AIBU to feel uneasy about a teacher carrying in a distressed child

[Cityslickers]

I dropped my DD off at school on Tuesday and a slightly older child (but still infants age) was screaming about going into school. The teacher picked him up / manhandled him in, which made him more distressed and he was flailing his arms and legs about etc. His lunch, bottle and glasses were all on the floor. AIBU in thinking this isn’t normally done? I feel a bit upset still thinking about it.

It seems to be quite common with kids struggling going into school but it just felt uncomfortable to watch.

Parents drop at the gate, which was shut. It’s hard to describe but the gated area is within the yard (also gated).

Did you see him being dropped off by a parent first and what state was in, or did you just see the part where he was crying on the bench and she went to fetch him? The negotiation probably started the minute he got out of bed this morning and you just saw the tail end.

@Cityslickers but you have no idea of the background to this, you just have seen one aspect of it. That approach may have been agreed with the parents as the best approach, as perhaps negotiation and attempts to reassure in fact escalate the upset. You don't know.

It just seems like you think you know better than anyone else involved what they should be doing and that your opinion on that is important for others to know. I don't think that is the case.

Meanwhile there is another parent complaining their child’s class was left either unsupervised or with a TA as the teacher was dealing with a child who would not enter

Teachers can’t win

It may not be ideal but may have been necessary in the circumstances.

This. The child might have a very clear ECHP with guidelines about appropriate physical intervention.

If this isn’t your child, it’s not your business.

Definitely flag it up to the HT just in case its not an agreed approach with the parents.

It's not great. Likely in my experience it will be entirely counterproductive.

Do the adults drop the childrwn at the gate and then the children are expected to go straight in or do they play in the playground for a while? Either way, the teacher has 29 other young children waiting for her. It is far easier to calm a child inside with other adult support than in an outside area where parents/carers are dropping their children off and potentially judging...

My DD is in reception and I've seen this happen a couple of times at drop off, they get given a little bit of time and talk to calm down/reason with them, but if that fails they do pick them up and carry them in while talking nicely to them, even if they are kicking and screaming, it does look quite shocking to see, but the children seem to calm down once they are inside and they realise the parent isn't coming back for them.

I would hazard a guess that this has been discussed with individual parents who this applies to, and the fact the parent had left at that point seems to think it is all part of a process they are aware of, I personally wouldn't leave my daughter in that state, but I know I could calm her down in a reasonable time, but there are children in her class I know would not calm down at the door, it's either take them home or leave them there for the teachers to bring inside one way or another.

You could make enquiries with the teacher if you are really concerned, but IMO people are right, you do need to stay out of it.

Just because today there was no negotiation doesn't mean all year/term/month/week there hasn't. In our school for that to be the case, its likely a child who regularly refuses to go in and is on a staged plan of negotiation for a few days/weeks/however long then physical intervention after that.

You are seeing a snapshot of that child's school journey which can be upsetting when you aren't use to having a child who reacts that way.

Sometimes a child can be extremely anxious about going through the school gates but settle quickly once inside. It may be that they just felt it would be a better outcome to get them in there than get into a protracted discussion that wouldn't ultimately help the child. You don't know.

Depends how it's done, like a nursery teacher providing comfort with full backing of parents all good. Picked up and dragged along which this sounds like not acceptable at all. Although parent shouldn't leave them in this state either. And I say that as someone who has been late for work from sitting in a playground with a screaming 8 yr old clamped to me.

Physical contact of this nature is unacceptable in any circumstances. It's just going to traumatised the child who will start to understand that "might is right" and simply using your size is the best way to deal with any problem. I would not be comfortable with any teacher treating my child in this manner. Though it seems to be the accepted norm for both parent and child. If the child is so reluctant to be in school, that is what needs looking into. Not the way that one child is dealt with. What is making this child so anti the idea of school and what is the child's parenting like?
No I don't think you are being unreasonable, to a point that I would be looking to move my child to another school. The way you judge a school has to be by it's weakest link and I feel you have correctly identified that link. The only time I ever laid hands on a child such as to actually pick them up is if they were injured in some way.

My autistic ds had to be carried into nursery for the first couple of months, as he was too anxious to walk in with the other children.. He's fine now.
Apparently he would settle once there and play happily, it was just the act of separation, he would always tell me he had a good day in school.
I'd keep out of it, you don't know if this is a particular case.

Mind your own business.

If the teacher did this there will be a reason and a plan in place that is nothing to do with you.

Well perhaps the parent should keep their child at home whilst its being sorted out, or at least stay with them in the playground then. Because the alternatives are to leave the child to run out into the traffic, or to devote a staff member to spend hours with them coaxing, which are both unacceptable.

Or perhaps the parent has a job they need to keep, or knows that the problem is the transition and that drawing out only makes things worse and thinks the is the best solution for their family.

I can't see that the teacher did anything wrong here.

If they were rough or aggressive or intentionally hurt the child then by all means report away, but picking up a tantrumming child to move them is fairly normal. I imagine most of us have been there. Calling it physical contact or restrictive contact makes it sound like the child is being hit or held down on the floor.

It's not something a teacher should have to do but it's a fairly commonplace technique.

If you are still concerned about it, I would sent a quick email to the head to say what you saw and why it worried you. If it's part of the child's plan and the parents are aware and agree, then at least you'll know. If it's not and it shouldn't have happened, the school can manage that internally and make the changes.

As a governor, I'd rather you contact the school so we can do something about it if needs be than chat about it in the playground or on WhatsApp.

I can understand why it was concerning to witness.

When my son was in year 6 and they were going on a coach trip to another European country, one child was physically moved onto the bus by his mum and a teacher even though he was screaming and flailing around. He was a popular sporty boy who I'd not seen in that situation before. When the bus had gone his mum said "he'll be fine once they've got going and I don't want him to miss out but I get that it looked a lot", a photo was sent to the parents of all the children on the bus smiling and relaxed, including this particular boy smiling and sat by his best mate. He joined in with all the activities and adventures on the trip and had an excellent time. His parent was part of the decision making in advance of the trip that this would happen. The teacher who helped her get him on the bus was a very experienced, warm and lovely gentle woman who made sure that the boy was comfortable and calm for the journey.

When they came back from the trip I asked my son if this boy had been OK because it had looked a bit distressing and my son said "oh he gets like that sometimes, he just gets easily overwhelmed and anxious about leaving his mum but as soon as we got moving he was fine and we forgot about it, he was glad he came".

I know that was a much older child but just wanted to share as that one moment didn't feel great but it's what he needed to have the opportunity to go abroad and do the trip.

So the child was just dumped outside. Parent had left and kid was screaming and refusing to go in?
Honestly I don’t really see another alternative. The child couldn’t just be left outside. Physically carrying the child in to school seems the only way. Other than calling the parent to come back and fetch the child. But presumably if the parent was that bothered they would have stayed to make sure their child actually made it in to class.
Id stay out of it. There must be an arrangement if the parent had just dumped the kid and left

"I dropped my DD off at school on Tuesday and a slightly older child (but still infants age) was screaming about going into school. The teacher picked him up / manhandled him in,"

Yes, I should think so.

If the teacher was the only person available she might not have had much choice. As she needed to get to her class and couldn't leave him on his own. Negotiating might just prolong his distress and it could go on all day.

That’s not for you to say. You get to say what is the right approach for your child, no other child.

I had one who needed this approach. It was agreed and documented. There was an aide 6’3 and built like a brick outhouse whose job was to physically restrain my child into the classroom bear hug style, keep them restrained until they wore themselves out and then leave with the door locked behind them so my child didn’t bolt. Repeat after morning tea break and lunch. Eventually my child gave up and didn’t need this.

The reality is, this got my child in a classroom and learning by osmosis (not at a desk as they were curled up in the corner behind the door). After a while they migrated to under their desk and then after a year or so to the chair at their desk. If we didn’t have this option, my child would have been out of school, with a shit future, and likely a life on benefits. By doing this to get them into a classroom, they ended up in a highly competitive, sought after degree and very good professional job.

So, I’m really glad you didn’t don’t get a say in how my child was managed.

ETA - there would have been zero point negotiating with my child. You would have been stuck in the same negotiation come home time with no progress, utterly pointless.

I'd report if in a gentle non-confrontational manner. If it was OK and proper then the school would be able to dismiss the observation and shouldn't think badly of the person reporting it.

Why not speak to the parent about it if you know so much about their child?

It sounds like a teacher dealing with a tantrum. Nothing more.