Another child killed by a dog...

[tnorfotkcab]

Another poor child is killed by a dog.... We already know this is an XL Bully, don't even have to wait for confirmation.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce35zkl9dg3o

XL bullies literally are bad dogs regardless of owner as every single one regardless of how well it’s trained or not etc has the genetic predisposition to suddenly snap and kill.

The government are excellent at ignoring their noise over every other issue, I don’t think they won’t deal with it because of that. I don’t think they have the appetite to be considered animal killers and have all of the animal rights people after them.

BBC News has just announced that the victim was a 3 month old baby girl.

2 dogs have been destroyed.

I totally agree with this. Any dog, in stressful situations, may bit and show aggression, usually through fear. But the simple fact is that breed characteristics are key. In a freeze, fight or flight situation, certain dogs are only ever going to fight, or attack. They will revert to type and behave in the way their genes and breed heritage would expect them to. No matter how well trained, how well socialised, how well handled by someone who knows what they are doing, a big powerful dog designed to bring down a boar or fight to the death, or guard fearlessly is always going to be a risker choice than say, a soft mouthed retrieving dog, or a little terrier that might well gobby and feisty, but is too small to do any serious harm.

I'll never understand what goes through people's minds when they look at the character traits of a big, strong dog whose breed was developed specifically for bravery, aggression or fighting and say 'yep, that's the perfect dog to bring into my home with two toddlers. Don't worry, I'll train it to make sure it's not aggressive.'

Why not just choose a dog with absolutely no reputation for, or breed history of aggression in the first place? It's not as if there aren't hundreds of other breeds to choose from, is it?

XL bullies are not bad, any more than tigers are bad. They are powerful and dangerous predatory animals and as such they ought not to be kept as domestic pets.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cy915wr1074o

That poor little girl and her parents. Allowing this to go on is disgraceful. These are preventable deaths.

I’ve always had bull terriers they make lovely dogs .. mine have always been big and daft .. saying that I would not leave them alone with a child but then again I wouldn’t leave any dog alone with a child .

Couldn’t agree more with your whole post.

Even IF it's the owner's fault when a dog mauls or kills someone, so what? Apportioning blame doesn't change the outcome or bring the person back

Exactly, it’s just meaningless. I mean I don’t think it’s any comfort or help to the dying victims or their family to say ah it’s not the dog it’s the owner”.

End of the day we will always have some bad owners so we must remove the option for anyone to own dogs that easily kill just because they have a bad owner. It’s for the same reason most of Europe is against widespread gun ownership.

Will the parents be charged with the murder of the baby girl?

‘A 45-year-old man has been arrested on suspicion of being in charge of a dog dangerously out of control and causing injury resulting in death. He has been released on conditional bail.’

Im sure he is an upstanding pillar of the community.

I second this I’ve own bull terriers and they are lovely dogs ..

Companionship, love, exercise, because he needed a loving home, and we had one to offer him, because we have the time and experience a dog like that needs to thrive, and because he's adorable.

So you actively chose that breed over another dog that would equally need a home, and with that comes a weight of responsibility to protect the pubic from your massive dog. Hence why you keep it under good control with a harness. Excellent.

I don’t need any puppy photos to try and convince me it’s some poor, helpless thing. It’s what they grow up into that concerns me.

Exactly. How does change come about if people don’t discuss things? That poster has a very very weird take on things - of course it’s going to result in debate. That’s what humans do. Talk.

Out of interest, do you think you could control him if he were to turn? Are you faster than him? Can you restrain 40kg of angry dog?

Nobody could.
I love my little 10kg dog, but I would kick it into next week if it harmed a human.
This difference is it’s possible to do so, anything over 15kgs its just not.

Can you read??
OP’s words “We already know this is an XL Bully, don't even have to wait for confirmation” … yet it’s apparently NOT an XL Bully. That was the point of my post. Why not go challenge someone else but actually read first, it may help.

He's not an angry dog, but yes, I can control all 40kg of him when he's trying to bolt into a river to get away from a murder of crows. He learned the hard way that groups of crows are called a murder for a reason when he tried to befriend some as a puppy. I can also control him when he picks up the scent of his favourite person and tries to drag me to the shop she's working in.

That's what a head collar does. It is why the same design is used to control and lead 400kg plus horses.

Again, you only need to read any dog thread on MN to see that the majority of the UK public is utterly clueless about dogs and their management and behaviour.

Hmm, labs. Famous for mauling children, aren't they.

I'm not saying he's an angry dog inherently, I was talking about if he were to turn, and thus turn very angry very quickly. In your home for instance. In that situation you wouldn't have the head collar on, would you? So without the head collar, could you physically restrain him if he went for someone in your home?

so not an XL Bully. It's a staffy cross.

Why is this so difficult for some people to understand? These animals gave killed grown men and their own owners, for crying out loud. A vet I know initially rejected any idea of a cull but having dealt with quite a few in the practice now says they need to be culled.

Yes, yet another child killed. But the dog lobby doesn't care.

It could be an XL bully but any larger dog could kill a baby. In fact, a smaller one could, if it inflicted a wound which caused sepsis.

The law needs to be changed so that any dog attack is considered an attack by the owner and punished as such, not some wishy washy fine.

One of those ripped my sisters face off in the 80’s.
Had a fight with a rotwiener - and won.
Nanny dogs indeed

There is a distinct difference between the pet lines of e.g. Rottweilers and the lines which are bred to work. And there is a difference between a staff bred for the show ring and an XL bully bred to look, and be, as aggressive and intimidating as possible (and yes, I know that staffies are not the same as XLs, I'm just comparing two bull breeds).

And there are is a difference between high-drive dogs in capable hands, and high-drive dogs whose owners haven't got a clue.

People get XLs without either understanding or believing the warnings they are given. They lap up the 'it's the owner not the breed' BS. They don't fulfil the dog. Sometimes everything does swimmingly and everyone is happy and so is the dog. And occasionally it's a complete disaster.

What the answer is, I don't know.