To want to tell my kids to fuck off

[allwrongnow]

Dd2(3) destroyed DD1(6)s Lego. Tried to put DD2 in a time out; of course she won’t stay so she’s in her room with me on one side of the door holding it closed while she screams the place down and DD1 follows me bellowing and ranting about the injustice of it so two kids screaming their heads off at me while I’m holding door closed.

I didn’t but I wanted to tell them both to fuck off. (I have never done this out loud but Jesus it’s tempting.)

Yes, I know I probably did it all wrong and no MNetters would have such chaos but that’s not my life I’m afraid.

Tbh a lot of what you’re saying about your dd2 sounds a lot like my DS when he was younger. Wanting what other people have, not listening etc

It’s just hard work! I do find that low demand parenting works well, and lots of praise, but obviously you do have to step in to stop bad behaviour, no one disputes that. And there can be consequences- but for me this was usually not putting in rooms or on stairs or anything they can disobey.

People probably expect it more in a boy but there’s nothing to say a girl won’t be this personality type.

But they can grow into really brilliant people with minds of their own - not spoilt and difficult but really lovely, considerate and independent with lots of love and sensible boundaries.

Yes it does matter that she is actually 5 because you’re calling her 6 while also repeatedly saying she is developmentally slow/delayed for her age and can’t even obey simple instructions as well as a dog. Your expectations are too high for a 6yo, and even more so when the child is actually still 5.

Pulling her hair to make her cry? You don’t teach a child not to hurt someone by hurting them! All you are doing is showing your children it’s ok for the oldest & biggest to hurt the younger & smaller.

OP, just wanted to say that I hear you. I don't think you are being difficult or dismissive. I'm sure you have tried literally everything so most responses here would literally make you just roll your eyes. I'm sure people will slate me for this but your daughter sounds like a horrible little shit so you have my every sympathy. I can't say I would cope any better than you are currently doing and I'm sorrry I can't give you any positive suggestions. If it were me, they would be spending significantly more time in their room until they got the message. But I'm sure that is a very unpopular opinion!0

I am a bit worried this comes over horribly but I genuinely don’t understand this but for me this was usually not putting in rooms or on stairs or anything they can disobey. so you tell me what you didn’t do but not what you did, not what the consequence actually was. And if she doesn’t care about the consequence then does it make a difference?

@SadEyedTigger i think a nearly six year old should be able to follow a simple instruction, but maybe I’m expecting too much to ask a child of five years and eleven months not to yank my hair out when I’m driving <sigh>

It’s just been a shit day, only 30 more of them.

She is a horrible little shit, I can’t really disagree with that. They both are.

And the thing is @SadEyedTigger again you tell me what I shouldn’t have done. Not what I should have done. And believe me I tried a LOT before reaching my absolute limit with having my hair pulled out. It was fucking dangerous; on that occasion I nearly drove us all into a ditch.

Of course it will teach her a lesson. Do horrible things and you get removed from the situation. Used to work on mine, you cannot reason with a 3 year old, the gentle parenting technique i see of people reasoning is ridiculous.

Time out isnt that outdated, it's not like shes giving her a slap on the arse and telling her child she won't sit down for a week if she tries that again.

Maybe I’m expecting too much that an adult of what? 30 something? doesn’t in the course of a single day pull her child’s hair until she cries or walks off out a supermarket leaving her 3yo behind, or ‘properly loses’ her temper over a snack, or shuts a screaming distressed 3yo in a room holding the door closed over Legos.

You can’t get your DC to behave when you can’t even control your own behaviour.

I used to bite mine back if they bit me ... resolved the situation 😂 though I understand its frowned upon on MN.. you need to take them outside with pj's and barefoot- solves everything 🤔

I really feel for you, you’re getting a really shit time on here.

The hair pulling is dangerous and you’re right it’s absolutely not something you can ignore. And I would expect a 5 year old to understand that.

practically speaking, is she sitting behind you in the car? If you moved her to the other side could she still reach you? I know this is just one of many things but if she’s not understanding not to, removing the opportunity is probably the best thing right now

No it won’t because the 3yo doesn’t understand what was horrible about wanting to play with Legos too. The Legos were on the lounge floor- where toys are usually played with. OP has ignored all suggestions to set up a Lego play area out of DD2s reach or a Lego play time when DD2 is otherwise occupied playing with OP.

Is there many places in your house that would be out of a three year olds reach but still within reach of a five year old? Because there’s none in mine

OK, so I let DD1 run off into the car park? It’s a bit of a Hobson choice isn’t it? I decided on balance DD2 was probably safer in the supermarket than DD1 in the car park.

The hair thing was after weeks of pulling my hair out and I lost my temper. Sue me.

Nor mine . DD1 isn’t the BFG.

Young cats fight and squabble, young dogs fight and squabble, little children fight and squabble. They're at roughly the same stage of development - and cognitive function.

So you train them.

Have a third item to distract her with - if she grabs item 2, give DD1 item 3. She then wants item 3, give it to her and DD1 gets one of either 1 or 2.

Reward looking away from DD1's stuff. Every time she even slightly looks away, oh, here's a strawberry/bunch of Lego or Duplo/whatever so that she learns to pay attention to your voice calling her as it might be something interesting or tasty.

Don't set either up to fail. DD1 is always going to dangle whatever she's got in front of DD2 either when she goes straight to see her or because DD2 will make a beeline for her, so take it off her beforehand. It's like going to dangle a feather toy on elastic in front of a cat and then wailing because the cat won't let go of it.

Put something in DD2's hands first before she can get anywhere near DD1. Redirect that laser like focus onto you and what's in your hand.

Use sound and gestures and short phrases rather than long strings of words - 'Oh, hang on, please don't do that darling, you really need to give your sister a chance to play with the lollilolabeggybabywhatchamacallit because it was given to her by her friend Ava and it's not very kind...'. 'WaiT' (hand up), 'Leave'. Do similar when walking with them at each crossing - you stop, say 'wait', then walk on 'go'. Then get them to wait on the other side (treat incoming - maybe a single sweet). Both do it, it becomes instinctive to wait before moving, and it means something good is coming to hear you say it. Both become safer outside and at home has slightly less of two wailing kids screaming for something.

A truly Machiavellian parent would make a tiny double clicking sound with her tongue every time the child does something that's to be encouraged, like release the claw like grip even slightly, as that can be shaped into what you want her to achieve in the end.

I have a 6 and 3 year old and I sympathise, my 3 year old would love my undivided attention 25 hours of the day if she could. We do time outs too if things are bad and it's age appropriate at 3! The bickering is relentless and I am dreading the next 4 weeks!! 😭 Today my 6 year old has spend some time in her room reading and things and it's been a bit calmer but still when together bickering. Exhausting!!!

Again, out of anger and fear you hurt your child, you lost control over your temper and your actions. A 5yo isn’t going to understand the danger of pulling hair in the car when you’re driving. They don’t have the capacity to predict cause and effect. They barely understand why they need a seatbelt.

I think you don’t want any help at this point. I was sympathetic to you as I have been in your shoes but at this point that has worn thin with your obstinate rejection of all suggestions. Right now I feel very sorry for your children.

Doesn’t work @NeverDropYourMooncup . she wants what DD1 has. Doesn’t matter if you offer her the moon on a stick, if it’s not what DD1 is holding then it’s not good enough. Thanks for the suggestion.

I do the WAIT and STOP. Gets ignored.

Thanks @zeddip . I unfortunately can’t seem to keep them apart. It’s utterly miserable!

I would probably still get people telling me to stick my four year old on a naughty step. Funnily enough it doesn't work on him and he is autistic.

@SadEyedTigger if you wouldn’t be angry and upset after you nearly killed not only your family but someone else’s then you’re a better person than me (and yes, you are and clearly think you are.) Again, you haven’t told me what I should do, just what I shouldn’t. And actually I do agree I handled it badly but I’ve had weeks of DD1 yanking my hair and it’s really getting me down.

Ok, then put things where only you can reach and you put things up or get them down when DD1 asks and while DD1 has the items, you keep DD2 busy/distracted.

It doesn’t have to be up high, out of reach can mean a locking drawer or cabinet that DD1 has a key to.

Ok, then put things where only you can reach and you put things up or get them down when DD1 asks and while DD1 has the items, you keep DD2 busy/distracted.

It doesn’t have to be up high, out of reach can mean a locking drawer or cabinet that DD1 has a key to.

I know you're at the end of your rope @SadEyedTigger but what's happening at the moment, with you losing your cool with them repeatedly isn't working, is it? It's upping the ante and making them and you stressed and miserable.

I know the phrase 'fake it til you make it ' is hackneyed, but presenting a calm and in control attitude even if you feel like screaming is honestly more effective. My grandmother never laid a hand on me in anger (I lived with her for part of my childhood) but I knew that the raised right index finger meant an unbreakable boundary was being approached. It takes lots of practice but I don't think there is an immediate fix for this anyway.

@NeverDropYourMooncup makes excellent points.

I would be angry and upset, I just wouldn’t lose it and take it out on my kids.
Yes, I’m a better person now than you are now, but I was not always and it took a lot of hard work to get here. You don’t seem to want to change.

Then give it to DD1. She'll want it then. Bait and switch.

And tie your hair up. Don't make yourself an easy target when you're vulnerable because you've got your back to her. The non hair puller goes behind you.

I'd also be thinking of deploying a water spray bottle for random grabbings. Non harmful, no risk of getting somebody reporting you to SS because 'Mummy pulls my hair and shouts at me' and clipping the claws/nails to reduce the opportunity for scratching. A towel purrito works on kids just as well as it does on cats as long as you keep your head to one side to avoid the head being flung back.