Anyone else in the South East worried about Andy Burnham bringing in a land tax?

[Beachbooks]

With it looking likely that Andy Burnhan will be the next PM, I was interested to see if anyone else in London / the south east were worried about potential tax raises specifically around the land tax rather than stamp duty ?

A lot of my friends who live locally are worrying that he will make the land tax for the South East so high in proportion to other areas of the UK that it will be financially very difficult to afford but then also extremely difficult to sell!!

BTW we have very standard house and garden but we live in an expensive area

We absolutely need investment, I haven’t said otherwise. But we cannot talk about the economy without looking at welfare costs & that means looking at what is spent on pensioners. Why do you think growth is so easy to achieve and yet it’s eluded us since the crash regardless of who was in power?

Oh, this answer is very simple. Part of it was Brexit self harm. Another part was both parties enabling welfare state and I don't mean pensioners. Our pensions are still very low vs other European countries and our retirement age is higher than a lot of Europe.
We allowed a quarter of working age population to be economically inactive, means they don't contribute but consume. To fund it we created a culture where success is seen as undeserved privilege and has to be taxed to redistribute to idle ones.

Look at a couple of parallel threads - government has to sponsor air conditioning. You couldn't make it up.

Do you know that Musk was here, in the UK, to learn about space technologies before he set up StarLinkX? we have exceptional research capabilities, but we can't monetise them. In the last year along hundreds of businesses worth of £100m were bought by foreign investors - you can't tax them. We need to attract and incentivize those who can grow economy, not try to bleed them dry. London productivity is significantly higher than the rest of the country, it's the only net tax contributing region, why to hurt it yet again?

great, so there will be IHT on this. But why to move goalposts now?

Its hardly their fault that a policy that exists today didn’t exist when they bought

None of us has a crystal ball and no one hands over 115 times the bill they are set by the Govn as a just in case it might seem unfair in the future

Meanwhile
Your parents alternate revised yearly bill for council tax services will be £8000
I would imagine not many in the area could afford that. Laying waste to good housing, schools and local communities

It’s going to trigger a huge property price crash 😩

@BrownTroutBluesAgainyou understand I was simply correcting the comment @nearlylovemyusernamemade about them having a huge stamp duty bill?

Completely agree. We really need to switch from hammer people more mindset to incentivise. There must be posters with young adult dc. We need to think about them having the option of working and living in a thriving capital. Not just clamping on anything that has potential to earn and taxing to the hilt.

And if she doesn’t want to pay 8k a year she can sell up which she planning regardless as it’s far too big for her. Not many can afford that mortgage & stamp duty now hence why hardly any families live there anymore just people who bought decades ago.

@nearlylovemyusernameso what would you actually change?

One big difference between our pension & other European ones is that there isn’t the culture of private pensions & what you pay in determines what you get out unlike here which is a flat rate. Plus employers & employees pay more in social security taxes so you cannot compare them.

A lot of young people with high potential I know (friends kids, DCs kids) are actively considering leaving UK. We have a temp relief with Trump and US not being attractive at the moment, they'd be gone by now, but they are switching to EU instead.

It's this loss which is absolutely tragic.

Struggling with the logic here. So many questions...

Yesterday you said:

"That wealth never existed in the first place... We don't all get more wealthy sitting around while house prices increase."

and

"Many of the older people who have held houses for a long time have seen significant house price inflation... I don't think it is harsh to negate a portion of that."

Now you've doubled down with:

"The richest few pay more. They still will have gained huge amounts in housing equity over the years..."

So which is it?

If that wealth never existed, why is that same increase in value now the justification for a higher recurring tax?

And if housing equity is wealth, why should unrealised wealth be taxed every year before it's ever been realised? We generally tax income when it's received and gains when they're realised.? Even if the government really believes part of that "unfair" gain should be captured, when the gain is actually realised is the most logical point. Not whilst it's purely an unrealised paper valuation.

If the "wealth never existed", what exactly are you advocating should be taxed?
Government policy has contributed to decades of house price inflation and housing shortages, not older homeowners. Making current homeowners pay more based on paper valuations of "wealth" won't make homes more affordable. Building more homes will.

The irony is that the so-called "idle" family home is already expected to help fund residential care and, in many cases, those paying for their own care cross-subsidise people whose care is state funded. If you steadily tax away the equity people rely on to fund their own care, you increase the likelihood that those costs will ultimately fall back on taxpayers.

It’s not just this person who would pay £8k a year. That would block out a vast number of younger people already struggling with mortgage, childcare, student debt or other.

Yes !
and masses of negative equity making the mortgaged incredibly vulnerable

Apologies 🙏
but what you said in terms of using the info for stat purposes is interesting
Re the effects it will have on established communities

There must be posters with young adult dc. We need to think about them having the option of working and living in a thriving capital. Not just clamping on anything that has potential to earn and taxing to the hilt.

There is little future here for young people. We already have more over 65s than under 25s, you can’t support the pensions & NHS on those demographics. It’s similar for much of the West but you will see more countries incentivising to attract the young eg Portugal. All you can do is educate your dc as much as possible. I fully expect mine to move abroad.

It is tragic. London thrives on young people and it should be open to more of our dc not fewer. Forcing them out via ruinous taxes on top of everything else is so shortsighted.

Exactly
Now those communitees will have to sell up
and hardly any will be able to afford living there

The very real reality is large swathes of residential areas will be laid to waste
We all know landlords will offset the cost to tenants, we can’t rely on them buying either

Plus where exactly do these 655,000 households across the country move to ?
I see a massive house price increase on everything under £500,000.

And round and round we go

There are very few legitimate situations where someone should have to sell their home to fund public spending.

Expecting people to sell their home to self fund for their own residential care etc, is one thing. Those costs are directly linked to your own care and support. But forcing people sell in order to contribute more simply because the paper value of their home has increased, in order to fund general public spending, is quite frankly uncivilised and unacceptable.

Yes totally agree

@EasternStandardbut young people have already been pushed out of London.

London is the only major UK city that is ageing, the rest are getting younger.

I think nearly 100 schools have already closed.

I’ve seen it myself having grown up there and having dc there.

So why do you want to make it even harder for them?

@NorthXNorthWestbut care in the home also costs & house value isn’t included in that.

It doesn’t justify making it even harder or nigh on impossible

We should be looking at how to tackle that issue, not supporting a policy that makes it worse

@EasternStandard I don’t believe the proposal should only apply to London but as I have said many times an annual tax is more preferable to me than stamp duty.

Yes but totally unfair to those who are moving in 2026 and paying SD already

@BrownTroutBluesAgainI think the people who buy in London now/who can afford to raise dc here are already fairly privileged. For that group I don’t believe this tax is especially prohibitive.