16yo ds seeing much older man in London, ds1 has made it 100x worse, dont know what to do know

[kettleonbutnoidea]

i dont even know where to start tbh this has all come out in the last couple of weeks and i feel like im constantly on the back foot

my ds2 is 16 (17 in summer) and has been talking to someone online for a while which I DIDNT KNOW about until recently. turns out its a man in his 30s living in london. ds says they have “met a few times” which actually means hes been getting the train down there on his own. i only found this out because his brother saw messages on his phone

before anyone says yes ive had the talk about safety etc but hes insisting its all fine and that hes happy. says im making it weird and that age is just a number which hasnt exactly reassured me

then ds1 (22) completely lost it. tracked the man down online and basically messaged him threatening him. i dont know exactly what was said but it was bad enough that the man replied saying he’d go to the police if it carried on. now ds2 is furious with all of us, says weve embarrassed him and is barely speaking to me

since then hes even more secretive and has said hes going to stay in london “for a bit” over easter. i feel sick writing that but i dont know if i can physically stop him and im worried if i push too hard he’ll just go anyway and cut me off

im stuck between thinking this is completely wrong and also not wanting to drive him further away

AIBU to be this worried or do i need to back off a bit now its all blown up?

Unfortunately this is all useless, try reading LuciferTheMorningStar

post and then have a search yourself

He should be embarrassed. He’s a child running after a grown man. Contact the police.

He's 16 and being groomed by an adult man. Tell him in no uncertain terms that he's not going to London, or staying overnight anywhere until you're sure he's safely away from his person.

I can't imagine many people would allow their 16 year old daughter to travel to London to sleep with a man in his 30's. Your son is no less worthy of protection just because he's a boy.

Do you propose that OP locks him up?

Which hasn’t been mentioned by OP

Your DS1 has made things a lot worse. If DS2 is being groomed then he may cling to this man in an ‘us against the world’ way.

Is DS1 always so aggressive?

Do you know what legally constitutes child sexual exploitation? It's not 'having a sexual relationship with an older person'. There is no evidence he's being groomed into CSE. The OP would need more than just the fact of the man being older to get the police to investigate. If he's got new clothes, money, drugs with unexplained sources then yes, that's evidence. If he's got burner phones and starts disappearing at all hours and being found in certain hotspot areas then that's evidence suggestive of criminal exploitation. But just having sex with a dirty old man isn't exploitation in a legal, criminal sense

The absolute worry would be he could just pack a bag and leave at 16 no one can make him come home

I’d be shocked if she checked his messages and there was not a single indecent image which has been sent to this man by her 16 year old child. Of course he’s been sending images. Therefore by possessing those images the 30 odd year old man is breaking the law

My DSis was 16 and was in a similar situation. My parents did nothing and blamed her for being wild. They said, what can we do? I am pretty sure the repercussions of this stayed with her until she died (cancer at 26).

Please report and support your DS however you can, no matter how difficult it gets. Your DS needs you.

He’s a CHILD being groomed by a grown man twice his age.

Your job as a mother is to protect him, not worry that he will be upset that you ruined his “relationship”.

Nothing about this is normal and your 22 year old seems to have more common sense. You need to notify the police about this groomer and put an end to your son’s trips to London, he’s not an adult and can’t decide to travel on his own whenever he wants

That hasn't been the case for many years

No. But he’s already planning to go to London to be with this man because he feels attacked by his family.

If she reports this to the police, without any evidence of sexual exploitation, the likely outcome will be that the police will make a brief investigation and be happy with her son saying they are in a consensual relationship. He will then cut off his family.

The 30 year old man will be rubbing his grubby hands together. He wants OPs son to be completely reliant on him.

If she finds evidence of sexual exploitation, that’s a different matter but as it stands, a heavy handed approach here would play right into that predator’s hands.

Very likely and so will her son have broken the law

But he hasnt disclosed any of this, so who is going to be taking and looking at his phone?

The police?

What crime has the son reported to them? The police need grounds to take his phone, what are they going to be?

OP's son doesn't need her permission, unfortunately.

Op there is a lot of completely wrong information being posted on this thread.

in the circumstances I would advise you to contact the police simply because they at least will know what the law is and will be able to help you.

i’d suggest stepping away from the thread.

there’s a lot of people posting what they would like the law to be/think the law is.

He's 16 so over the age of consent!

As distasteful as it is no actual crime has been committed. There's absolutely no suggestion of grooming or coercion.

There's nothing to report to the Police and she can't stop her son going to London - he can leave the house, he has his own money, and she needs to be sure not to drive him further into this man's path.

I think you should keep talking to your son OP and express your concerns. Get whatever guidance you can from EXPERTS in this field.

Where have you got this bit of fake news from? A BBC docudrama?

What do you think constitutes the criminal offence of grooming for a 16 year old by an adult who isn't in a position of authority? Persuading a 16 year old to have sex with you is not grooming.

hard no, he’s 16! A child. I’d move mountains to stop my child seeing a very much adult. I’m shocked that you try to make this sound ‚normal‘ by saying he’s 17 soon. Take charge

‘Common sense’ doesn’t include acting like an aggressive thug though

No, being older doesn't constitute 'being in a position of authority' for legal purposes. If the adult is a teacher or former teacher of the child, a social worker or other professional in contact with the child then that would likely constitute a criminal offence. Age does not come into the definition.

This is not true Mike - please research something before commenting:

Strict legal grooming offence (s15/s15A): Victim must be under 16 (unless the adult is in a position of trust like the child's teacher, coach or carer, or if there's any evidence that the older party is paying the child, then it's 18).

However, broader child sexual exploitation/safeguarding: Applies up to under 18.

Grooming can even apply to people over the age of 18 if consent is vitiated.

16- and 17-year-olds are still legally children under the Children Act 1989/2004. They can be victims of child sexual exploitation (CSE), which includes grooming-like behaviour involving manipulation, coercion or abuse of power. Police and social services have a duty to safeguard them from significant harm due to sexual exploitation, even if they can legally consent to sex.

What would you actually do