Does this sound like neurodivergence or a sensitive temperament?

[kvazzy]

Hi everyone,

Posting on AIBU for traffic.

I’m trying to make sense of my DD’s profile and would really appreciate balanced perspectives, especially from parents of neurodivergent children or people who know this area well.

My DD has just turned 5 and is in Reception. Overall she is doing well. School are happy with her progress, she is developing well academically and teachers say she is on track. She also does well in structured activities such as tennis, ballet and singing. Teachers/coaches generally give positive feedback. She has a lot of energy, but can also concentrate.

What makes me wonder about neurodivergence:

• She is very emotionally intense and can get very upset over things that may seem small.
• She finds losing, being second, or another child being “first” very hard. For example, if another child overtakes her on a bike or runs ahead of her, she can become very upset and say she doesn’t want to be friends with that child anymore, although this does not last.
• She can take refusal very personally. If another child doesn’t want to play her game or do something together, she can experience it almost as rejection of the whole friendship.
• She can be quite controlling in play. She loves children and wants to play, but sometimes wants very intense, close interaction and struggles when the other child wants space or wants to do things differently.
• She has some sensory sensitivities: hair brushing, hair washing, nail cutting. We have to put a cartoon on while doing all these things.
• She can be perfectionistic. She has said things like “I am not good enough” and can become very upset if her writing or numbers don’t look right.
• She is very sensitive to criticism or correction and can become upset if we point out mistakes.
• She can resist everyday demands such as dressing, handwashing and stopping play. We often have to make these tasks playful or interesting for her.
• She can be very shy around other people at first, especially adults.

What makes me less sure it is neurodivergence:

• She is very socially motivated and has always loved being around children.
• She has rich imaginative play and creates lots of different scenarios and games.
• Her play is flexible in the sense that she invents new games all the time, rather than repeating one rigid script.
• She generally does well at school and in structured classes.
• She can follow instructions and wait her turn in after-school clubs.
• She has good language and can often explain her feelings afterwards. For example, after one big upset with friends and craft materials, she later told me she was scared the other children would take her things without asking.
• She usually recovers after meltdowns and can go back to playing happily.
• She seems very empathic and relationship-focused, sometimes almost too much so.

I suppose what confuses me is that she is not withdrawn or socially uninterested at all. If anything, she is intensely social, very imaginative, bright, energetic and sensitive. But she struggles a lot with rejection, losing, sharing control, and feeling that her things or her place in the group are at risk.

Does this sound more like possible neurodivergence, or more like a highly sensitive / intense / strong-willed child who needs support with emotional regulation and social flexibility?

As you have probably recognised, this is not the best place to get an objective view. 5 is still very young, teachers often won’t recognise neurodiversity as there is such a wide spectrum of behaviours. I would just keep watching and supporting your DD and see how it goes- there is so much development to come. It’s hard when you have one child as you don’t know what’s standard and what’s not. Both of my children are neurodiverse and they’re both very different. And by the way neither of them were diagnosed in primary school despite my concerns. I think maybe it’s better now. But the diagnosis is not the important thing, the support is. So just keep watching and supporting and see how things go.

You’re wrong to assume that ND kids aren’t social or empathetic.

I have a child (who is now a young adult) with ADHD and he’s very popular, sociable and flexible.

You’ll know if it’s ND if a gap between your dd and her peers develop. Everybody has weaknesses and there will be plenty of 5 year olds who struggle with losing or say things like they want to end their friendships over silly things. It’s perfectly normal for kids to have black and white thinking at age 5. Experiences create the grey areas where she can deal with things like not liking her handwriting.

Are you or her dad ND? You seem keen to label her behaviour as outside the norm so I wonder if her “perfectionist” behaviour was learned from you? If you help her channel her desire for success positively, she could achieve some great things. Model and encourage her to praise others for their achievements and with time she will hopefully see that it’s ok not to be the best at everything and your love for her isn’t based on her achievements.

She sounds like my DD was at 5. You’ve described what a lot of young children are like.

My DD is NT.

I posted something similar on here about 11 years ago about my highly sensitive almost 3yo and mainly got a load of armchair psychologists blaming my parenting. Anyway, things came to a head in Y2 when she started getting very distressed about going into school and was ultimately diagnosed with autism. Keep on keeping an eye OP; you’ve given a good list but even then it’s hard to convey your full everyday experience and concerns in a post. It comes down to the intensity and frequency of these things and how they impact her ability to navigate daily life unsupported. You might find this a helpful resource.

I would and see but also read up on how adhd and autism presents in girls. There is so much ignorance re this and all to often they’re left instilling crisis.

All of my dc have diagnoses for both and have traits on both your lists in the op.

When I see these thread titles, I do roll my eyes.
I have a ND adult DC, has a great job, hobbies etc, so you have an odd idea of what ND looks like.
Your DD sounds like an indulged only child, used to her own way, your gentle parenting won’t help her, she sounds quite demanding and spoiled tbf.

To add, I think you know her behavior is lacking and possibly hoping to excuse it by saying ‘oh she’s ND’ step up and parent her.

ND or not, games at home as a family will help her to experience losing - mum and dd as a team vs dad for example with you modelling, ‘ah well, never mind’ and ‘well done, dad’. Games like the Sneaky snacky squirrel really worked for us.

Sounds like an average sweet/ intelligent girl of 5

It’s really hard from a snippet to conclude any sort of possibility it a diagnosis of anything.

my daughter - I never really thought she had autism but her school did.

she is empathetic, fairly rarely has a meltdown about anything can get upset but rarely like a big meltdown. Is a “ good” loser. Never gets in to trouble. Academically able and does well in school.
Follows rules, never been in trouble at school. Not even needed a reminder of rules.
enjoys having friends, but is passive.

I eventually followed the schools lead and she was diagnosed with autism and adhd.
her Ed psych reports and OT reports etc meant she ended up on a independent Sen school without tribunal.

there is no one I have ever met in our actual personal life who would assume she was autistic - but she is.
the SLT who did her ADOS and a community paed said it wasn’t even a conversation needed between them as she scored so highly on the ADOS.

It could be neurodivergence or it might be typical 5 year old behavior. If there's neirodivergence it will become more evident as she gets older. Don't worry about the people saying you're trying to label her. I was worried my DD was autistic from the age of 3 and was told I was being silly by family etc. Shes 9 now and shes being assessed and almost certainly autistic. Time will tell. Just keep half an eye on it and trust your instincts. You know her best. Its good that you're aware she might be so she will get the help she needs if and when she needs it.

That’s exactly what I thought!

You do sound worried - Unfortunately no-one on a forum can tell you with any accuracy whether or not your child may be neurodivergent. Is there any family history? Have you raised your queries with school staff?

In primary school, my DD had a friend just like your daughter. She really struggled with friendships, but has now completely settled down and is doing well at secondary having outgrown some of her earlier ‘quirks’.

I do get what you are saying. She is an only kid, she did went to the nursery though from 1.5 yo (part time). But yes, at home /with grandparents she is often in the centre of attention and winning the games

Apologies if anyone has posted this, but have the school raised any concerns OP?

Yes we explain things when she is upset (and after, once she is calmer). It helps eventually. It just feels she is a bit more reactive and emotional than other kids.

I think she sounds like a five year old with a fiery, assertive character.

That is interesting, so in her case what were her signs?

No first time posting! A bit of an anxious mum but don't think I am completely OTT considering that many children got missed and diagnosed later in life. I am not saying she is def ND, just asking if any of these could be signs...

She sounds like a 5 year old.

Honestly, it sounds like normal only child behaviour to me.

My nephew was the same. Incredibly bright, lovely lad, but dear god if he wasn’t the best/first/biggest he would have huge meltdowns. His mother was a large part of his problems.

He only changed once he moved away for uni, and has really mellowed out now. At one point I was genuinely concerned about what would happen if a woman refused him sex. That’s how spoiled he was. He either didn’t hear “no” or when he did, SIL couched it in ridiculous platitudes.

Thanks @Neuronimo . She would self-calm if we leave her to it, yes. If she's not tired it would usually take from 5 to 15 minutes to come back to normal (she would stay in a quiet corner/ her room before that saying no one is her best friend).

Regarding games, they are quite different games each time - I think she's got good imagination as she keeps inventing new games. If a friend does not want to play her game / follow the rules, she could get offended especially if she really wanted to play it. On some occasions she would drop it and follow the friend. On others, she would have a tantrum. She would then calm down and they continue playing again. The tantrum could be very emotional, though.

Stop letting her win games for a start. You obviously love her very much but she’s too used to getting her own way and being the centre of attention. Try building in more situations where she doesn’t get to decide what’s happening and isn’t the centre of attention.
Sounds like there’s a lot of validating of feelings and talking things through. This isn’t always going to be possible in real life so I’d dial back on this too. Be a bit more matter of fact. Eg daddy won, well done daddy! And then ignore any fallout from her.

so her not breaking any rules was actually her biggest sign.
she is a absolute stickler for the rules but this equally can be restrictive.
she is super passive - can’t say no, easily manipulated and this causes a lot of issues with peers. She is a target for quite significant bullying because she can not show a single bit of assertiveness.
she likes strict routines, struggles with noise and although likes having friends she struggles to understand the dynamics of friendships. They explained that the school picking it up was great because in these cases often is goes unnoticed until teen years where it effects their mental health as they are internally stressing and masking on the outside.
she also has strong special interests and huge anxiety of doing something wrong ( mainly in school rather than home )
when she started her secondary school ( I dependent ) they do SLT and OT assessments and even then I was surprised to read how she qualified for the maximum amount of sessions in both the school offered.