American Influencers who terminated for T21.

[ScaredButUnavoidable]

Has everyone else seen all the hatred online for the social media influencers who have decided to terminate a pregnancy due to a diagnosis of T21?

I have no idea who the couple are but today my social media feed is full of really abhorrent articles, videos and posts aimed at them (and about termination in general) and I’m just horrified.

Unsurprisingly they are in America, but even so.

I’m assuming the couple have been streaming videos about the pregnancy since the start and this announcement seems to have sparked absolute outrage.

Ok, the Influencers must have realised that some people would be upset by their decision, but at the same time, those same people must understand that although couples choose to have terminations based on medical conditions it’s still usually a very difficult and upsetting decision for them to make.

Has anyone else seen it?
I’m deleting as much of it as I can from my timeline but it’s constant.
They are even getting death threats.

It’s like a witch-hunt, it’s disgusting 😢

I think this is an element that is frequently overlooked.

As part of this online hate campaign there are so many people posting videos of their eldest child (say 4 years of age) playing with and cuddling the younger sibling who has DS with quotes along the lines of how much happiness and joy the infant with DS brings to the family and how loved they are by thrir big brother/sister etc. I don’t doubt that’s true in that moment of time, but fast forward 5, 10, 20, 30 years etc and I’m sure the family dynamic is very different then, especially the sibling relationship.

Siblings of dependent adults with complex needs will typically fall into the role of carer, and be expected to take on that role, especially as the parents age and can no longer cope with the demands of the child with the disabilities. Nobody seems to want to think about the long-term implications on the siblings when it comes to
having children with disabilities, they are so often overlooked or not taken into consideration.

Many parents say, “We have made it clear that we will never expect our other child to take on caring responsibilities….” but realistically, it always happens, and I imagine a lot of it happens because the healthy siblings feels duty bound to do it (obviously this isn’t the case for all families). I imagine a lot of guilt is felt by the healthy siblings if they don’t take over the care when the parents age they are basically forced into situations where they have to sacrifice their own lives and freedoms to care for a disabled sibling they didn’t ask for. I know that sounds awful but I imagine it’s how a lot of people feel.

As another poster said, when thinking about bringing a disabled child into the world the parents need to seriously consider the implications of their decision long-term, not just whether they could cope with a disabled baby/child as it’s so much more complicated than that.

I watched her documentary too, and I also felt it was easy for her to make her claims when she comes from a wealthy background and probably has absolutely no idea how ‘normal’ people struggle to cope when they have a disabled child and what battles they have to fight for even the most basic level of support.

I know an elderly lady who has a severely autistic son who is now in his late thirties. It looks so hard. I imagine it is similar to DS. He is in care for most of the week. If you can be forewarned of this level of disability I think that is good. I am sure the lady I talk of would probably have chosen an abortion if she could have.

There is no law that states a sibling must take over the care of a disabled child/adult when their parents are unable to do so, There are services in place in this country to take responsibility for seriously disabled people. I’m afraid I don’t know the American system but in the UK if you don’t feel you can care for a sibling then you don’t have to.

This.

my sd learned at pre school age how to sit with the belongings and not move while everyone else rushed off to sort her severely autistic brother, who’d run off again.

she grew up with her brothers needs first and foremost. She’d be late for school. Hobbies, they didn’t want her to do them so db would be the excuse.

she lived at home until her late 20’s because she was guilt tripped into staying. Fortunately she met a man from another country 7 hours flight away and moved there. That actually contributed to breaking the whole family apart, for long and complicated reasons, including an inheritance they were never entitled to. Once you don’t have additional live in carers, you need money to pay for respite.

It’s social pressure that makes people take on siblings and the fear they will be mistreated/unloved in care.

I know someone who is very religious and wants to take on her sister with DS. She is also autistic and has a multitude of health issues. She cannot be left alone and can rarely go out. Her parents are mostly housebound, but she can’t see what a negative effect it will have on her children.

No there is no law. There’s no law children must care for elderly parents. There’s no law anyone has to care for another adult person.

but we do it. Because there’s no one else. Because we’re expected to. Because there isn’t the money to pay for help.

obligation, societal judgement, not wanting to see a relative dumped in the care system- there are lots of unpaid carers in the UK. None are forced to, but that doesn’t mean they can just..not do it.

This is what confuses me.

Women get abortions all the time - what's the difference between an abortion at 14 weeks for DS, vs any other reason? And yet as soon as a woman says she had an abortion for DS, suddenly it's terrible, unacceptable, and hurtful to people with DS or their parents.

It's very strange.

That’s exactly what it means there are choices there they may not be great choices but they exist.

America is pretty much Gilead. I'm actually impressed they've been able to access a termination. But then disabled people are valued less than women so I guess that does make sense.

Anywhoo, it's obvious they would get this backlash. If they wanted to avoid it they could have lied and said they lost the baby, so they've obviously chosen to accept the backlash.

Of course it isn’t the law that they have to.

But people do it because they feel obligated to do it, the societal pressure they feel and receive, the fear of judgement if they don’t, a sense of expectation, to avoid feelings of guilt if their sibling ends up in a crappy care institution etc.

Being a carer for a disabled sibling is usually a role they find themselves in despite not wanting it bit because there’s no other realistic option.

It’s not as black and white as just “choosing not to do it”.

With Down’s syndrome I think it’s got the image of a happy child, living life without a care in the world, bringing joy to everyone…

people romanticise the perpetual childhood aspect of it.

in reality it can be as brutal as any other severe disability. On the child physically and mentally, as well as on the carers. This part they don’t show.

in the us there seems to be a cult of caring for a severely disabled child and advocating for medical intervention to keep them alive as long as possible, regardless of the child’s quality of life or suffering. There’s a fair few accounts on social media, with a lot of “god is good” and invoking Jesus that the child survived the last near death resuscitation.

Christianity in the states currently has a lot to answer for.

I suppose they see it as saying a person with DS isn’t worthy of life.

The problem though is that DS is such a spectrum…..and that’s there rhe problem lies. It’s such a huge risk. You may have a child who is minimally affected and can live a relatively normal and independent life, whereas the other end of the spectrum is a completely different story. Some people are happy to take that risk and others aren't, which is ok.

I imagine it’s usually the parents of those who aren’t significantly affected by their DS (i.e those who are able to live independently within society) that take the most offence to terminations for T21. They see their own teenager/adult with DS living normally and functioning in society without any extreme health or behavioural problems, and they can’t understand that for other families with severely affected DS children (and adults) it is a very different scenario.

It’s also not as black and white as letting go completely and having no input whatsoever or doing all the care yourself and receiving no help at all. When people go into care homes families can still visit take their family member for trips holidays medical appointments etc.

I can understand that but it's so hypocritical, really, if one is otherwise okay with abortion. For instance, I'm not offended by people having abortions, and I don't think that means they think children aren't worthy of life; I just understand it means that they didn't want to have a child/continue the pregnancy.

And the faux naivety around 'why would someone have a problem with a DS child?' is grating too, given that I'm sure no loving parents would actively choose for their child to have DS, or be disappointed that they didn't have DS.

I suppose the train of thought is that the couple did want a baby….. UNTIL they realised it had DS, and then they didn’t want that specific baby.

Whereas earlier abortions are generally done because the woman/couple didnt want a baby full stop (i.e it was never for reasons related to the ‘quality’ of the baby).

I think terminating for DS is a completely valid choice but I also understand why others may disagree with it (not that it justifies in any way how the social media influencers are being treated).

I was hoping the nastiness might have calmed down a bit today on my social media feed but if anything it’s ramped up even more ☹️

I remember reading about a mum of a boy with DS campaigning to get rid of the test because she felt pressured to abort. Okay let's just take the choice away for other women. 🙄

I have only seen a little on this but the criticism I have seen is not related to the termination but some of the ignorant comments they made around people with DS and their health conditions etc. I think most people (even people with children that have DS) can understand the termination but their comments around recovering and having a better outcome next time were crass in my opinion.

This is such a brilliant post. It's beautifully summarises everything that is wrong with the pro life brigade and people who fetishise disability as a beautiful thing that makes someone special and call preventing their suffering a sin, disgusting and proof that people see the disabled as less than human and not worthy of life.

Of course disabled people are worthy of life, no one in their right mind would murder a disabled person because they think they are sub human. And nobody believes disabled people are worth less than able people. But most people who have any empathy for human suffering, given the chance to prevent that suffering happening in the first place, by preventing the life from happening in the first place, would in a heartbeat. It is an act of mercy. Only a sick God would demand suffering for his own pleasure but the nutty Christians can't see or accept that so they prolong horrific suffering for a s long as possible and get a perverse sense of righteousness out of it. Now THAT is disgusting.

Many claim to have had amnios but I haven't had to verify as this isn't something I've ever had to deal with. I hope they are liars or wrong though, because I can't imagine how it would feel to make that choice then find out it was wrong.

Actually, I believe some states in the US do have filial responsibility laws.

My child was in their teens before any kind of disability showed up. Anyone who doesn't recognise the gamble in having a child as far as this sort of thing should probably not have one at all.

I am parenting a disabled adult. They're an amazing person who has opened my world in so many ways and they have said they enjoy their life.

Fair enough! But as I said, I doubt any loving parent would actively choose for their child to have DS, or be disappointed that they didn't have it.

So it seems deliberately obtuse to act as though people shouldn't be hoping for a healthy, 'standard-issue' baby, and don't consider that the best outcome.

I'm sorry your parents put that on you. I think some parents just don't exercise awareness when it comes to their other children. I have made sure mine is provided for after our deaths and told my children they have to be free to live their lives.