Welfarisation has made people utterly entitled and unable to take responsibility for themselves and their families.

[hagchic]

I grew up in a working class family. The values I was taught were that you stood on your own two feet and it was no one else's job to do what you could do for yourself.

If you were hurt, you were expected to get up and go and clean yourself up - and stop whining about it unless it was actually serious. If you were ill, you went to bed and if you were lucky some magic lucozade appeared.

If you were sad, then you were sad. If life was unfair then that was just how life was and you needed to deal with it.

You never ever sought charity or took benefits when you were able to work or put up with less. You lived to your own means, not to what you saw on TV or at school - and if you wanted that lifestyle it was up to you to get it.

Today everyone has the expectation that someone must help them, that they are obliged to help them - even before they have made any attempt to actually do the work of helping themselves. They expect luxuries like holidays, pets, new clothes and treats when they do nothing to earn this.

I think self sufficiency is a value that needs to return to our society.

I certainly remember home visits as a child in the 70s when I had tonsillitis or an ear infection. A godsend for my parents I imagine when the alternative was taking an ill child on a 45 minute bus ride (and the bus being full of people smoking).

Anyone who thinks that reducing the circumstances of the most vulnerable in society to pay for defence is deluding themselves if they think that there aren’t a range of more humane options.

People pretending to have "anxiety" are not the most vulnerable in society.

I’ll tell my sons autism, vision problems, mobility problems, mental health issues to do one then shall I? I too came from a working class family where your op came from, the same values but guess what we evolved with the world and realise that not everything is black and white, I’ve worked since 14, DP since 13, I still work now but can only work part time because I’m a carer for DS, DP still works 14 hour days. By your standards I should just kick him off too work and he’ll just have to manage…

And yet again this is trotted out. Disability benefits are not awarded for simple anxiety and depression. You need NHS secondary care, consultant led, mental health team involvement as a minimum to even stand a chance, and then the bar is set very high for stand alone mental health claims. A few pills from your GP simply doesn’t cut it, no matter how much you buy into the government narrative that it does.

@Kickinthenostalgia. Don’t upset yourself. This is just rage bait. Friday night, nothing better to do than benefit bash shite from people who know little to nothing about disability or caring. So many of these surfacing lately- and under so many different guises, but hopefully some of us see them for what they are 👀

Is a ‘bond market crisis’ the new bogeyman? It seems to be a phrase that is repeated a lot by doomsayers on the right. Has a memo been sent out that this is the new talking point? I suspect the majority parroting it wouldn’t recognise an inverted yield curve if it turned up in their Cheerios.

I can only agree OP.

Totally agree OP.
I also feel that people would feel much happier/fulfilled if they did take responsibility for their life choices.
Clearly I am not aiming that at genuinely ill / disabled people but at the many who are not.

Clearly I am not aiming that at genuinely ill / disabled people but at the many who are not.

Sadly I don’t think the OP is making any such distinction.

It’s a tough one, dependence creates entitlement. It’s a catch 22. One that often makes it easier to be unemployed if you are a low skilled worker, it’s more financially rewarding to be unemployed but obviously not for society or your mental health.
I noticed a few social media influencer who can’t work due to ADHD and other mental health conditions, one who can’t sleep at night so only falls asleep at 6/7am until the evening, madness. If you were up at 7am you’d sleep by a reasonable hour and feel better all round.
The answer would be apprenticeship roles, government subsidies towards training to stop people earning a low wage.

A third of the population lived in council housing in the 70s though. It might not have been seen as a benefit back then but it was heavily subsidised housing for those who couldn't afford a property at market rates. Is it really that different to those getting housing benefit today because there aren't any council houses? And are the numbers that different?

And uptake for child benefit during that time was consistently above 98% from what I've read. People will argue it's not a benefit because many of those claiming were working but that's exactly the same situation as today. I always think of this when people claim that it was considered shameful to claim benefits back then - it clearly wasn't!

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/gilt-yields-climb-burnham-election-075159832.html

10 Year Yield above 5 is problematic, it is really that simple.

30 hours min wage would stop a lot of "perks" from UC anyway

thats the other side of the coin, publics education on the stock market

many people it seems would bring back the old asylums based on some comments on this thread

Was it really a third of the entire country? One third?

I remember a lot of council estates back in the day, including where my mum's sister and her family lived but I had no idea it was that much.

I've been living here for 15 years and, coming from another country, I was always intrigued by the amount and variety of benefits paid here and also to so many people. I didn't understand the concept of UC and why so many people need top-ups to their rent, etc. Myself I've always been lucky not to claim anything. So I've done some research and it looks like problems are very deep and structural and it would be very difficult to change anything, especially when there is no political will. For example, in my country everybody can just buy a plot of land and build a house on it and here it's close to impossible. Then I read that the politicians don't want to make things easier because the older voters own a lot of property and always go to vote.
Then I discovered, thanks also to many threads here, that actually you can check online how many hours to work so that you don't lose this or that benefit. I actually thought it's crazy - so many people just chose to work under this and that numbers of hours not to lose out. Crazy, crazy system.
Then when I had a baby and when my child later broke his arm and we went to A&E I was amazed by the number of staff employed or just running around, as in my own country our hospitals look pretty empty and very efficient. I was a surprised that in general it took around 8 staff members to see and assess my kid's arm including 4 staff to do his cast. In my home country this would be 3 people total from start to finish.
It does look like though this small island has too many people now and services are crumbling down. The future looks bleak if the trajectory doesn't change.

Council houses were amazing and are some of the best built houses around.

I grew up in a rural area and my kids are always surprised when I point out the old council housing stock (long since sold to private owners of course) because they are such nice houses.

Such a shame that we don't provide housing like that now
In my London Borough the council is building lots of new flats and closing shopping centres etc to do so but hardly any of this are for social housing.
Instead they let people rent at extortionate rates from private landlords and subsidise, or flat out pay, their rent through housing benefit.
It hardly makes sense.

I totally agree OP. I'm in my 60s. Benefit claimants were 'on the dole' (or dolites as my dad would say). Most people considered it shameful to be on the dole, although even in those days there were a few of the bad back brigade.
Welfare should be a safety net for people genuinely in need.
The Motability car system definitely needs to be ended, it's an absolute joke, use your benefit money to buy a decent roadworthy car a few years old and maintain it yourself.
And yes, I personally know of 3 families with made up ailments (mental health) who get the lot - large amounts of money in benefits, a car etc and live as good a life as a family on £70,000 a year.
I also know a lady who received a one-off payment to buy household items (white goods I think) and spent the lot on a pedigree spaniel which she has never trained and which never gets walked.
So yes, I agree with the OP.

"Dolites"?
Ah, yes, the good old days when people were shamed for falling on hard times.
Lovely.

This thread should instead be titled:

”Rampant end stage capitalism has prioritised making money for shareholders over paying decent wages meaning that full time workers are being forced to claim benefits”

we have a low waged economy meaning that the VAST majority of benefits goes to working people (and pensioners)

Ah yes, you know a tiny amount of people taking the piss, so everyone on benefits is?

I know a few people who have cars on the Motabilty scheme, and if they did not have that, then they would not to be able to get to work.

We have had "welfarisation" and "dolites". Any more?

Are you serious?