AIBU to feel so weary of labour voters going on

[livingonstrawbs]

I think if people in real life knew I was saying this, they would be shocked or maybe not.

Reform are not my politics but I'm honestly so fed up of labour voting friends lamenting the rise of reform and blaming it all the greens and declaring everyone voting reform to be racist, stupid, ignorant.

Reform absolutely have some racist nutters but I do not believe that councils that were labour for more than 50 years turned reform because everyone became a racist overnight or is ok about racism.

Even saying yesterday that the rise of reform was down to failure of lab/conservative to do do anything other than maintain the status quo for many working class communities, let alone others, and the media to properly question, inform and hold to account farage was met with a barrage of hostility and false accusations. one person genuinely thinks this is all down to zack polanski and that farage has been questioned as hard as he has. Really?!?!

I should say by the way that I am a person of colour, was on free school meals, ended up going to Oxbridge and doing professionally well even if it's not lucrative. that's fine - those are all my choices. I'm miles better off than many other people and I know that. But i'm still very connected to the community i grew up in and see how working class people of all races etc without the same chances are living in immense poverty and the grind that is going on for them. Meanwhile, my very affluent labour voting friends seem to repeat 'labour is the best of a bad bunch.' for who, i say?? maybe for you. but honestly, when life is continualy shit, people do vote for change and will vote for reform or greens.

i'm just sick of being patronised and told i'm stupid, ignorant etc etc.

This is such a good summary of what is going on. But the left won’t get it. In their minds, an even more extreme version of this, the Green Party is the answer.

Any other political debate is moot when the spectre of immigration looms on the political battlefield because working class and middle and upper class will absolutely unite on that one issue - the UK is rejecting mass migration and no insults will stop it.

And yet net migration figures continue to fall, following the record breaking years under the Conservatives ? Which I imagine you see as a good thing ?

I agree with your point about a leap into the unknown, but Reform aren't the unknown.

We know them from who funds them, their voting records, the things they say and do, that their MPs were all Tory before Reform, Farage's record of attendance as an MEP for example.

I agree with you on your second paragraph - like I said, they're not my cup of tea. but despite all that, they're promising change and for some people that's enough because the 'unknown' is they havent been in power as a government and when they tell people they're the only credible option to improve things people will go for that with no viable alternative.

this is why i also think the media has a lot to answer for.

I agree with you.

I wouldn’t want reform in power, but I hope this result is a wake up call that the country is divided and unhappy with how things currently are

Would you say that voters are feeling the effects? Last Thursday says a resounding no.

I had to put my phone down last night. A far left "friend" was actually quoting the bible on SM. The whole "lord forgive them, they know not what they do". And it wasn't tongue in cheek, she was serious. There's something seriously wrong with these people.

Wow. Fanatical.

I said to my brother that the results show the country is disillusioned and whilst I wouldn’t vote reform I can see why people have. His response was ‘they are all racists’. I just agreed with him, I don’t want to argue with my family. I honestly think it’s too easy to call all reform voters racists.

Sorry to hear that - although every time the R card is played wrongly, it simply risks driving another voter to Reform, or reinforcing their reasons for supporting Reform, in the first place.

It’s difficult because looking at it purely objectively, you are twice as likely to support Reform if not tertiary educated. Areas with wider support for Reform (and the far right) are often those with large swathes of the population having no qualifications at all. I’m looking into this as part of my research at the minute so can tell you in areas of South Yorkshire, for example, which have turned towards Reform, 1 in 4 people don’t have GCSEs.

Having said that, Reform also seem popular with some wealthy former tories, business owners and retirees so there is a mix in there and it’s unfair to say they’re all uneducated. I also hate the classism present throughout. It’s always middle class people on their high horses whinging about the ‘stupid working class’ being ignorant and illiterate. They’re clearly disenfranchised and who can blame them to be frank, I think many of us feel that way right now.

What I am a little surprised at (maybe) is how quickly folk have turned against Labour when they’ve actually done quite a lot for the poorest in society.

Not all reform voters are racist, but certainly a large number of them are, including their leader whilst at school. I’m prepared to believe that racism isn’t the main driving force for some voters, but the fact remains that those non-racist voters don’t seem to be too bothered by the racist ones.

How many times on here do we read about stag dos and bad male behaviour in a poster’s husband’s friend group and we get the comment, well, if that’s what his friends are like, what do you think he’s like when you’re not there?

Why does the same not apply to reform voters? Why are they not worried that they’re voting in racists all over the country?

I have not looked too closely at the data, but I believe that those areas voting for Reform are relatively closely correlated with the pro-Brexit vote.

In short - Brexit fault lines remain.

For the sake of balance, do you apply the same logic to the Green Party?
I am not being provocative - just curious if people draw the same conclusion.

If that is true of Reform then it must be true of the Green party too?

There have been many examples of overt racism from their electoral candidates - and some of these were not removed from position by the Green leadership ahead of the elections.

So what does it say of the "fellow travellers" who will vote Green - not personally antisemitic but prepared to ignore antisemitism in others?

Yes this is true. Leave areas like much of South Yorkshire, North East, Essex, parts of Lancashire etc did disproportionately vote Reform. Remain areas have turned towards Lib Dem or Green, if not Labour. As with this, though, education alone didn’t explain Brexit. More rural areas and a lack of overall exposure to diversity swung it plus older people were also more inclined to vote Brexit. Weirdly, this may also be because in the 70s during the first referendum lefties voted to leave. Swathes of Labour, for example, were eurosceptic - more so than tories (Thatcher initially loved the EEC).

Having said all of this, Brexit was a bit more complex. The notion of a binary referendum doesn’t sit well with me generally. There was far too much misinformation around. euroscepticism only really came around again thanks to Nige, I don’t think many people worried about the EU in day to day life before.

Thanks - also curious to know the answer.

It’s fine to recognise voting patterns and demographics but as often seen on here the language on mn belies a sense of superiority, which is misplaced. Whether that be something like ill-informed, or even uneducated, or just flat out thick, it’s a value laden judgement.

To put thus to the test ask the same (usually mc tertiary educated person) what they think of someone working in Tesco, a carer or Angela Rayner and they’ll bristle at the snobbery if the same terminology is used.

There are threads in here showing pretty much this.

I also don’t think they are ‘thick’ but there’s running narratives which they are less likely to be corrected by.

To be honest, I find The Greens the same " Tax the billionnaires". Just not the millionaires, because that's me/my parents. They are more or less the same people who are natural Labour supporters- the affluent middle classes, or more now, their children. Just as the Hard Right of the Tories has moved to Reform, the Hard Left of Labour has moved to the Greens. They are as patronising as they always were.

I agree with you, but I can’t think of any party that has ever improved much in recent years. 🤷‍♀️

They are full of promises, but their promises are like pie crusts - always get broken.

Have you heard of Glenn Gibbons? The good people of Sunderland just voted him in as a Reform councillor. He suggested on social media that Nigerians should be melted down and used to fill potholes. And yet Reform supporters still voted for him. With that level of discourse. I thought Farage was supposed to have weeded out the 'obviously' racist candidates. If Reform get in to national government we are well and truly stuffed.

Maybe it is the threads I click on but all I have read recently on mumsnet is how much everyone dislikes Labour and Labour voters.

I see being left wing being hurled around as an insult on here.

Great post op. It’s always been like that on here. It’s an attempt to shut people down and put them back in their box.

As a working class usually Labour voter (but not this time), I find it all very sad. Labour had a massive chance to change things for ordinary people. It would have taken time, but I think people would have been patient.

Farage saw his chance in August 2024 to really stir the pot, and that was the start of the real rise of his party. How anyone can vote for Reform is beyond me. For the record I wouldn't vote Green either, unless it was to keep Reform out.

@RampantIvy we are all snivelling something or others according to one thread!

@Pippin2017 yes, repulsive. Yet some Tories would be happy to make a deal with Reform.

Yes I’ve heard of him recently and it’s crazy to me that Farage didn’t sack him from the party at the time those comments first came to light.

I feel the public should make it clear we won’t tolerate racism in any form from political candidates. I hope Farage gets forced to belatedly sack him now.