To wonder on the future of generous welfare in the UK

[happybug1234]

It seems increasingly obvious that many middle-income families are becoming frustrated at how squeezed they are financially, while at the same time seeing people on universal credit receive a growing range of subsidies and support — £1 attraction tickets on days out, a 6% rise in benefits this financial year, childcare costs reclaimable through Universal Credit, housing benefit, and so on. I see thread after thread on this on this site and also increasing momentum in the media on this issue (income cliff edges etc)

In my own extended family, 1 unemployed parent with the other on min wage, in social housing appear to have more holidays and more disposable income than we do, despite us both working full time with a household income of around £95k. Once childcare, mortgage, insurances, commuting and tax are taken into account, we 100% have a lower level of disposable income than they do as they do not have any of these work related costs and their rent is paid. They have recently gone on a 2 week holiday whilst the most we can ever afford is 1 week.

Quite a few teachers in my friendship circle are declining promotion opportunities or TLR because the extra pay often doesn’t feel worth the additional stress once tax, pension contributions and childcare costs are factored in. Instead, some are putting more effort into private tutoring, which is tax free cash in hand.

What is stopping the government from addressing this as people seek to be responding accordingly in their behaviour!

But you shouldn't just keep getting more money because you decided to have more children. There are people who only have one because their income is too high for benefits

There's someone on Twitter who has 10 children (3 not on the claim because of their age) most of them have a disability. Why should we keep paying for them to have children?

Your wording suggests to me that you think the parents are somehow swindling the system. They're not. As I said, if their child was eligible in 2018, they'll remain eligible until some point this year. A side benefit (to ALL pupils) of FSM eligibility is the added pupil premium funding awarded to the school.

The parents may not even have applied for FSM themselves. I didn't. The school sent about a dozen letters home pleading with parents to check whether they were eligible and apply, because they needed the pupil premium. In the end, the school applied on my behalf - they neither informed me of this nor asked my permission; nor was I ever required to submit any information proving my income.

If you're earning less than £7,400 a year, or are eligible because you meet other criteria, then you should also consider claiming. If you're earning more than that, yet you and your children have to scavenge through public bins for food, or they have to watch you slowly starve because you have given up food so that they can eat, then no, I don't think that's right. But it is not the fault of someone who is eligible for FSM.

Not everyone has a career, or is career building.

A lot of whom don't know what they're talking about, unfortunately.

Clearly, but @Wynter25 is more interested in trying to shut down debate than acknowledge there are a lot of people very unhappy about the situation.
Rather like Labour on Thursday, as it happens.

It’s not benefits bashing, we are allowed to critique the system? Don’t like it? Tough!

Its changing in September so that if you receive universal credit regardless of income, you're entitled to FSM

There has been plenty of personal bashing on here of people on benefits.

And this is why Labour voters like me will be looking elsewhere in the future. The failure to tackle the waste of money.

That's a disgrace.
Freebies like FSM should be means-tested, not automatically given to those in certain groups, regardless of their income. Money is money, regardless of how it arrives in your bank account.

Er, universal credit is means tested?

Means tested to give me over £5,000 a month (see my post above)
That's a lot more than many families earn, yet they are considered able to afford it.
Blanket entitlement to things has to stop.

It is benefit bashing.

Im doing nothing wrong. Shouldnt have to justify myself

Theres no need for it.

Thank God many are. You rely on them.

I disagree. I think the complainers know full well they have better lives than those on benefits, even if they aren't interested in helping those less fortunate than themselves.

When you talk about the desire to give back, who are you talking about giving back to? Because it feels contradictory that you're expressing this sentiment in the same sentence as using the word 'leeching' about benefit claimants.

If you mean benefit fraudsters, I quite agree and tbh if the benefit bashing threads focused on bashing the fraudsters instead of the genuinely in need, I doubt there'd be much complaint if any, because literally none of us want the fraudsters to prosper except the fraudsters themselves. It's the continual inability of some people to accept that most benefit claimants want to work if they aren't already doing so, want to be productive members of society, are doing the best they can, and really don't have better lives just because £1 days out, as someone claimed upthread 🙄that is causing some of us to lose patience with the endless bashing we're seeing on MN at the moment.

What gets to me about these threads is that, yes, people should be angry - but not with the least fortunate in life. We should all be targeting our ire in the same direction - towards underpaying employers, benefit fraudsters, and the succession of immoral/inefficient governments over the decades. That's where the blame lies. Not with the poorest, weakest, and least able to alter their lot in life.

Anyone who genuinely thinks bona fide benefit claimants have it better (I inserted the 'bona fide' as yes there will always be scammers, unfortunately, and that's not OK) is too thick to be taken seriously as far as I'm concerned. Honestly, some folk need to take a long hard look at themselves and their so-called values if you ask me.

Erm, a bursary, or scholarship....

Can we drop the word 'free' please. It is tax-payer funded.

Actually, I think the FSM scheme should be expanded so that all children are eligible, regardless of parent income. Schemes in other countries have proved that FSM programmes deliver significant and long-term health, education and financial benefits. We don't have to be furious because some people are eligible for things we are not. We should be focussed on raising standards for everyone, not dragging everyone down to the basest level.

People get to contribute to threads how and when they choose.

It’s labour that’s increasing the FSM to all children from families on UC from September and then once entitled they keep getting it for years after even if they become millionaires, if that’s not a perk I don’t know what is. I don’t resent the fact that the parent at the school who is a consultant in the local hospital can afford to holidays in the Maldives, something we could never dream of, they would of had to have been a straight A student all their lives and their work life carries a huge amount of challenge and responsibility but I do resent the fact we are taxed so much that we can’t afford the treats for our children that many people on UC can and a large reason we are taxed so much is to pay for the country’s astronomical welfare bill. I don’t resent them personally but I do resent the government who has created such a divisive system

because it seems the govt needs more people for the system to be able to tax as and when,

besides why the hate for the people, blame the system not the person

FSM for every child would be much fairer but it’s not what the labour government are doing. It’s not the children on FSM whom teachers are finding are going without at lunchtimes