset I'd not been worth helping. Now, I've known a fair few kids in exactly that same position in work, with SS stepping down involvement or not taking it up initially at all when we're already very worried. It makes sense to me now, my own childhood and lack of support. There's just not enough social workers and support workers for all the neglected kids.

I’d think about contacting her local MP, tell them that many reports have been made by various people but that no/ not enough action seem to be taken - this should hopefully trigger some kind of overview and get all the agencies communicating properly.

It was a rhetorical question. It is sad when parents lose their children to the care system but as an adopter, my experience and that of other adopters I know is of neglectful parents being given chance after chance after chance - and the children continuing to suffer. If you are a baby, you can't go back and redo those early months when you should be in a cycle of a primary care giver responding to you, regulating you, mirroring you. You end up like my adopted daughter with an insecure attachment style and a hyper sensitive anxiety/distress response.

My experience as an adopter is that reports from concerned individuals are added to the file - until something utterly catastrophic happens. Then the children are removed as an emergency. Then the reports are taken into consideration when deciding what to do next.

I think you need to report and continue to report. Also ideally your brother and your cousins tooo. The more people who are concerned the better.

she will end up like your parents

So so sad. I am glad your daughter now has you to look after her

@Pipiscoming2023

How it will go is if you keep reporting in your sister to SS (and it’s best to do thus via your local authority MAST service), your sister will have a parenting assessment. If she fails this, or as part of this, she will be asked to nominate family or friends as potential carers for her children. There could be something called a family group conference, whereby family and friends step up officially to offer support to the family. Your nieces and nephews may be put on s17 child in need plans. Utterly meaningless. Probably a meeting every six weeks. If things escalate, then your sister will be subject to a s47 child protection investigation and then put through an initial child protection conference. Again, not much help. Although it is worth noting that if any of the children are considered to be neurodivergent - and foetal alcohol spectrum disorder or FASD is a recognised neurodivergence - then the older children will be expedited up NHS assessment waiting lists. To be clear, there is very little chance of your nieces and nephews being adopted as a family group and the eight-year-old is absolutely at the upper age limit for adoption. Potentially, most likely, the sibling group will be broken up for placement purposes. Before the local authority moves to looking for foster and/or adoptive placements, they will seek to try to keep the children within the extended birth family.

You are an excellent person to be doing as much as you can for these children. Report every single time for every single thing you are concerned about. Send in the videos as well.

I would specifically add in your reports that you are worried about the risk of serious neglect, non accidental injury or even death without intervention and a child protection plan.

Put in a safeguarding concern to the schools designated safeguarding lead and Multi-Agency Safeguarding Hub (MASH) in her area

If you know her GP /health visitor I'd be dropping detailed letters in reception..

CiN (child in need) is also only with parental consent

That is correct children can only have help as children in need if the parent consents and co operates.

This

I would also get into emailing the MP in her area - remind them of the many many tragic cases of failed children and social services in the news. Services which have been deemed inadequate and completely stripped of their duties, following child death investigations.

Also do try the NSPCC, they have trained professionals who can say the right things and would have local contacts. Hopefully it would trigger a more serious involvement.

Your sister may be hiding well if SS still pre warn people by phoning and making appointments, instead of just showing up.
Out if interest, did you report her the time she smashed up your car? She sounds horribly impulsive and in no way fit to be a mother.

If the police are there every weekend, they will have alerted child protection. I am surprised they haven't applied for an emergency care order to remove the children. Hopefully it is in motion. Phone the local police station see if they can note your very serious concerns, those poor children. Addiction is soul destroying, ruining lives.

This reads as though you're saying "don't report" because it will be OP's fault if the family ultimately gets split up.

Is that what you're saying?

Please do contact anyone and everything. Those poor children. And I am especially scared for the baby, they are so fragile. I knew a woman who used to behave this like, she would pass out in the playground at school. Her partner used to yell at her and/or just step over her. It was horrific and I ended up reporting her for the children’s sake.

I hope that someone does something to protect them all!

This is exactly, how, sadly, children end up dead, where lots of people know that there's major issues and no one reports.

Why would you do this and not your relatives who are local to her and see her in person. Whereas your version is all second hand from them. Surely they know the timelines much better than you and have the “evidence”?

The police are there every weekend and extensive involvement from SS.

The school will be aware of this as they will have been approached by SS.

NSPCC don't trigger anything that a referral directly to social services won't do.

If you write a chronology of events over the span of your timeline and then a summary of your concerns for the children's wellbeing, using words like physical neglect, emotional abuse, witnessing violence etc, that may help them take it seriously.