AIBU to think these boys should have been incarcerated?

[newrubylane]

BBC News - Teenage boys sentenced for raping lone girls
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clypg68e2neo

I've never started an AIBU before, but I'm genuinely really shocked. I'm just not sure how this sentence is justifiable. Their actions were premeditated and deliberate, they were carrying a knife and they filmed themselves. They're obviously a danger to women/girls, and probably to other boys too.

If anyone knows how and why this sentence might have come about, I'd be interested to hear it.

And shame on their mothers who were relieved or whatever

Disgusting.

Yes this is what everyone has been posting above. Links are there for details necessary. Write "unknown" for names

I’m absolutely sickened. The sentencing for rape in this country is too lenient and it makes it seem that rape is now “legal” as there is no deterrent. It’s so very upsetting. Those poor girls.

Oh sorry. Have they been? I've been on a mission and didn't check. I'm too fired up. 🙄 Thanks for the heads up re the 'unknown' for names.

I didn’t say that. I said I agree that children shouldn’t be unnecessarily criminalised, to give them the best chance of rehabilitation.

you’re so wild with fury you’ve made assumptions. We are talking about one situation which we have limited details of, I don’t apply the same view to every single under 18 who has committed a violent crime. I don’t know the first thing about the iow bomber.

I’m not really following you. Are you saying you think manslaughter is the same as murder? The outcome is obviously the same but legally they’re very different and attract different sentences. The sentences in this case are a little below average I think, but not as surprising as the rape case in the OP.

Agree that a community sentence often seems as though it’s not much of a punishment. However there’s no evidence that longer prison sentences are a deterrent to others than shorter ones, or that prison is more of a deterrent than a non-custodial sentence. In countries where children really are not criminalised, there’s less youth violence and less reoffending.

What an arsehole of a judge and there are many more of them.

I think the judge should have to sign his name to a legal document stating that he will be held responsible for any sexual attack these rapists do in the next 20 years.

If he has such faith in the little shits, that won't be a problem for him and if it is, he should ask himself why he is willing for women to take the consequences and risks of his brainless sentence if he isn't.

A guarantor for a loan has to sign his name saying he will be responsible if the person making the loan repayments stops doing so. It is the same principle.

That might make a few of these soft headed, soft hearted judges think twice.

i am horrified by what i am reading. I half expected the boys to be 11/12 or in some kind of relationship . Not that would make this ok in any shape or form but it might have explained why the judge wanted to give a second chance.
but these boys knew exactly what they were doing, they SHOULD be criminalised! Surely this kind of crime is what prisons are for!!

Wonder how the boys would have felt if someone raped their mother's/sisters?

But they’re violent rapists, so they wouldn’t be “unnecessarily criminalised”, would they?

It is absolutely appalling. What message does that send to those poor girls.
As the mother of girls I am so increasingly pissed off at the attitudes held by certain males and the dismissive responses they seem to receive from our society. I really don’t recognise this place anymore.
Form completed.

I've written to appeal the sentence as unduly lenient. This is a disgraceful outcome to a very disturbing crime. Those young girls will have to live with what happened to them for the rest of their lives; it's only fair that their attackers should have an equally serious consequence.

There you go

https://www.gbnews.com/news/prison-officer-ear-sliced-off-terrorist-jail-beaten-unconscious-kettle-work

I think you’re just goading posters for whatever purpose. Your lack of empathy for these girls is crystal clear.

Thank you for previous posts stating how to complain about an unduly lenient sentence. Here’s a link for others:

www.gov.uk/ask-crown-court-sentence-review

So what? What’s it to you if 10 people or a hundred submit the form?

So what.

A deterrent is only part of it-we're too hung up on that.

The main part should be focusing on punishment.

Punishment is what these fuckers need and if the punishment is harsh enough, that will be deterrent enough.

If they come out and throw a crisp packet in the street, then back they go for life.

Bollocks to rehabilitation-there is no such thing. Punishment is what's needed. Hard, tough, unforgiving and strong.

If there aren't enough prisons then get those already in prison to build more-that will reduce the bill and make them work for their keep doing something useful.

I would vote for any party who would look hard at our current judicial system and sentencing guidelines.

It is not fit for purpose. It does not protect the public, it does not appropriately punish crimes (especially sexual ones) and it does not act as any form of deterent.

There seems to be something wrong with many judges, they have too much leeway within sentencing guidelines to be lenient where they have a bias for some reason (look at this man's comments about not wanting to criminise these serial rapists).

Polite request to not downplay mumsnetters submitting these forms

We have every right to and as @Meadowfinch noted
the more people who do this the better

Who after all gives a toss about creating an admin problem for a justice system that doesn’t protect young girls

Im all for giving them an admin headache every time !!!

I agree and I have also raised a complaint.

Thank you to the PPs who provided links

Form submitted.

There is some evidence that intensive rehabilitation can work for youth offenders but properly done, it removes them from home, puts them with dedicated well trained case workers, often involves significant outdoor activities, and is expensive to run. I’m sceptical that happens in the UK.

Edited to add: In countries where children really are not criminalised, there’s less youth violence and less reoffending. See above. In other countries, it’s a mixture of either more focus on outdoor activities, better education, and/or stronger family and societal influence guiding and judging youth behaviour.

but it would seem that the judge wasn’t “wrong” or “weak” per se @SpidersAreShitheads thanks for posting the sentencing guidelines and the judge may well have made his judgement accordingly but there was absolutely no need to pronounce that ‘no one goes to jail today’ (or to that effect). He could have apologised to the victim’s families for being unable to give a custodial sentence. Without further explanation, his comments point to thinking of the offenders families more than the victims at that point.

I am so sick of the future of boys being considered far more important than the ruined lives of girls.

Judges follow the law to sentence someone who has been found guilty. Unless they have made an error in the sentencing, they are not responsible for the guidelines they follow.

Do you think they just use their own personal opinion to sentence people?!?

Perhaps not officially, but it sends a message, and a message needs to be sent!

I think we should write to our MPs too