To suspect police are worried about vigilantes - Epsom attack

[ReadingCrimeFiction]

I live relatively close to Epsom and so this appalling assault is all over my news feeds and social media.

BBC News - Town left in shock by appalling rape outside church
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8dl5yevjg9o

The police have asked for witnesses but no descriptions have been given. Cue lots of very disturbing posts and comments from people who very clearly think these men are not white.

I can think of half a dozen scenarios where this is not being disclosed but, based on the comments, I think it all comes down to fears that local communities will take it on themselves to "apprehend" anyone who even vaguely looks like the perpetrators? And while the comments I am seeing are mostly white people being disgusting in their assumptions about brown and black people, i can imagine police would he equally concerned if, for example, the woman was Asian or Black and her attackers were white.

Is this where we are at? Where people make horrible racist assumptions and/or where police have to worry about how they will protect the broader community if they give any details of criminals?

I'm from Epsom. I grew up there. I gave birth to my first child there. My parents still live there. I had to call them and warn them not to go into town yesterday evening because of the aggressive atmosphere being created by a bunch of racists. I watched the feed - full if F this, see you next Tuesday, Keir Starmer is a W*er. At one point there were chants of "who raped the girl". The atmosphere was absolutely awful on the live feed last night. Had I been in town with my children, I would have swiftly moved away due to fear for our safety. Many of the people there weren't even from Epsom. Those there didn't seem to have an ounce Of intelligence or critical thinking skills. They didn't represent the vast majority of Epsom residents who are law abiding and happy to let the police do their job.

The attackers may be immigrants. They may not be. It's up to the police or to investigate. The most ridiculous thing I read was they are clearly immigrants because someone told someone else they were wearing flip flops and no British person would wear flip flops at this time of year!

I have been searching for a video I watched a while back that explained my thoughts rather well. There is a difference between being English and being British.

The poster upthread wants to be sure we understand that the Child being born in England is the Top Trump card in the Southport conversation. I think there’s more nuance involved and it’s easier to watch two people discuss it than it is to try and write what I mean.

Clearly.

It's all a big conspiracy. My Google is censoring me!

Still no screenshot though 🤭

What do you need a screenshot of?

Btw, are you in the UK?

I've given you two screenshots. How many would you like?

The accusation was it was ‘my Google’ as opposed to Google. I suggested the poster show me her first page with the question I was trying to find the answer to and seemingly I was a conspiracy theorist. I thought it was interesting.

Well another one as I’ve obviously missed the first two.

Here's one from me if that helps. Are you in the UK?

If a woman was raped by 3 men in your town wouldn't you want at least a description of what these men look like?

If the police don't release even basic description people will read into that. This is easily avoided by the police making a description of the perpetrators public.

I don't believe this at all. I just believe that a significant proportion of white British men have vile views on women too, and that those men are overrepresented in the men protesting now.

I think, cultural differences aside, it's reasonable to assume people who have been through the level of trauma that means they need asylum are going to be more likely to commit crime. I also know that there are very dangerous attitudes about unaccompanied women in some cultures. I'd be really happy to see an intelligent action plan to address that.

However, the situation we are in now is that large mobs of men are demanding someone else's traumatic rape is managed to their timeline and, because it isn't, they are creating loud, aggressive situations which feel unsafe for women and girls. To serve an explicitly racist agenda - because 1% of women are raped and none of these men cared before.

Tom cats behave instinctively. The difference between them.and humans is that humans can stop themselves from doing it. Cats can't

I said the first page of Google results not the Ai version. What links to news articles does it give you?

No one wanted migration at these levels, millions over the last 20 years we weren't given a 'choice' . It is absolutely wrong that this ladies family have been questioned by strangers about their immigration status of course but don't pretend it's not the government's fault (Tony Blair specifically but successive governments did nothing to address the issue).

I can't work out if you're posting in good faith or not.

It isn't a question of what "makes Men of a culture not rapey" or the rest you witter on about.

Given that men are the sex that commit rape and crimes of violence against women and girls (and boys it should be added) the real question is why should the UK government allow men - from cultures that specifically denigrate women and condone the abuse of women as acceptable - to be welcomed here as asylum seekers or illegal migrants without adequate background checks as to their history.

Reading what you write I think you would rank a white, British, middle-aged racist (male or female) as being of less value or being less "virtuous" than an asylum seeking non-white non-British rapist

[Edit - if British men go abroad they should conform to the accepted customs and laws of the country they are visiting - or have emigrated to - and if they commit sex or other crimes in that country then they should face whatever the prescribed punishments in those countries are. They should not get special treatment or have special excuses - just as male asylum seekers and illegal immigrants to the UK should not get special treatment or have special excuses in the UK.]

Are you serious? Comparing US to Afghanistan?! Book a weeks holiday wearing shorts and t shirt to both and let's see where you feel most safe. 🤔

Would you answer my question first? Are you in the UK?

Actually we were given a choice. The public have actively voted against unfettered migration for years by voting for election pledges and the problem has worsened. The referendum is widely publicised to have been a protest vote against immigration and so we got more of it and no doubt Farage will also get in based on nonsense election pledges and nothing will change.

The electorate absolutely have an appetite to control migration but the politicians have failed to implement any policies that have teeth in that area.

I don’t take instructions from randoms on the internet im afraid.

You know the vast majority of rapists in the UK are white? White men are perfectly capable of raping women in the country they were born in. The nonsense about black and brown people coming from cultures that treat women badly suggests all non British born black and brown men are liable to rape. If that's the case why aren't there actually MORE rapes by black and brown immigrants in the UK? There's literally hundreds of thousands of them so why are they not all committing rape?

Oh yeah. It's because men commit rape and their ethnicity is a red herring stirring up shit by racists.

Ha. You, a random on the internet, just gave me instructions.

Anyway reason I ask is

a) Google results might vary depending on the country you are googling from

b) you seem to think the capital city of Wales is in England.

Why would you "hope" they are white British people?

Your "hope" sounds racist.

Because the vast majority of men here are white.

Ethnicity is probably a red herring (in that a black or brown British man may be less likely to rape than a black or brown man from a more misogynistic country), but culture isn’t. Otherwise why are some countries far more misogynistic than others? Who is doing the oppressing, if not the men from those places?

How far back do you want to go with that? Grandparents, great grandparents, great great grandparents? How long does somebody's family need to have been living in the UK?

And given he'd have had major issues whatever country he grew up in, what you're really saying is that it's worse that it was British children.