Missiles can reach UK say Iran

[Spinningnewbie]

Just heard this in live interview with Defence Secretary.
Apparently they can reach us in 4 hours.
Are they lying??

And how do they get them in into Gaza ?

These rockets and missiles that are funded by Iran.

Well they smuggle them. I wonder if there's a documentary or something you could watch for how terrorists operate?

Article here from last year, Jerusalem Post:

Israeli military seizes weapons smuggled from Egypt | The Jerusalem Post (jpost.com)

Three rifles intercepted being smuggled by drone over the Egypt border. Note this part of the article :

"Regarding the weapons, the IDF's statement did not clarify whether the smuggled weapons were intended for terrorists in Gaza or criminal gangs in southern Israel."

Three rifles, and it is not clear who they were for. And note this too :

"The IDF has intercepted several similar attempts to smuggle weapons over the Egyptian border into Israel in recent weeks."

That's into Israel. Not Gaza. So even if for Hamas, how do they get to Hamas in Gaza ?

This is my point. Iran fund and supply is the claim. But how they do it is never mentioned. Just handwaved away. Yet it is a reason given for bombing Iran.

'So even if for Hamas, how do they get to Hamas in Gaza ?'

You must know there are lots of corrupt organisations out there so for every 3 rifles picked up there will be container after container waved through. How do you think hamas have been murdering their own civilians, with bow and arrows?

It's not as if this is some mystery that hasn't been reported on. Hamas brought them in through its tunnel network that crosses the border with Egypt, by sea, concealed in the import of other goods, and by making them locally with Iran's assistance.

How does Hamas get its weapons? A mix of improvisation, resourcefulness and a key overseas benefactor

The Iran factor
“Hamas acquires its weapons through smuggling or local construction and receives some military support from Iran,” the CIA’s World Factbook says.
While the Israeli and US governments have yet to find any direct role by Iran in last weekend’s raids, experts say the Islamic Republic has long been* *Hamas’ main military supporter, smuggling weapons into the enclave through clandestine cross-border tunnels or boats that have escaped the Mediterranean blockade.

“Hamas’ tunnel infrastructure is still massive despite Israel and Egypt regularly degrading it,” said Bilal Saab, senior fellow and director of the Defense and Security Program at the Middle East Institute (MEI) in Washington.
“Hamas has received arms from Iran smuggled into the (Gaza) Strip via tunnels. This often included longer-range systems,” said Daniel Byman, a senior fellow with the Transnational Threats Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS).

“Iran has also been shipping Hamas its more advanced … ballistic missiles via sea, in components for construction in Gaza,” said Charles Lister, senior fellow at the MEI.

But Iran has been a mentor, too, analysts say.

“Iran also helped Hamas with its indigenous manufacturing, enabling Hamas to create its own arsenals,” said Byman at the CSIS.

A senior Hamas official based in Lebanon gave details of the Hamas’ weapons manufacturing in an edited interview with Russia Today’s Arabic-news channel RTArabic published on their website on Sunday.

“We have local factories for everything, for rockets with ranges of 250 km, for 160 km, 80km, and 10 km. We have factories for mortars and their shells. … We have factories for Kalashnikovs (rifles) and their bullets. We’re manufacturing the bullets with permission from the Russians. We’re building it in Gaza,” Ali Baraka, head of Hamas National Relations Abroad, is quoted as saying.

Yup. The article is 3 years old. The tunnels gone. All cargo searched. Yet here we are, one of the reasons given for bombing Iran, 1000 miles away, is that they supply Hamas. I am not seeing anyone say it's because they did supply Hamas. You know... before the Gaza war.

So my question is still valid so long as the supplying Hamas argument is used. How does money in Qatar translate to arms for Hamas ?

On that subject
You haven’t responded to my post of yesterday
Here’s a reminder

'So my question is still valid so long as the supplying Hamas argument is used. How does money in Qatar translate to arms for Hamas ?'

Because they illegally export arms to hamas via smuggling and corruption! All cargo searched? Have you really no idea how organised crime and terrorists work?

So you are doing a begging the question really. You are basically saying " because they do, don't you know how they do it ?"

Because no, I really do not know how organized crime and cross border terrorism works. That's why I am asking . Yup, I added "cross border" to terrorism, because that is what we are talking about.

So the news should constantly be full of reports of truck loads of food aid being searched and rockets being found. Or are you saying the IDF who search the aid convoys are corrupt ? If so then tackling that should be done before bombing Iran I should have thought.

All I want to say here really, is that anyone using "Iran supplies Hamas" as one of the justifications in this war, then unless evidence can be presented then they should not be.

For sure. Say Iran did supply from year x to y, and they supplied a b c. But that is totally different from saying Iran DO supply. Because there was the Gaza war. And the reason given for stopping aid and the peace protestor boats was "Iran smuggling". So if the suggestion is that Iran is still getting arms to Hamas, then the Gaza war was a failure. Or that aspect was.

And yeah, lets do it all again with Iran. Then it will be Russia supply Iran,

At this rate the Trump regime is far worse ;the disgusting pig Hegworth quoting passages from the OT Bible to the soldiers , including passages quoting kill them all , leave none spare. They are evangelicals psychos. Competition for the Iranian regime

'All I want to say here really, is that anyone using "Iran supplies Hamas" as one of the justifications in this war, then unless evidence can be presented then they should not be.'

Well unfortunately for you intelligence services are not going to present Alan from mumsnet with all their sources but Iran are known to support and fund terrorism, illegal arms of course get into gaza as we know corrupt organisations are on hand to facilitate it.

Israel can care all they want, people in the UK don't. And it's only one country that keeps insisting that the UK and Europe are under threat from Iran. Fuck off and spend your own money and endanger your own people on your own fucking wars.

Ahh right. As expected, "it's secret".

I can look at the news and see photos of drug busts, drug subs, false bottomed suitcases etc... but smuggled rockets found in food convoys no.

As if Israel would stay quiet about that.

And yes, I would expect evidence to be shown for the reasons for war. Hand waving away really does not cut it.

Here you go Gloriia. This just now on the sky news feed.

"IDF claims hundreds of Hezbollah weapons found in school
Hundreds of weapons held by Hezbollah have been found at a school in southern Lebanon, the Israeli Defence Forces has claimed.
The stockpile was found after Israeli troops conducted a focused riad in the village of Al-Khiyam, the IDF said.
It shared footage on social media showing what it said were rockets, mortar shells, firearms and explosives found at the school.
"Hezbollah systematically embeds terrorist infrastructure in civilian spaces, thereby continuing to endanger the residents of Lebanon," the IDF said in a report of the raid."

The IDF is very quick to report this. But you are saying if they found smuggled rockets in Gaza, then that would somehow be secret ?

Nah. You are practically making stuff up for them really. They would report it like a shot if they found smuggled arms from Iran in Gaza.

I find it truly shocking that anyone these days would defend the IDF ( and the Israeli Government ) after what we’ve seen in the news of them shooting children in the head and innocents waving white flags trying the retrieve the murdered off the streets.

That's not to say Hamas are any better. But it’s clear the IDF and the IG are being defended ….i find it disgusting

I agree. I am not saying if I think the above news is true or not, I am just trying to get evidence for the claim that Iran is somehow still smuggling arms into Gaza.

I reckon if they found rockets in a food convoy the IDF would shout it from the moon. Not keep it secret for "reasons".

If there is no evidence for the claim, then the claim should be dropped. Not parroted. Indeed, if they don't even try to present evidence for that claim, why believe the missiles can hit London claim when that also has no evidence presented. .

That's my logic anyway.

The Iraq war was started on the back of a bunch of lies and this one is the same

Your posts have been very interesting and concise btw
No one seems to have an answer I see.

why believe the missiles can hit London claim when that also has no evidence presented. .

I think with regard to that claim people need to look at the big picture and not just make a knee jerk reaction either way based on "cos the IDF says..." they need to look at what's in the public domain..

The Iranians have a mature ballistics missile industry but fortunately as far as we know none of their military types of missiles has the range to reach western europe..

However the Iranians have demonstrated the capability to launch satellites using their own indigenous launchers, which like it or not, objectively, according to the science and engineering, means if they wanted to they in theory might be able to reach western europe with something....

Problem they'd have in the current conflict would be erecting and fuelling a launcher without it being detected and attacked, also we don't know what weight of payload could be carried, and we don't know if the Iranians have solved the problems with re-entry heating at high velocities...

To cut to the chase I suspect if you asked intelligence specialist/analyst if the Iranians, if so minded, could launch something that could reach the UK they'd say something like .."highly highly unlikely, but I can't say the probability is absolutely zero".

They use Russia to launch their sats usually I think.

Re missile claims. With the DPRK, when they do a missile test and it lands in the sea of Japan, the news reports will usually give a height attained. And from that the range can be calculated by anyone familiar with the equations. Or estimated anyway, given the payload is not known.

So if their test rocket gets to 650 miles altitude, and lands 400 miles away, it's range can be estimated pretty well. And I think they track it's re-entry too, and publish if it breaks up or not. If a sat launch does not re-enter intact, who cares really ? It's not designed to.

None of that was published for the Diego Garcia rocket claims.

@RedTagAlan

They use Russia to launch their sats usually I think

Over the years they have used a mix of Russian carriers and their own indigenous launchers.

By way of contrast the UK developed one indigenous launcher and flew it once, so whatever they may or may not be capable of right now I'd be wary of thinking the Iranians are backwards when it comes to advanced tech.

Potted history of their space and launcher program here:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Space_Agency

I am not saying anyone is backwards. I am saying the data will be known but it has not been published. One of them was shot down, so that data is known. And satellite launches are cool. But re-entry is important too.

I think it was shot down with a THAAD ? But the location of where that was fired from is also not known. If that was known then the range could also be estimated from that from that. Given guesses of launch sites, the parabolic flight needed to reach Diego Garcia, and the known performance envelope of the interceptor.

'The IDF is very quick to report this. But you are saying if they found smuggled rockets in Gaza, then that would somehow be secret ? Nah. You are practically making stuff up for them really. They would report it like a shot if they found smuggled arms from Iran in Gaza.'

No hun, I'm saying they'll report what they find but they'll be plenty they don't find. It's the nature of illegal arms smuggling, they don't have stickers on the containers telling everyone what the contents are.

@RedTagAlan

I am not saying anyone is backwards.

Sorry, that comment wasn't aimed at you...it's more aimed at those who perhaps are inclined to think "It's only Iran, how the heck can we be expected to believe they could possibly be able to do X, Y or Z"