to want to carry on working so I do not end up doing childcare?

[skizz]

I mentioned to my DC that I was thinking about retiring, just exploring options, nothing even decided yet. Their immediate response was along the lines of “oh that would be perfect, you could help with childcare, school pickups, when they are ill, that sort of thing.”

I actually do not want to give up work and slide into being on-call childcare. I like working. I like having my own routine, my own space and my own independence. The idea that any flexibility automatically gets translated into availability for childcare does not appeal to me whatsoever.

I have friends who do regular childcare for their grandchildren and honestly they are constantly picking up bugs, dealing with sickness, plans being cancelled last minute because a child is ill. It looks absolutely exhausting. It is not how they imagined retirement but they got railroaded into it by their daughters/DILs.

I would rather keep working than be doing childcare.

Wonder who would look after these kids if all these pesky women just 'stayed out of it'.

It's a rare privilege to be able to just decide not to get involved in childcare arrangements, and not one that women tend to benefit from (until they reach grandparenting age, ideally).

But if you have not challenged the narrative that it's women who are railroading their parents/in-laws into childcare, without pointing out that the men are doing exactly the same, but by proxy, then you are actively contributing to the mismatched expectations between men and women. 🤷

I think you need to have a clear word with your DC about this, and their assumptions. You will know how best to word it with them of course.

But whilst making clear you love both them and your DGC, also make clear that if you gave up work it would be to well, stop working! To have freedom.

You might be happy to help in the odd emergency (that wasn’t illness related) but nothing regular, expected or tied down. Just asked as a favour now and then. And of course you will continue to enjoy seeing them with their parents around too.

What you won’t be is an unpaid after school nanny/ au pair, so they need to get that expectation out of their head!

Edit. - I do agree about the blaming Dds and DILs, whilst saying nothing about sons and SILs though. It’s both parents railroading the grandparents in these cases, not just the mothers of the children. Even if the men are doing it by proxy!

OP, yanbu.
Push back.
I know quite a few who got caught and have said they swapped the work clock for the expectations of their children clock.

Keep your business to yourself.
Reduce your hours and say nothing.

Honestly I cannot get over the entitled expectations from some children.

I really think you need to stop sharing and push back.
If you give to one, you have to give for all, so have your head straight.

You have 4 married children with grandchildren?

You could be on their clock for the week, always running and dropping.

Screw that is my response.

Oh and booking regularl trips away, anywhere is a good way to start, to kill any expectations.

Talk about all the travel you intend to do now that you are final free.

Just say no. When I was pregnant my mum was v clear that she wasn’t interested in helping and that it was my responsibility to sort childcare.

Thankfully I’m a higher earner so I paid for nursery. The cost was eye watering but we got by. I don’t know know how people with normal jobs do it though.

I made sure to never ask for any help whatsoever and ran myself into the ground trying to juggle around fixed nursery hours, a big job and DH’s unfixed shifts. It was hell. I quit and went freelance in the end and we got through it.

Interestingly as the kids have got older my mum has begun to want to spend more time with them and has offered to look after them. She does it ad hoc if there’s a pinch point in our schedules and now really enjoys it. I think she was so worried about being put upon that it took her awhile to realise seeing her grandchildren might actually be enjoyable now and again!

My daughters always knew that I wanted to travel more, and was looking forward to retiring and taking advantage of cheap fares and holidaying in term time. So when my DD became pregnant, she was the one who said to me, spontaneously, that she would not be asking for any childcare from me, and that it was their decision to have a child, and their responsibility.

So I travel a lot, but step in and have my DGCs when DD and son in law have shift clashes, and now the eldest is in school, cover training days. That's my choice because I like having them to myself occasionally. But my DD still doesn't expect me to do that.

But having nothing else to do with my freedom other than childcare would depress me. There's a whole world out there.

So being brought up by (presumably) lovely parents all your life, having a nice childhood, being looked after well, all the school runs, clubs, birthday parties, holidays, days out, cleaning your grazed knee, hugging during a nightmare, help through college, through uni, putting cash towards driving lessons, towards wedding, if lucky, towards a first house, cared for lovingly throughout your life means....

.....absolutely nothing because people don't wish to do childcare? So the treat how you want to be treated throughout a parents live is void once the GC are here?

OK!

And yes, I think most grandparents are happy to babysit on occasion for the record and that's absolutely lovely and spot on but thats different to the level of childcare that is happening up and down the country, every day.

My parents actually want a relationship with their grandchildren though, and enjoy spending time with them.

How the fuck is this also emotional manipulation? Give it a rest. It’s the truth of my situation.

Vastly different in occasional babysitting, fun days out as families, popping around to see the family, where there still can be a relationship, just as you have found in your family.

No, you still don’t get it.

My parents aren’t joining me on days out. They aren’t sitting around waiting on me to visit to facilitate a relationship. As I said, they actually want a relationship with their grandchildren though, and enjoy spending time with them. And so they do. Without me. I just don’t rely on a regular arrangement in order that I can work. This is also childcare.

Perfectly put

The idea that you can't have a relationship with your grandchildren outside of providing childcare, or if you don't do childcare, is ridiculous.

Are you saying then, that parents are owed help in their old age from their children, regardless of whether the adult child wants to provide it or not.

It's babysitting.

Childcare is more commonly used as in paid childcare, long term childcare, not popping by time to time to spend a few hours ad hock with the grandkids.

I wouldn't call inviting my grandkids round for the day or taking them out, just for the fun of it, childcare. That's just being Grandma hanging out with my grandkids.

Childcare is done out of necessity to allow parents to work etc, and is usually regular and a commitment..

Just say no then.

That’s what everyone’s been telling you so why are you still moaning? It’s a very simple solution.

Of course not. If they don't want to, they don't have to and the older person should have planned better. (sarcasm).

It seems from many threads that they are only owed the consideration of possible help and care if they do provide childcare. Otherwise they can't expect anything. However, I expect the reality is that they will provide childcare and the adult child will then say, when they need help, "Oh, but I have to help my kids with xyz and am working and tired and can't help." Watch it become optional no matter how much childcare was done because it will be 'different'.

They're not owed anything. But threats not to support them to a degree in old age, because they didn't do childcare, are not the actions of people who care about the parents who brought them up.

You would think, right.

But many people do consider that to be childcare.

And all the studies into how much childcare is provided by grandparents include “hanging out” with your grandchildren, and occasional babysitting, as childcare.

No, I am saying that if a child is brought up well, in a loving and respectful way, the family unit should want naturally to look out for their parents in their elderly years, regardless of how much childcare provided to the grandparents. Because they love them.

To hear so many people say that their own parents - yes, their own parents would not be considered as much as if they had not provided childcare to GC is blackmail, manipulation and it's an appalling attitude. I could never ever have lived with myself had I not taken my parents to hospital appointments, spent time with mum when she was dying of cancer, helping even though we lived 100's of miles apart. She was my mum. She'd been loving growing up, I wanted to be there for her. It wasn't dependant on how much she did for me as an adult (very little actually), it wasn't transactional, it was respect.

What rubbish. Parents have raised the children already but how dare you not use your retirement to look after your grandkids as well???

And that's the veiled threat that pressures mostly women to continue to provide childcare after raising their children and decades of working hard, if you don't provide free childcare we will keep the children away from you and not visit you.

There's a difference between helping you once in a while, giving parents a break etc but many now expect committed regular weekly care.

Utter rubbish. She has contributed by raising her 4 children while working hard all her life. But if she doesn't commit to use her retirement to raise your children then she has not contributed and you wouldn't visit or care for her.

What a selfish manipulative perspective.

This really stood out to me, as well.

If my children have that attitude they will be less part of my life and less helped by me in other ways too. I don't need people in my life, even if my children, who are only interested in me because of what I can do for them. Any attitude like that and I'll be spending my time, money and energy on real friends and whatever I want.

So what was your response when your kids starting talking about how you’d be able to help with childcare? What did you say to the people actually involved? What is it about that relationship that means you seek the validation of strangers online rather than have a productive conversation where you set boundaries and also show concern and care for their current struggles? How do you think the relationship got into the state where that kind of conversation is not natural to you all?

And you know thats perfect. If the parent know your willing to do Tuesdays, or maybe Wednesdays then fantastic.

But you know what DMum does Thursdays in school holidays. I know she looks forward to it, but I also know 1 day is enough for her.

You don't have to have a tragically fucked-up relationship with your children not to make an immediate response.
I haven't noticed the OP seeking validation in her posts.

Obviously putting a thread up on AIBU is always problematic as its nature implies a question rather than the utter certainty evinced by the OP.

It just seems like such a non problem

”I’m thinking of retiring”
”Awesome you can help us with childcare!”
”Oh! I was thinking more along the lines of taking a luxury cruise and then getting myself a puppy! I’ll need a total break before I can even think about taking on any new regular commitments. But are you all okay? I thought the kids enjoyed after school club?”
…

Honestly yeah it does feel like something else is going on if that level of conversation is out of reach.