Can we talk about NEETs?

[MrsBennetsPoorNervesAreBack]

Sorry if there's a thread already and I've missed it. But I want to talk about NEETs.

Apparently, we are potentially going to have 1.25million young people not in employment, education or training by the early 2030s. This is quite an alarming number, and it feels like we're failing an entire generation - both the NEETs themselves, who don't seem to have very much going on in their lives that might give them a sense of satisfaction or achievement, but also their working peers who will presumably end up having to support them via the tax system.

I really don't want this to be a thread with lots of judgement or criticism of these young people - it seems to me that we must have failed them somehow as a society. I also want to steer clear of party politics if we can. But I really want to understand why we have so many young people in this position right now.

Does anyone have a child in this situation who would be willing to share why they find themselves in this position? What are the barriers to them studying or getting at least a part time job? Are they happy with how things are right now? Are they trying to change their situation? What do they actually do all day? Are they surrounded by friends who are in the same position? What do they do about money? And what do you feel about the whole situation as a parent?

If anyone is willing to share, I really hope we can avoid a pile-on in which the young people and/or their parents are subjected to a character assassination. I would like an honest and frank exchange of views and experiences because I do genuinely want to understand the root causes of this issue, but if it descends into blame and fingerpointing, then the whole conversation will get derailed.

For full disclosure, I do have a dc in the middle of the 16-24 age group, but neither she nor any of her friends fall into this category.

Yes we’ve had young graduates not able to make eye contact, shaking with nerves and barely able to speak (no disability declared)
Our admin lady is a grandma type in her 60s who brings them to the room with a bit of chit chat like was your journey here ok and some just blank her. We are two middle aged mums in interview it’s not high powered corporate and always include some easy questions they must surely have expected inc a team work one.
I was so despondent last time that I did interviewing session with my Girlguides.
I presume unis offer practice interviews but maybe aren’t basic enough or they don’t utilise careers service.

At least your company is trying to warm them up with gentle female interviewers. Most interviews feel like youve been subjected to a cross examination by the prosecution even for experienced candidates

Yep, it was basically the same setup as yours, bigger but a very casual office, and we were often blanked on just the chitchat (Do you want a coffee? Was the drive here okay, weather is miserable today isnt it etc) and just got stared at in response.

I find that very strange. I work with young people ( admittedly they are the ones with jobs as I see them in an apprenticeship setting) and they are all perfectly polite, fine talking to me, to their managers etc. I had one with ADHD who showed me a dizzyingly complicated chart she had devised to help her keep track of her coursework. My DS is 18 and he and his friends are all chatty and friendly to me. They will chatter away despite not really knowing me that well. Some of them are a bit overly friendly if I'm honest in a way I wouldn't have been with my friends parents. I have a bit of a socially awkward DS2 who is younger but he would still say ' no thank you' if someone offered him a drink!

I just read an article in The Times about wealthy parent paying up to 30k to coaches who claim they can get their DCs past AI recruitment.

Yes, we do need to learn from other countries. Makes a lot of sense.

If wealthy parents have to resort to those extremes (presumably alongside wealth they have networks and connections too) , what hope do the rest of us have?

Nothing. But years ago they were largely locked away in mental asylums. Then these were closed, in the 1980s I think and it became all about "lack of care in the community" instead. They've always existed, you just didn't used to see them.

There also weren't such stringent employees rights or employers rules. Jobs that people who were not unwell enough to find themselves locked away - but who were struggling to cope with life all the same - could have done in the past, they now won't even get an interview for. Employers don't want to take a chance on someone when it's almost impossible to fire anyone just for being incompetent.

Jobs that you could do alone, sometimes unsupervised if appropriate and you weren't a slacker, now require you to display teamwork skills just for the heck of it, before they'll even employ you. Once employed you'll have to take part in regular team building events and group training, instead of being trained on the job one-to-one by your immediate supervisor. Jobs that didn't (and still don't) require regular meetings, now require regular attendance at meetings.

Sure, there's always been ablists and discrimination, but it was actually easier to get - and keep - a job in the days when you weren't expected to like your job, or be a permanent bubbly ray of sunshine at all times, or justify your existence at regular appraisals and pretend you really loved your employer, as if you genuinely don't just come to work for the wages.

All this stuff that's work-adjacent, but not actually "the work" itself, this life-stuff that people who are struggling with health issues often struggle to do. It used to be enough to show up, do your job well and you'd be rewarded by being paid, without any other hoops to jump through. Now people who could do the work, but not the rest of the nonsense because it makes them (more) ill, are on the sick instead. Or if they're young and unable to cope with navigating the benefits system, and have parents who either know nothing about benefits or who are willing to fund their DC to live at home, they're NEETs.

Then despite being in the county with one of the lowest funding, we have all of the above -,we are obviously doing something right.

No one in our school writes any student off. It’s the parents who do that.

You are out of touch.
I completely support the students, they are however a product of their parents and their upbringing. I see about 50-60 students a day in my role. I have a good relationship with every student and they need the reassurance and support I offer. If parents would back off and let us try and do our jobs, we might genuinely get somewhere.
in our area, waiting lists to see other specialists are months long. Even GPs tell parents to ask the school what they can do. A GP who has a child at my school said she couldn’t and wouldn’t do my stressful job for all the money in the world.
i think you need to look at the latest Ofstead requirements. Mental and physical health are huge right now. There are check lists of what schools need - sounds like you could get a grilling.

You just did

Oh I can assure you out of touch I am not .Well aware of what is required and reality as regards funding and provision.

Also the fact remains school support can only help to a certain level. The things you list are best for mild anxiety, exam stress, friendship issues, or family adjustments.Schools cannot diagnose or treat severe clinical disorders, and support is limited to what a school can provide.

CAMHS are specialist services for children and young people with severe or complex mental health difficulties. They are best for clinical diagnoses, severe depression, eating disorders, self-harm, ADHD, trauma etc. Sadly many children that need what CAMHS offers are shut out and left to get a whole lot worse.

Your attitude towards parents is appalling.
It is widely recognised that the child mental health system needs to move away from a culture of parent-blaming toward compassionate, collaborative support. Does your school and services know your attitude towards parents?

Are you aware of parents attitude towards support staff? I have never ever been rude to a parent. I have colleagues who have been physically attacked and being sworn at is a daily event. We are an outstanding school. We are on our knees. I am making observations. And of course a lot of parents are amazing and their children will thrive and achieve amazing things.
I know that tomorrow morning, at 8 am I will have a queue of students waiting to see me and off load.

You are being hugely rude to parents and children on here alongside writing off children in year 7. That attitude will be very much present in real life.

From the Financial Times. What if remote working, not AI, is to blame for weak junior hiring?
share.google/iMtmyE4RpRIoNgvZG

I think that the problem with parents seeking support is that the systems for accessing support can be very antagonistic with parents having to "fight" to get it. Even if the people involved try to conduct themselves well this sort of system will test anyone's patience.

There are simply not enough jobs to go round. Jobs, never mind good, moral or well paying jobs. Just any job.

I am 50 and cannot find one either and this has never happened to me. I usually appear somewhere and they take me in, the CV is just an add on.

So I am thinking what I am going to do 20 odd more years...never been on benefits, thanks God for now don't need them but hey ho, sofa surfing and slowly becoming one old misanthropic mass

I have done all the choirs, churches, volunteering, adult courses, crafts at home and in studios, nothing seems to be filling this urge to be in paid employment and seeing the money comes in each month

Not in Employment, Education or Training.

So imagine, these are also kids born from foreign parents who are becoming British. How the government is going to tackle ever growing population when they do not have enough job offers????

Absolutely this and your damned if you do, damned if you don’t. The amount of threads I’ve seen where posters blame parents for not fighting enough! People have no idea until they’re fighting the system how appalling it is, how dreadful many services are( and I’m talking beyond negligent) and how gruelling supporting an ill or disabled struggling child is ,whilst trying to hold down jobs and pay the mortgage. After years of nothing from services and the education system you’re then expected to get them into work!!!

I have experienced battling the system with a child getting provision and one without. It is stark. My child who would have been written off by the previous poster would be NEET now if not for their robust EHCP and years of care from multiple services and finally superb SEND. I have another who got nothing,however hard we battled. We have several degrees between us and full time jobs. Battling the system and supporting a child getting nothing brought us to our knees and nearly broke us all. I dead to think how hard it is for others.

I’m so glad that now kindness and collaboration is being widely recognised as being crucial. Massive reforms to SEND and MH services( along with access to first step jobs and experience)are crucial too.

Despite the government complaints and woes this and that, it is the government policies who invite every growing immigrant population and spend more and more on benefits. One thinks that they may be want in fact to raise the taxes to pay for more and more benefits and this is why they shared the amount of the young people needing the benefit, not that they are bothered to resolve the crisis, but actually are happy to perpetuate it

It's such a myth that all ND people were locked away in asylums. They really were not. Non-verbal and what we'd call now Autism type 3 maybe but the rest, no.

Adult ADHD wasn't even recognised as a condition until this century and so you now have thousands of people up to the age of 70 or so being diagnosed with it which means they had it as children and although many faced struggles and hardships, they were still functioning in society - went to school and then worked.

Same goes for all the thousands of people diagnosed with ASC in older adulthood. A minority will have been misdiagnosed and treated as having mental health issues but still, largely in the community, went to mainstream schools and then worked.

Yet we now have numerous children and adolescents being diagnosed and we're expected to believe that it's ADHD or ASC that is causing them to not be able to be in education, answer a 'phone, have a conversation or get a job.

And that doesn't wash.

Autism and adhd impacts life massively. It has gone through generations in my family and the impact on life and work had been stark and yes inpatient was involved for verbal members without a learning disability.Having a diagnosis is hugely helpful and it was often women and girls who were shut out of the diagnosis process. Thankfully that’s now changing.

Only 3% of young people have an autism diagnosis and 5%. Both are under diagnosed in the uk. The recent NHS taskforce highlights this and how devastating ADHD can be.

www.england.nhs.uk/long-read/report-of-the-independent-adhd-taskforce-part-1/