AIBU to feel hurt my son will not visit while my dad lives here?

[Triniette]

So I have been up tossing and turning all night and I have no idea what to do about this.
My dad is 85, he doesn’t have any official diagnosis but he is certainly struggling with memory, controlling what he says and mood swings. He lives with DH and I, he has done since my mum passed away 9 years ago. Other than his state pension he has no income, and very little in the way of savings, my parents never owned a property.
Last week my son who is 27 and his relatively new girlfriend came to visit us.
My son’s new girlfriend has a French mother and an Italian father, her skin tone is notably tan though, perhaps what you would associate with south Italy more than anything.
My dad made a very stupid comment, something along the lines of “gosh aren’t you very dark, you wouldn’t think there was any French in you! You’re darker than some of the Italians I know, are you sure your French-Italian”
Now I don’t think my dad meant this maliciously, however I appreciate that it comes across awfully and his intentions don’t matter all that much if hurt is caused.
My son pulled us aside before they left and said it had upset his girlfriend and could my dad apologise. My dad apologised but it was clearly not all that sincere, I don’t think he believed he did anything wrong.

Today we are having a family get together, my son messaged me yesterday saying he and his girlfriend won’t be attending. There was no reason attached so I replied saying that’s okay, I hope all is well. He replied saying that his granddads comment made his girlfriend feel really uncomfortable and neither of them will be back in the house so long as my dad is still there. I replied saying I was really sorry that she had been made to feel uncomfortable and that I would talk to his granddad again as the last thing I would want is for anyone to feel uncomfortable in our home. My son replied saying it is irrelevant, as the damage is already done.

This is quite out of character for my son but I understand he just wants his girlfriend to feel comfortable.

My husband thinks they are being over dramatic and it’s not a massive deal, my dad apologised etc.

My daughter thinks their reaction is valid.

I feel totally stuck, I don’t know what to do with this, I really don’t want to have a bad relationship with my son or his partner.

AIBU to be really hurt he said they won’t come to our home again? We love hosting and all our family events are hosted at home, so he would be really missed.
What do I do?

If I was your son, I wouldn’t have had a filter with your father. As soon as he started, I’d have told him to shut up with the comments.

I think that's a very fair comment re social norms.
In 1941 when your father was born, your sons gf's grandparents were living under Mussolini's fascist rule and, for a time, the Pétainist aka Vichy aka Nazi government of France.
France has come close to electing Le Pen (both of them) far too many times, Italy currently has a far right leader, and who can forget Berlusconi's comments about Obama's "tan". Obviously I'm not suggesting she agrees with or supports any of that but I'd be surprised if she didn't have a single family member from an older generation who might make an inappropriate comment!

On rereading the original post, I realised that even your comments about the shade of the girlfriend’s skin felt weirdly unnecessary, as though you also think French people aren’t meant to have tan skin, so perhaps you don’t see your father’s comments as racist because your own thinking is also a bit racist?

This. You are doing amazing looking after your dad and I hope your son realises that. Do you think a memory assessment would be worthwhile? There are medications with a small benefit in Alzheimer’s dementia. And not that you should have to but having a diagnosis may help son and gf understand, especially as his behaviour or what he says may get more disinhibited

What exactly is supposed to be racist about this comment? People from Italy and France are Caucasian. Some people have more tanned skin than others. Some people are taller. Some people have blonde hair. None of that is racism.

If he was being racist and she felt uncomfortable she of course can not go to her boyfriend’s house. Just as if he was being sexist or held a political religious or any other view she found unbearable she could opt out. Personally it’s not how I’d behave and I don’t find it particularly admirable.

Personally having been on the end of these comments too, I find them to be racist micro aggressions and unacceptable.

(Similar to you - white British but dark features owing to genetics)

He said are you are you are really Italian or French - implying she was darker therefore not European.

I agree, it was multiple unpleasant comments, not just one.
My mother was like your father, she couldn’t see what was wrong about making rascist comments, she often thought it funny. I didn’t. And I would tell her so but it got to the point where I avoided taking her out because she was so unpleasant.

This is a really unbelievable unkind thing to say OP and maybe you should do some self reflection.

As mentioned above I've been on the receiving end of these comments all my life in the UK and it's shit, especially as a child.

Not to mention implying she is either too stupid to know her own heritage, or perhaps being dishonest about it.

Oh gosh what a nightmare.

I don't think there's much point arguing over whether what your dad said was offensive or not. It was certainly not appropriate, but even if it was racist, rather than simply inappropriate, I don't know what posters think you should do - kicking an 85 year old man out his home isn't going to help anyone and anything else doesn't remove the issue.

I suspect the answer might be to try and wangle a combination solution - meet up outside the home with them for a bit, suggesting meeting at theirs etc, then suggesting you'll do your best to prep your dad not to say things. Then either your son comes on his own occasionally or they both come.

Agree a method of dealing with his comments beforehand "dad, that's not a suitable topic, can we change the subject" and agree that with your son and his girlfriend in advance as well. Hopefully your dad will understand that you want to see your son even if he doesn't agree what he's saying is inappropriate.

If you can't do any of them then definitely go about getting him a memory assessment. Dementia literally eats your brain so it's not even necessarily that it makes you say things you already thought, it can make your personality change completely. If your son and his girlfriend understand this they may be more prepared to put up with what does sound like a pretty uncomfortable experience. But I think you'll still have to accept that they might not come skipping along with joy to what for them is going to be something of a trial.

So it wasn’t just one inappropriate comment she was subjected to, but many.

You will just have to suck this up unfortunately.

Seems it's fine to be ageist on Mumsnet.

Your first post made me think she was being precious, but your update sounds like she was relentlessly verbally attacked, it sounds exhausting, I would have left your house feeling like I wouldn't want to return, it wasn't very welcoming was it? Did anyone tell him to pipe down and leave her alone?

My goodness OP your update is absolutely horrendous. The racist remark is just ths tip of the iceberg given all the other comments your Dad made to the new gf. It must have been a really horrible experience for her.

I understand that your Dad's comments probably stem from his mental deterioration and, if that is the case, there is absolutely no guarantee that if he were to meet this young woman again there wouldnt be similar faux pas.

I understand why she doesn't want to visit and I can understand why your DS wants to show his solidarity with her.

My son did say to him in the moment, granddad can you not say things like that, and he did stop for a moment but he started up again, I genuinely don’t believe it was malicious at all, though I do understand intent doesn’t eradicate the impact.
I understand it was a rough day for his girlfriend, I’m sure being around a family where my husband and myself and my dad all have regional accents, English is her 3rd language etc. would be difficult without adding in the comments. I think she’s a nice girl, she hasn’t given me any reasons to think she is doing this to isolate my son from us, none the less I just don’t know how to handle it. Hosting is our main way of getting together as a family, we have several relatives who much prefer it to going out.
Of course I will still see them at either my sons or out at a cafe, but it will be so sad for them to not be at the family gatherings.

Little thought experiment for you. On your first visit to your son's GF home, her parents say the following:

"Your bone structure is notably large though, perhaps what you would associate with a trans woman more than anything."

"Gosh aren’t you very butch, you wouldn’t think there was any natural woman in you! You’re more muscular than some of the men I know, are you sure you were born a woman?”

"Aren't you tall. Aren't you hairy. Aren't you strong."

Followed by an insincere apology when it was pointed out hurt had been caused.

Would you be reluctant to return?

My DD’s fiancé has black hair and olive skin and he has been asked several
times If he is mixed race. Is he offended? No. He laughs and explains that henis probably half Gloucestershire and half Oxfordshire.

This. The impact on your son and his GF experiencing racist comments at a family gathering is the point. It’s not for anyone else to say how they should feel. They’re clearly still upset.

An insincere apology can also add insult to injury. Your son is right, the damage is done. If you break a plate and say sorry it doesn’t change anything.

Best you can do is respect their wishes and meet away from your home for the time being. Create lots of good interactions/memories and keep your DF away from DS/his GF.

That is one hell of a drip feed.

My dad is a similar age and I can imagine him saying this stuff. Nothing to do with dementia. He is just socially stupid and has always said what he thinks. We pull him up on it all the time and it doesn’t work. He just gets defensive. Some people are just rude and stupid.

This young woman must have felt very self-conscious. Esp if nobody really supported her during the meal. She will probably move on this eventually but give her time.

I feel really sad for you that your son doesn't recognise what a wonderful thing you are doing but looking after your father. I always put my own feelings to one side for the sake of my Mum as I knew how much she was doing.

I think your son is being highly intolerant considering the issues your father is facing. It's totally fine if the girlfriend doesn't want to goz but I'm very surprised at your son.

she is 24 now and I’d have hoped she could tell the difference between malicious intentions and passive comments

So you hold a 24 year old to a much higher standard than an 85 year old? Surely your DF could have learned not to upset guests by repeatedly making insensitive and racist comments by now or you could have intervened and taken them to another part of the house once you witnessed DF was in Alf Garnett mode.

Part of the issue here is you maybe seem to think they should be over it already and their reaction is the issue.

Racism is offensive, but a bit of casual ageism is clearly fine....