To think the main Mumsnet demographic are out of touch politically

[Veiledveritas]

Reform.are smashing the polls yet any Reform voter is despised and ridiculed on here.

Same.

This in spades. ^ Many people who support Reform don't speak up on here, lest they be accused of being thick, racist, bigoted, homophobic, badly educated, gammon, flag shagger, etc.... The list of the insults and put downs that come from the 'left' is endless..

The left seem incapable of a decent debate, and don't want to listen to the reasons WHY people are voting for REFORM, they're too busy shouting people down and calling them stupid and racist, and laughing at them. 4 or 5 posters usually join in too, and it's uncomortable to witness when a pile on occurs.

If people DO post to explain why they are voting for Reform, or why they think others may be doing so, they still get laughed at and ridiculed, with the 'tell us you're a thick racist without telling us you're a thick racist!' type of comment, and the usual 😂emoji. None of the left ever say 'hmmm, I hear what you're saying poster, but I really wouldn't vote for Reform, and this is why.........'

I have no idea why the left always hurl insults and nasty remarks. It does no good whatsoever, as people know they're not badly educated and racist just because they are voting Reform, (maybe a small minority are but not all.) Hurling insults, laughing at, and ridiculing people who vote for Reform, causes further division, and doesn't stop people voting for them.

Disclaimer I have never voted for Reform, and don't particularly want them in power, but IMO it would be worse if The Greens got in power! 😱

Oh, and to the OP @Veiledveritas YANBU.

p.s. I am not responding to ANYone on 'the left' who addresses my post here - (if anyone does,) as I CBA to get into an argument, as the left are impossible to talk to on here..... I do wonder if they are like this in real life... and talk to people how they talk to some people here in the real world....... (calling people thick, racist, and badly educated if they don't agree with their left-wing politics, and say they may be voting for Reform.........) 🤔

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Do you think Reform’s policies will deliver better outcomes for their voters?

Completely agree with this.

I don’t really have the time or inclination to explain obvious things to obtuse people.

People who vote reform are thick as mince or bigots. They also believe pencils are in polling stations so ‘they can rub your votes out’. Just my opinion. Which I’m perfectly entitled to.

I mean for sure OP is correct. I'm sure you likely saw the exact same thing in e.g the run up to Brexit, or Jeremy Corbyn. 'The left' are loud in a few specific communities, & I guess this is one.

I used to be right wing and “woke up” when I saw how far right leaders were acting, especially Trump. Even when I was right wing, Farage gave me the ick. He isn’t the right option moving forward. We are heading down a dangerous path if we vote Reform in the GE.

it doesn't explain the population rise at all.

Longer life expectancy helped prop up the small natural-change component of population growth for part of the last 20 years, but it is not a major reason in any way. The overwhelming cause remains high net international migration. Further the longevity effect is now fading as the population ages and births stay low. According to the latest official ONS projections (28 April 2026), deaths are projected to outnumber births in the UK every year from mid-2026 onwards. This is a clear “demographic turning point” - the UK’s existing population is no longer replacing itself through births. All future population growth will come entirely from net international migration.

The UK's population in mid 2005 was around 60.4 million.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/populationestimates/timeseries/ukpop/pop

Mid 2024 the latest ONS estimate was 69.3 million
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/populationestimates/bulletins/annualmidyearpopulationestimates/mid2024

An increase of around 8.9 million.

According to the University of Oxford based COMPAS (Google them they are considered highly reputable and independent)

“More than half (65%) of the increase in the UK population between 2004 and 2023 was due to the direct contribution of net migration. […] Natural change […] fell into negative territory in 2023. As a result, net migration has accounted for 98% of population growth since 2020.”

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-impact-of-migration-on-uk-population-growth/

So immigration accounts for some 65% of total growth 2004–2020 and an astounding 98% since 2020. (so the longevity affect impacts only the 35% of growth and then 2%)

You can also go straight to the raw ONS data if you want to verify it yourself
Latest UK-wide bulletin: Population estimates for the UK, mid-2024
Downloadable datasets: Search for “components of population change” on the ONS website.

I don't know where they get these embarrassing tropes. The "working class" vote this way, the "middle class" votes this way. Move on 😂

Oh ok, well I guess in that case the poster is at least trying to engage even if what they say isn't very relevant.

I was wondering more about situations like the CEO of Starbucks who rather neatly is paid 6,666 times the average earnings of an Starbucks employee. Without him, they wouldn't have their job but without them, he wouldn't have his job. So why is the profit shared so unequally?

(I know you're not arguing with me here but I'm not sure the pp will come back to answer so I thought I'd put it out there anyway because it's an interesting question!)

It’d the same here in Scotland either people both for SNP. I work for an English finance company. I could choose to hop to England at the drop of a hat and my company would accommodate it. If I wanted to stay they’d be happy to pay me via GBP. It’s the public sector workers and those on benefits that would see their income drastically slashed. And yet they’re more likely to suck up the SNPs nonsense. madness.

But the ageing population puts a very significant strain on the NHS.

Clearly, you are evidently a very busy person.

One thing a lot of public sector workers fail to understand is the laws of supply and demand in the private sector jobs market. I’m not in a union because if I don’t like my terms and conditions I’ll get a new job thanks. I get paid what my skills are worth. Same at Starbucks. The CEO is paid the value of their skills. The barista too. If the barista left the company could hire another person on the same low wage.

my sibling works for a university and is always whining about not getting a ‘real terms’ pay rise etc, but if you’re a specialist in 14th century poetry then your skills are hardly in demand in another sector so why would a uni - that is haemorrhaging money - pay you more?

Nobody will admit to voting Reform on MN but I suspect there are loads. Plus, honestly, MN is not a true reflection of real life in many, many ways.

I must be in some parallel universe -our tax income does not cover our outgoings or interest payments on loans -how don’t you know this look up google

The problem with Reform voters is that they are voting for such an obviously odious bunch of hypocritical grifters with no clear policies apart from attacking the poor and minorities, that it's difficult to ascertain WHY they are voting in such a way, and they certainly can't explain it without mumbling something about immigration that is such a huge issue NO party can solve it without the cooperation of the EU, which we are no longer part of.

Protest vote doesn't cover it. Just don't vote at all if you can think of doing is voting for such a nasty set of incompetent, self interested characters.

I also don't think it's a minority that are thick and racist, in my experience of listening to them and reading their posts on social media, that is EXACTLY what they are. It's a huge majority.

People can vote as they wish; if they want to be shilled by Farage and Dubai Tice, then they should own it, not bleat about being misunderstood.

As for Mumsnet, I think it's quite RW to be honest; the sneering at lower class public figures, the pearl clutching at having to pay tax like the commoners etc.

It's quite laughable to suggest otherwise.

I’m so disappointed in people choosing Reform but understand that this is their vote and political freedom is important. I can but hope England is using the local elections as a protest vote. I understand that the electorate probably feels misled and disappointed in their current politicians.

I’m Scottish. I hope we have no Reform MSPs but am preparing myself for there to be one or two.

I'm not sure we understand one another's point here. Are you arguing that being an integral part of a profit making entity holds little intrinsic value? That value isn't normative? That people selling their labour don't deserve to be paid a living wage or one that keeps up with inflation depending on what that labour involves? That public sector workers lack intelligence?

My point, it has to be said, isn't complex. I'm questioning norms and values in advanced capitalist societies. That's all.

I see your reading comprehension matches your political acumen.

That isn't robust evidence which suggests a case for welfare retrenchment though.

This belief in an absolute law of supply and demand ignores social factors.
Most top jobs are given to "people who look and sound like us".
There is a very good reason that the phrase 'old boys club' exists.

The CEO is not paid the value of their skills. They are paid what a small, elite, self-interested group deem the value of their mutual skills and 'worth' as a social type.

Thank you, that's kind.

I have seen comments over the years here of some very very deluded women who claim to be professional women, etc etc

no wonder the cliche you cannot trust what people post on anonymous forums about their real lives is true. But as we say: through their acts you shall know them, usually one's mental content shared in a written passage reveals things also