Another child killed by a dog...

[tnorfotkcab]

Another poor child is killed by a dog.... We already know this is an XL Bully, don't even have to wait for confirmation.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce35zkl9dg3o

Both are bully breeds no? With a genetic background of being bred for fighting.

Yes, historically, many of the dog breeds referred to as “bully breeds” were indeed bred for fighting, but it’s important to recognize that this was only part of their history, and these breeds are much more diverse in their temperaments today due to responsible breeding practices.

Some of the most well-known bully breeds include:

• Pit Bull Terriers
• American Bulldogs
• Bull Terriers
• Staffordshire Bull Terriers
• Rottweilers (though not always considered “bully breeds,” they share a similar history)

History of Bully Breeds:

• Pit Bulls, for example, were originally bred in the 19th century in England for bull-baiting, a cruel sport where dogs were made to attack a bull. After bull-baiting was outlawed in England, these dogs were used in other forms of dog fighting.
• American Bulldogs and Staffordshire Bull Terriers also have historical ties to dog fighting and were bred to be strong, courageous, and determined in a fight.

Imagine if the ‘responsible breeding’ was rewound by some irresponsible breeding practices that used a massive, nasty, reactive male dog as the starting point. Imagine if you then marketed that as a criminals dream and then imagine if a load of low IQed males thought those dogs made good family pets. I wonder what would happen then 🤔

I think the point is a child is dead is it not?

Should we just ignore it when children die unnecessarily because we shouldn't use child deaths to talk about uncomfortable topics?

From the Mirror link above about the Redcar attack:

Another witness said one of the dogs was "running up and down the street" and was a grey and white "pocket bully type"

What is a pocket bully? Is that just a puppy XL bully? Are there other smaller fighting dog breeds that have emerged since the XL bully ban?

I agree. I love dogs generally but this breed is so highly dangerous that we cannot have them in a safe society.
If they aren't to be called completely, then we need much, much heavier restrictions with heavier penalties and they must be enforced. For e.g. they should never be allowed anywhere near children and anyone not muzzling or securing their dog should face charges of reckless endangerment.
But frankly, culling is the kinder option. Anyone who still owns one of these dogs is a dangerous idiot

It’s not a game. I just asked you a simple question, which you can’t answer, because you know that the result of logging/reporting the dog leads to fuck all.
The owner gets a visit from someone in a uniform. Big fucking deal.

As i said.

Anyone who has tried to ring 101 in the last few years knows you can't get through to them - the last time I tried I was on hold for 25 minutes to a message saying 'you might prefer to report your crime online' until I gave up and reported it online. It wasn't until the next day that I got a phone call from the officer saying that unless I had taken a picture of the person who had tried to steal my phone and assaulted me in the process, they wouldn't be passing the information to the neighbourhood policing team and it would, in effect, be closed. Although they 'never 'really close cases that are unsolved' I was advise. My arse.

Some peoples ignorance never ceases to amaze me.
I work in a vets so you can imagine we saw quite a lot of them at the time of the new rules, i thought it seemed quite well organised and sensible - if sensible is a word that can be used in this context .
That aside i am quite certain that there are far too many of them for the rules to have much of an impact as there are not enough police/ officials available to police them and their owners.
I think they are terrifying and during the work we did at that time we were all fully aware of how vulnerable we all were and pretty helpless if one was to 'flip'.
The size of some of their heads was huge and being up close you can clearly see how people literally get torn limb from limb by them.
I can't imagine what is left of a child in these circumstances.
There is no place in society for these dogs and other similar breed
'replacements'.

Cull all bull breeds. Yes, all of them.

Spaniels and labs are more popular so probably would account for more bites however think about it, it’s rare for those dogs to kill anyone, an XL bully can kill a fully grown adult!

No, it's necessary. It would be grim and disgraceful to let one more child die because people are frightened to have a frank discussion about the stupidity of what we are doing as a society.

awful awful news, it seems to happen all too often. I’ve heard of a story in the last week where an XL attacked and killed a smaller dog unprovoked, it had escaped from the house and went for the smaller dog who was with owner! When a child/adult/dog gets killed it’s nearly always a bully breed!

Ahh yes because there are constant stories of American bulldogs, British bulldogs, English bull terriers and French bulldogs killing people 🙄🙄

Yep. Six poor people a year isn't going to force a cull. Pisses me right off.

The first middle class kid that dies and parliament will be on the warpath. Legislation will be passed in weeks.

Ridiculous. Educate yourself.

No thanks.

@Lemonfrost the park is enormous and operates as a cut through, they were using the footpaths. If I reported it to anyone they would have been no one there by the time they arrived.

It is incredibly difficult for anyone to enforce the laws around these dogs as they are obviously mobile and potentially deadly to approach. If someone was having a BBQ in a park where they weren't supposed to I would feel comfortable to approach and politely let them know it wasn't allowed there. I would not feel safe to do that with someone who had an unmuzzled dangerous dog.

I am not sure of the point are you trying to make?

I've been knocked over by a lab. The same dog also picked up baby rabbits in his mouth and safely put them down to run away. My friend's Jack Russell terrier was lethal to rabbits. It's what they were bred for. The issue with XL bullies and similar dogs is they were bred to be aggressive. They are so strong and heavy that most humans cannot fight one off. Even if chihuahua attacks are 1000 times more prevalent, fewer will be fatal.

Perhaps instead of people on this thread using it to advance their own agenda, they could focus on the horrible fact a child died in appalling circumstances. But that would probably require a level of emotional intelligence and selflessness that is impossible to find on Mumsnet.

How is a dead child the starting point of a AIBU thread? Disgraceful.

Sorry what? So how is the conversation (if you deign to allow us to have one at all) supposed to go?

'A child has been killed by a dangerous dog';
'Yes it's awful isn't it, but whatever we do we mustn't discuss any possible changes that we might make off the back of this horrific incident to prevent it happening again, we must all just agree it's horrible and leave it at that. We wouldn't want to be seen to be pushing an 'agenda' of...not having more kids mauled to death. That would be insensitive'.

Well bollocks to that. Were you saying we shouldn't be talking about gun law reform after Dunblane? Or police reform after Sarah Everard?

Says it all.

The arrogance of your comments is quite something. You have no idea of what I do or don't know about this.

People get dogs without realising how much work they are . We have had a fair share of big breed Rottweilers, Doberman’s and a few smaller ones . The time we waste training them the first 18 months is huge , as a result we always have balanced dogs and nil issues , we promote what the breed is behaviour wise and we train accordingly . People getting XL bullies are not only getting a breed that has a strong aggressive gene pool but they are not the people with money , time and patience to train them . That’s why we are seeing so many deaths .

I thought these feral murder pub dogs had already been banned?

Rubbish. If the 'agenda' is to prevent further children, or anyone, being killed by vicious dogs, it would be disgraceful not to discuss it.

You can hardly blame her for assuming you don't know when you refuse to answer and refer her to "the internet" 🤣

Firstly, 101 response times are currently far less than 25 mins in several areas. Secondly, you could report concerns using your relevant police teams live chat, (but you already know that), or attend one of the community events that police regularly host. Alternatively, you could send an email, contact the council, write to your MP or do numerous other things - including informing your local PCC. In fact, in the time you have taken to contribute to this thread you could have done any of these things.