To say no thank you to someone paying off the mortgage?

[yourewrongthenyoureright]

FIL has always been a very controlling and tricky man. Not cruel. But controlling and manipulative. I’ve kept my distance where I can. DH helps him administrate his life/speaks to him everyday /visits him (4hrs away) monthly. Husband and I have stood on our own two feet and not asked for or accepted (when occ offered) from his (not insubstantial/not crazy wealthy) pockets.

My SIL/husband have been very happy to accept help / have asked for help (FIL contributes significantly towards: kids at private school/v nice holidays/new cars - we haven’t had those things. They earn v similarly to us, I think). We can’t have those things on our earnings and so we’ve not had them. We feel he then exerts control over them and they seem less able to maintain boundaries with him as a result. SiL does less for him than DH, ironically, but there is a v different relationship which I find really one sided (he isn’t nice to her because he has power, I think. The power to take away)

Anyway. He talking about significantly downsizing and is saying this would free up enough money* to pay off both mortgages (ours and SiL’s). It would obviously be life changing in as much as we have yearsandyears of mortgage left.

But can you ever accept a gift like this without being beholden?

*Obviously I appreciate IHT situation etc.

Can you do both @yourewrongthenyoureright accept the gift and also exert strong boundaries which won't leave you feeling beholden?

Well, I’d say yes. I’d rather take the money than Rachel Reeves have it in IHT! You are denying your kids a leg up if you could use the mortgage money to invest for them?
Or if you really don't want to accept it, could he give your DH’s share straight to your kids?

Take the money. Once it’s paid off, what can he take away? It’s different for sil if the possibility of the kids schooling could be taken away- you could still be grateful but have your strong boundaries

I would take it. But depending on what you know about his financial situation it could be considered deprivation of assets if he later needs care & doesn't have enough money for it.

I think because it would be a large amount of money he will need to legally ‘gift’ it to you anyway - you will need to draft legal letter etc (I think) if it’s like anything to do with gifting when getting a mortgage anyway..

would you not stay out of it (turn a blind eye) and if he wants to gift his SON he can. (Obv whatever he gifts to your husband benefit you) but I would look at it like
he is only gifting your husband. If this makes sense !!

It’s a one off gift, he couldn’t take it back even if he wanted to. And DH is already doing loads for him, what do you imagine getting worse if you accept it?

I don’t know how much your mortgage is but it would be completely life changing if we could suddenly pay ours off, literally transformative, so I don’t think your reasons for declining such a massive gift are very good. And surely it’s equally up to your husband.

Take it. If. he flings it in your face at every opportunity then go low contact surely. Maybe get something in writing that it’s a gift, freely given.

I'd do what the others have said. Take it but still maintain strong boundaries because there's nothing he can take away from you, unlike your SIL

You are all correct, obviously. It would make a big difference to the kids’ childhood and it would make us able to give them a better start to their own adult life.

He is just so able to manipulate SiL: I couldn’t bear it. DH is able to just say ‘Dad, I’m hanging up now’. ‘Dad, I’m taking DD to X. It’s not a good time’ when he’s being a nightmare on the phone. It just feels like - by taking money - you’re taking away your right to that.

Your dh speaks to him everyday and sorts out his life admin - which his sister doesn’t do. I’d say he was already very much enmeshed in his life! But she’s being paid for it! Take the money. Shove it in a bank account if you don’t want him to use it against you so you can easily give it back.

In what ways is he controlling and manipulative - knowing that might help answer whether you can remain independent after a large gift.

(and, as others have said, make sure you get a deed of gift so there's no question of it being considered a loan by him, or subsequently his executors)

And there’s no reason why he can’t continue to do that.

It just feels like - by taking money - you’re taking away your right to that.

How though? What’s he going to do?

Take the money and run!

You're only beholden if you allow yourself to be.

Tricky if it's an in law though.

This. Times are hard, set to get harder and it will get taxed to shit through inheritance.

I'd take the money. You don't know what is around the corner - other than death and crazy taxes!

You don't need to accept any ill behaviour from him.

What is he going to do if you do enforce boundaries? He can't ungive you the money

this. don't let the promise of money control how you interact - your dh already has a healthy relationship from the sounds of things. so don't pander to him if it's "you can have it IF...". But once it's paid off, you offer appropriate appreciation and gratitude and carry on.

Once the money is paid, it’s paid. The constant top ups is what keeps your SIL being controlled by him as she has to keep on his good side!

Check out any potential implications, ie, tax on it if he dies in the next 7 years - this is on a sliding scale.

It sounds like it's a personality issue. Your DH is able to stand up for himself. SIL isn't. I don't see how him paying off your mortgage would change that.

DH is able to just say Dad, I’m hanging up now’. ‘Dad, I’m taking DD to X. It’s not a good time’ so if FIL then says 'but I paid off your mortgage' then he'd and 'thank you, we're very grateful, but I need to get DD to X, goodbye'.

That would be payable out of his remaining assets.

@yourewrongthenyoureright What age is your FIL? As well as IHT you might need to consider what happens if he needs paid for care. The LA can consider deliberate Deprivation of assets and go back more than 7 years.

I think if I were you, I would take the money, but bank it and see what happens down the line, before I spend any of it, in case it is needed back for care. At least if he lives another 7 years IHT won't be payable. But that depends how old he is right now.

Aha, maybe you can share how to do it - as in run with the hare and course with the hounds?

I would still accept the gift.

You can exert your own boundaries.

If he dies within 7 or 8 years of giving you the gift would that not be seen as deprivation of capital? Maybe you should get legal advice before accepting anything. Read any legal papers from FIL back to front incase a hidden clause that he owns your house or something along those lines. Could he not just directly gift it to your children instead?

I understand everything you're saying op and I would feel the same. Because it could be constantly thrown in your face if you cant/wont keep up with any demands he puts on you , you'll be reminded by him of how he's paid off your mortgage