To want to move back to england with my 5 children

[tryingtogohome]

Hi sorry if this is all over the place

I live in Poland with my partner who is Polish and we have 5 boys 15 11 5 3 and 10 months and im pregnant again 25 weeks

I keep thinking about leaving him and going back to England but then i think im being stupid because ive been here so long and dont even know where id start anymore.

I dont really have anybody. No family. I grew up in care and havent spoken to anyone from my past for years and years.

Things have got worse between me and my partner. Hes always saying what a real man should be and boys shouldnt cry and things like that. My 15 year old argues with him constanly (constantly) now and the whole house feels tense all the time.

This is going to sound silly but i keep feeling like this baby is a girl and every time i say it he gets annoyed. Not shouting just annoyed and says he doesnt want a daughter and what would he do with a girl and says hopefully im wrong. Maybe im overreacting but it upsets me more than it should.

I dont know if its hormones.

I keep looking at Doncaster and Rotherham and Sheffield on my phone when everyone is asleep and then crying because i dont even know if my children could go to school there after living here all this time or where we would live.

I know people will say leave if youre unhappy but it isnt that easy when youve got this many children and no money and nowhere to go.

Am i being unreasonable wanting to go back to England or does this sound completly mad after 11 years away

I do speak Polish, not perfectly but enough for day to day things and appointments and schools etc. I didnt when i first came here but i do now.

I dont really have any friends though. I had a couple years ago but not anymore. Everyone sort of drifted away and i dont really go anywhere without the children now.
All of the children are his. They were all born in England apart from the baby who is 10 months. He came early at 31 weeks and was in hospital for a while and thats part of whats panicing me this time because im pregnant again and keep worrying the same thing will happen.

I dont know about passports off the top of my head because my head is all over the place today. The older boys definitely have British passports. I think the younger ones do as well but I'd have to check.

Something happened yesterday that i cant stop thinking about. I went out with the baby and when i got back my partner had shaved my 3 year olds hair off. He had lovely little curls and now half his head is basically shaved. He said it was only hair and he was messing about but my little boy was crying and didnt want anyone looking at him.

Maybe that sounds stupid compared to bigger problems but it really upset me. Hes only 3.

All of this. There's something a bit insidious in the assumption that the DC must be brought to England asap as if it's obviously better than Poland even though to all intents and purposes all these kids are Polish. The examples of the DP's comments and attitude plays into this, like it's some unenlightened place and the DC need to be removed to the UK where no one sexist ever calls anyone gay. I'm not condoning what the DP says but the focus on it feels honed to provoke people to say 'omg leave that bad country immediately' which is as racist as the DP is sexist. If this was a relationship breakdown here, no one would be advising the mum to take her kids out of the country, and if a dad tried to, they'd be calling the police.

I’m so sorry, you are making sense. My exh was homophobic, sexist and racist towards some minorities. He used to say to say things to my kids, which I didn’t like as I didn’t want them to grow up with his views. My son at first internalised his views, I had to unpick all these with my son, as i didn’t want him to grow up with these twisted views. So I do understand where you’re coming from. Can you seek legal advice in Poland? Can you also reach out to old friends in England for support? Also if you can try and keep a secret fund, to support you and the children if you do leave. Also is there an equivalent of a polish women’s aid? I’m not sure how the system is set up but if you can look for social housing and benefits in Poland xx

How have you afforded the private care for all these deliveries where you briefly stayed in the UK? Because you would not have been eligible for NHS care.

Your husband has taken you to Poland, where it's been easy to isolate you. It may be where you have grown up in care, you are perhaps vulnerable too. You have no family or friends to speak of in the UK, so no support system to turn to either. Individually, these things probably aren't that significant but together, it paints a picture of a man, who wants to control you, he wants you dependant on him (hence why he's not keen on you working) and by you keep having babies, it keeps you trapped and tied to him. He knows he can treat you as he wishes, because he knows you have no where to go, and no support system. In essence, he's a nasty, abusive bully.

You can't simply leave the country. Your children's primary residence is in Poland, and one child is Polish born. You would need to seek proper legal advice regarding this, otherwise you could be in an even more dreadful situation.

You may need to find out, what help there is for you in Poland, and separate. You would sadly, have no choice but to stay in Poland, because there's no way your partner is going to agree to you and the children moving back to the UK.

Once the baby is born, sort out proper contraception. Stop having babies with this man.

I considered moving away from my emotionally abusive partner when we separated with two infant children. Now they are older teens, I'm glad I stayed and allowed a relationship between them. It wasn't up to me to choose for them if they got to grow up knowing their father.

She’s unlikely to be able to bring her children. They are all polish citizens. We are not in the EU.

My local hospital maternity department (and other departments must do too) sees people from various countries, but in maternity it is mostly Poland, doing this all the time. They just take a UK address and care for all comers.

I despair of the NHS as it is run now, a major overhaul if the system is well overdue.

I think you are stuck where you are really. You can't bring the children to the UK without his consent.

I was being charitable and assuming that the OP had not defrauded the NHS. But sadly some do. And yes, it should be tightened up on: I've worked at some big city hospitals where it was common enough that they had a department to deal with it, but at small hospitals no one may know how to.

Yes, you are absolutely right. They are dual citizens, I emphasised the Polish side as the authorities are more likely to work harder on their return as they are not just residents with British nationality.

Going back to your problems OP, I think you should play the long game and plan to leave your partner in a way that won’t risk you losing the children. You should work towards leaving the relationship but staying in Poland for the time being.

What is your legal status in Poland? Are you entitled to Polish citizenship?
Having it will make your position stronger when you leave your partner. Try to work towards some financial independence.
There are certain benefits such as 500+ , which you might not be entitled to if you are not a citizen and are not working. Think about getting a job at some stage so work on improving your Polish. There are free childcare options including nurseries.

OP. You could email Women's Aid in the UK and they might have some ideas of where you could get help and legal advice in Poland.

Also.. found this online
Women's Rights Center Foundation (Centrum Praw Kobiet): Operates a 24/7 nationwide hotline at 800 107 777.

It's a starting point at least.

Also. Would your DH relatives in the UK be supportive?

I left an abusive marriage in Europe, came back uk with my 2 ds, unfortunately he accused me of child abduction, cost 10k in legal fees to get residency order. We live here happily now.
My advice is get reports , police etc of abuse, thenyoucanclaim legal aid.
Without evidence of.d. v, you'll be liable for legal fees, as I was.
Good luck ! So much better here for the kids.

Why is the UK so much better?

OP hasn't mentioned domestic violence, what would she be reporting to police?

It happens in Ireland a lot too, due to some sort of shitty EU loophole, they’re entitled to claim child benefit from Ireland while living in Poland after the birth to 18.
The child benefit is high at €140 a month, a hefty bill for the tax payers.
I believe that you have to pay for an epidural in Poland, well it was years ago.

Get him to agree to move back over here, once settled tell him you want to seperate.
x

Would you be entitled to benefits in Poland?

contact women’s aid @tryingtogohome

wishing you the very very best of luck. Don’t stay with him. You’d be fine on your own and your children would certainly thank you for it by the sounds of it xxxx

If you had evidence of domestic abuse, I very much doubt that your children would be ordered to be returned to Poland.
Youd have to have serious reason to insist children are kept in Poland when the mother (in this case is primary caregiver) and wants to leave due to abuse. I think there would be almost no discussion on it and if you had evidence of his bad behaviour no one would stop you doing anything. Perfectly reasonable.

Get legal advice both in Poland and UK from women’s aid , assemble a plan xox

Why would her children thank her for dragging them from their home country, school, father and friends to live on benefits in the uk

Omg i am so sorry @tryingtogohome . I am polish and i am so shocked and ashamed.

do you get 800 pln benefit for each child?
does he control the finances?
i am assuming you are not married?
do you think he is dangerous?

Poland is much much better country for a family than UK nowadays so I would look into staying at the moment. Breaking up, moving countries (even if you manage to get it done legally) at the same time will be unbelievably hard for you and the kids.

do you have mortgage together or do you rent?

Come home ♥️

Don't just take the kids without getting proper legal advice - it doesn't matter if they are UK citizens or not they are residents of Poland and if your husband complains at you staying then you could ultimately lose custody.

I had a friend in this situation - USA/Sweden - her marriage was breaking up she went home to the USA for her sister's wedding and considered staying with her son. But she talked to a lawyer friend who advised her of the dangers (just as when a man takes their kids to their home country on holiday and refuses to return). In the end it worked out for her and he gave his permission (for a lot of concessions) and the custody orders were approved by the courts in both countries.

But it's a huge risk that your children could be sent back to Poland. There was an infamous case where a mother fled her marriage in South Africa back to her home country in Sweden with her children 2 boys aged 15 and 12 and a girl of 7. The father reported it as parental abduction to the police in South Africa and won. The boys were deemed old enough to have an input and chose to stay with their mother but the 7 year old girl was (forcibly) returned to the father in South Africa.

I’d be tempted to make the arrangements for you all to travel back to the Uk for the birth of your baby. I’d be wanting to come as early as possible to avoid the worry of the baby being born prematurely in Poland. If your partner can’t travel for all of that time then all the better as it would give you some breathing room. Perhaps leverage both the risk of the premature birth and wanting to help out your elderly MIL.

Then once your here seek legal advise on ways of safely leaving him and remaining with the children in the Uk. Perhaps plant the seed early on with your in-laws about how much you miss them (even if not true) and how much benefit it would be for everyone if you were nearer. If need be then refuse to go home after the birth.

but whatever you do do not leave him to come here without his permission. That will get you into a lot of trouble.

Another person suggesting she commits a criminal offence and risks three years in prison and losing access to her children.

I don’t understand how she’s able to use the NHS to give birth. Do they not check eligibility?