Can we talk about NEETs?

[MrsBennetsPoorNervesAreBack]

Sorry if there's a thread already and I've missed it. But I want to talk about NEETs.

Apparently, we are potentially going to have 1.25million young people not in employment, education or training by the early 2030s. This is quite an alarming number, and it feels like we're failing an entire generation - both the NEETs themselves, who don't seem to have very much going on in their lives that might give them a sense of satisfaction or achievement, but also their working peers who will presumably end up having to support them via the tax system.

I really don't want this to be a thread with lots of judgement or criticism of these young people - it seems to me that we must have failed them somehow as a society. I also want to steer clear of party politics if we can. But I really want to understand why we have so many young people in this position right now.

Does anyone have a child in this situation who would be willing to share why they find themselves in this position? What are the barriers to them studying or getting at least a part time job? Are they happy with how things are right now? Are they trying to change their situation? What do they actually do all day? Are they surrounded by friends who are in the same position? What do they do about money? And what do you feel about the whole situation as a parent?

If anyone is willing to share, I really hope we can avoid a pile-on in which the young people and/or their parents are subjected to a character assassination. I would like an honest and frank exchange of views and experiences because I do genuinely want to understand the root causes of this issue, but if it descends into blame and fingerpointing, then the whole conversation will get derailed.

For full disclosure, I do have a dc in the middle of the 16-24 age group, but neither she nor any of her friends fall into this category.

I'm working and would love to retire soon, but have to work until 68 to get my state pension. So on the one hand we are extending the age that older people have to work, but then surprised that there are fewer jobs for younger people.

Why would employers be hiring non-Eu migrants over UK nationals?

I'm sure it's been said but IMVHO the older end of the 16-24 age group were the first kids to get and use smart phones intensively during childhood, including in school. They were also the age group whose mid and late teenage developmental years were affected by Covid, the general experience of that as well as the lockdowns, restrictions and general reduced social/occupational activity in that age group.
Clearly the smart phone issue is going to be addressed for those currently under 16, but there needs to be help to alleviate the harm caused to young adults who were afforded no protection.
Clearly a proportion of this age group (higher than historically would be expected) have been harmed by a combination of factors and now need help that extends beyond being looked after by their parents at home.

We've had great success with jobs fairs, rather than sending off endless applications. For various reasons, my 19yr has no qualifications. He's personable, well spoken ,has a lot of soft skills and had a good CV for his age thru starting some little business ventures. It didn't help that he had to go to college, rather than go straight into work as he had to keep retaking his Maths and English....and still doesn't have them. It was demoralising and I think a lot of kids are in a similar boat. Face to face with employers in a room at a jobs fair, he was offered four interviews, the first one offered him a salaried job of 28k just over a year ago where he's been since. He has just been interviewed and been offered a job at another place with much better hours, slightly better pay and more progression. Highly recommend the jobs fairs!

Having to have a C in maths at GCSE is very unhelpful. Lots of jobs don't require that level of mathematical ability. It must be hugely frustrating to having to keep repeating something you find difficult and is ultimately pointless.

I’ve got a dc at uni.
My dd managed to get a pt fast food job in sixth form. She had a reference from her volunteer role (she did that age 14-18) and I think being 16 (cheap) helped. If she’d waited until 18 she would have been competing with kids like her with 2 years experience. Being local helped she could walk home - she said lady interviewing her circled that. Anecdotally those of her peers who got degree apprenticeships all worked pt, the employers wanted to see they could juggle work and study. Some parents funded lifeguarding or referee courses and their dc managed to get work.
For summer she’s off to Camp America again. They can work for them from 18. There’s a Canada version if USA doesn’t appeal. She got that role due to volunteer work.

"It would be better for parents to give their teens some basic marketable skills. Mine has lifeguard and cpr certificates."

Do you understand the privilege you've had? Your child has a lifeguard certificate, which means he has had the opportunity and ability to develop strong swimming skills, the confidence, presumably, to intervene in situations where people are acting unsafely, the ability to work with a degree of independence. Many, many children only get their statutory National Curriculum swimming lessons. Many parents are not in a position to pay for lessons, or lifeguard training. Many young people are not physically capable of being a lifeguard.

I always find with these threads that people can't understand that while there will be young people who don't want to take a job they consider beneath them, or work hard, there are many young people who really can't 'man up' and just get a job.

DD2 (18) is petrified of the future. She longs to be a veterinary nurse. She's amazing with animals. But she can't cope with people. Her latest school has worked tirelessly with her, but she still burns out regularly, and she still finds the transition back into school after a break really challenging. She has to leave her special school this year and, so far, we haven't been able to identify any next step. The supported internship scheme won't take her because they think it will be too much for her. The local animal care college has told the LA that if they can rewrite her EHCP so that she doesn't need what she needs, they can take her, but they don't think she'll cope. Another college is very willing to support her but, understandably, they can't reduce the class size, and the class size is the main problem. She's not ready for work because she needs to have life skills work done to move her closer to being able to speak to people.

I guess what I'm saying is that she's not making a choice not to engage. She's limited by her disability and she's trying so very hard but these things don't improve in an instant. They need really skilled scaffolding.

I read that article this morning too but did raise my eyebrows at the 24yo who is 'thinking' of looking into doing volunteer work to broaden her CV. So she's been a NEET for at least 6 years and is now just 'thinking' of doing some volunteer work ... Good luck to her and I hope she gets on with it and finds a good job at the end of it but she needs to get a move on.

However it is going to be really, really difficult for many now as the entry level jobs in many fields have gone to AI. How universities have the barefaced cheek to be charging students for degrees they must know have been hugely affected by AI is beyond me. Those poor young people emerging all hopeful with their degrees (and huge student debts) only to find out there is a fraction of the entry level jobs that there was a few years ago is really sad.

I agree that many university courses are now ridiculous. If I had a penny for every young person I know who has done/is doing Graphic Design… there are so few graphic design jobs. A local multi-national employer has just made its entire design dept of 16 redundant - replaced by two people in Singapore and AI.

Even if it were true that many university courses are ridiculous, there will not be jobs for all the 16 or 18-year-olds who would be leaving and not going to university.

Universities are in many ways hiding the unemployment figures by deferring them til after uni or after a Masters.

I've got two dcs in this age bracket, both in apprenticeships. Neither was interested in uni.

The path for kids who aren't interested in uni is really tricky to navigate. School were utterly useless when it came to apprenticeships, we had no idea what was possible, how to find one, how to apply. All the school seemed to care about was uni places. Baffling.

Eldest left school with no plans but was in an apprenticeship full time within 12 weeks of leaving and now has a full time job at that company. Having been through it once we were better placed to support youngest and he's got his apprenticeship sorted for September. The other people in his interview group were all graduates.

We put a lot of time and effort into making sure that both kids had part time jobs from 18 (they did mystery shopping for age restricted items, if anyone is interested). Eldest also volunteered at a local library after leaving school. Sitting at home and doing nothing was just not an option. Eldest is severely ND, fwiw, so we had that to navigate. It wasn't easy, and it was stressful. You have to think outside the box and make a concerted effort to find opportunities to develop job skills and resilience. But it is possible.

But I'm not sure things are worse than usual. It makes a good headline to say that they are. I do think we're seeing more young people who have been told that it's unreasonable to expect them to cope with any discomfort, parented by social media, with parents who were present but absent because they were constantly on their bloody phones too.

And too many graduates who (not unreasonably) want to see some sort of return on the investment of their expensive degree.

This is where we are as a society. A CEO of a large financial organisation, when talking to investors, calling employees he can replace with AI as 'low value human capital'. He got some criticism, but at least he was being honest. That's exactly how the majority of employees are seen by large corporations. We are the first generation that really hasn't given a societal shit about the next generation.
But we find it easier to blame them for the shit show we have created by saying they are lazy and entitled when we have failed to regulate society to facilitate their development.
We've fucked up in a big way, but I have faith that the next generation will rectify this and create a more fair and just society with opportunities for all.

You attitude matches up with arse

It’s insane that we blame young people for their NEET status and not the state of the economy. Anyone who has tried to apply for even a part time job recently would know how tough the competition is. It’s insanely difficult for young people - especially those who were locked down during early secondary school, therefore missing out on such a key transitional life stage
I think it's parents with this attitude that is the biggest problem. Encouraging their children to blame something they have little control over as an individual rather than focus on what they can do. Teaching them that if something is difficult, it's okay not to try hard. Finding excuses why they are victims. If there's competition, it's impossible.

What hope kids raised with these sort of attitude have in focusing on what they can achieve rather than lamenting on how hard done by they are?

The reality is that although times are hard, there is still hope. Like most average graduates, it took my son 9 months to get a proper jobs and many many applications. It took him feeling depressed and hopeless. It took wanting to give up and feeling terrible. It took him feeling worthless and unwanted. But like others, he kept going when others gave up and his determination paid off.

There is no denying that kids from involved, supportive and able households will generally do better.But then again, some posters on here see your kids unworthy of their jobs /apprenticeships because you as parents “put time and effort” into it, and it should’ve all been done by them, and used as a reason why “youths these days” are so crap.

Acknowledging and identifying a problem doesn’t mean you’re encouraging your kids to blame something else. It’s just reassuring them that no, they aren’t completely crap ,failures and lazy snowflakes which is why no one wants them. It helps them to keep going and trying. Do you really not know the difference?

I agree. I was telling my daughter this when she was ill the other day. I had to watch breakfast tv, This Morning, Neighbours was the only fun show. Then going for gold! Then hours of boredom! She was meanwhile on her iPad watching what she wanted!

I only know 2 in that age group who aren't earning, learning or working. One is having a career break while her child is a toddler; her partner earns enough money to for them to get by and she intends to go back to work when the child is older, the other developed FND following a traumatic c-section and is unable to work because they're in a wheelchair and have seizures. She intends to go back to work (she's a nursery nurse) when she's recovered.

Of the others I know in that age group, they are doing/have done apprenticeships in motor mechanics, carpentry, hairdressing etc and are working or have jobs lined up, one is a post-grad doing a libarianship qualification, another who got a degree is working for an LA and doing public finance accountancy qualifications. The carpenter is doing especially well, he's got a job lined up with a company that specialises in work for historic/listed buildings and he's shown a real skill for that.

This is in the SE though, I daresay it's tougher for young people to find work in other parts of the country.

My DD has just finished uni and is lucky enough to have secured a permanent role which may not be exactly what she is looking for, but is close enough to be good experience for it if nothing else. She had already worked for the organisation in a different role while at uni and had proved her merit, so to speak. Still; there was a gruelling interview process.
Obviously this cannot be the case for everyone. I know of many of her peers who have applied for literally hundreds of roles. Others are doing masters degrees which gives additional qualifications but without jobs just kicks the can down the road, so to speak. Many would happily do a minimum wage job, but a lot of these don’t want to employ and train a graduate who will clearly leave when something better comes along. Added to that housing costs which mean many are less flexible about where they can move to as they need to live at home, and the cost of owning and running a car is a further restriction.
It really isn’t about lazy young people. It’s a really harsh world out there.

Yup, SE and SW have the lowest percentages of NEETs.

Acknowledging and identifying a problem doesn’t mean you’re encouraging your kids to blame something else. It’s just reassuring them that no, they aren’t completely crap ,failures and lazy snowflakes which is why no one wants them. It helps them to keep going and trying. Do you really not know the difference?
Well yes, if you tell them the economy is tough, it's not just them being rubbish. However, the undertone of the quote was very different. They use the word BLAME. They only mention competition, choose dramatic words 'INSANELY DIFFICULT'... How is a young adult supposed to believe they can succeed in such defeating attitude.

I live in the SW and manual or farm work is very easy to come by for young men. I know a handful of young employed men who are now 30s but if they were 18 now I have no doubt they would be SEN Neets.

Last time I looked employers can sponsor overseas nationals. They do not have to prove that there is nobody presently resident here who could do the job.
Global companies in particular can pick and choose who they want and where.
I seem to recall reading that one construction company hired Indian nationals to be bricklayers for a new build estate.

The whole university sector needs a new funding model.

Worries about knife crime drugs traffic and the Madeline McCann effect

• re this, in some ways it's less understandable as crime is lower. But some areas do have genuine severe problems with knives,,county lines etc? I wonder how much this correlates with areas with lots of NEETs?