AIBU to think primary schools should not audition children for choirs?

[LovelyBranches]

Dd is 9 and loves singing. She goes to her school choir after school group and goes to signing lessons outside of school. She has competed (and won) at the Eisteddfod.

Yesterday she came home from school very upset, unbeknownst to us she had auditioned for a place in her choirs Christmas show which will be on tv. She didn’t get in. There were 3 children in her year that didn’t get in. DD was devastated and very upset about it.

Today she came home upset because the teachers had taken the new choir group to practice and DD had no one in her usual friendship group to eat with. She ended up eating with another girl in her class who hasn’t been very nice to her recently.

I feel really upset for DD, she sings all the time and will tell anyone who listens how she wants to work in the theatre when she is older. I am aware that the school probably had a limited number of places but I feel like they should have given places to all year 6 and year 5 pupils rather than what they did which was allow year 6 and pick selectively between year 5 and 4.

AIBU to think that schools shouldn’t have auditions for choirs at primary school level.

Why will the other children not be good?

Why are the children who were included in the choir "not good" but the child who wasn't is a "good singer"?

The other choir OPs child goes to is probably a paid one, where they give everyone solos because they are paying to be there.

It might be that she's a bit of a prima donna.

She might not be but I can think of a girl of a similar age who is, and Mummy and Daddy's hugely talented PFB star performer is is loud, irritating and not particularly talented. (That child is not OP's DD unless they have relocated ).

@LovelyBranches About why.. maybe your daughter doesn't sing very well? My DS loves singing- he can't hold a tune though so obv wasn't chosen for the choir. Not good at sports either even if he likes it so not chosen there either. Like you we pay for outside activities so he can do what he loves even if he's no good on it.

I think you are exaggerating the problem- so dd isn't with her friends at lunch- not fun for her but this is all TEMPORARY. Tell her she can invite her friends for playdates/sleepovers and try to not be overly dramatic- surely this is a case of learning resilience.

The thing is, if this is a choir of say 40 / 50 kids, they don't need to be amazing singers to be in it, do they? They just need to be able to follow a tune, blend in and look enthusiastic.

Choising 80% - 90% of a school to sing is not 'selective.'

If you're going to take 80%, or whatever, you may as well take the lot of them and be done with the pretence of 'auditions.'

The only exception I could think of for not having a child in this type of choir would be if there was one with a voice like a literal foghorn that is never going to blend in. Or, if a child really can't sit still or is particularly disruptive.

Again, this is just a normal primary school - not the flaming Westminster Cathedral auditions!

But OP’s DD is in the choir, and it sounds like everyone can join that.

This is about a particular TV opportunity where there is obviously a limit on numbers, so they can’t have everyone.

OP wants them to have done the selection based on age; they’ve done it based on ability - either way not all kids will get to go. Their way is not irrational and OP needs to suck it up.

And I know plenty of people who did go on to work in the theatre. They were actually good rather than prima donnas but despite that weren't always given parts at school. The teachers often gave those to the loudest most confident pupils rather than the talented.

If they chose nearly everyone I doubt they were all that good. I am just going on my experience of primary school choirs.

While I'm usually one for teaching such lessons early I also think the issue that everyone except only 3 kids didn't make it makes a mockery of the "audition" and you might as well have just opened it to all.

We still don’t know if it was the TV company that specified the number and sex of the children of each age it wanted.

This completely misses the point - OP has explained that there is a cap on numbers for the tv recording. So they can’t just take everyone. They need to select them somehow.

equal number from each year would have surely been the fairest way? Then if it happens the next year you ensure you pick people who haven’t done it before. That way hopefully everyone gets a go

Not everyone wants to do it though and it sounds like a tiny school. The school will also have to follow what the TV show wants so since they didn't even audition the Year 6's who want to do it, that may be because the TV show largely wants older children.

People keep acting like it is all down to the school where they are likely following instructions from the TV show as to what age, how many etc they want.

It’s a one off. It’s completely reasonable for them to pick the best singers. It’s a shame for the OP’s DD but that’s life.

It's petty and inconsiderate to audition all the choir and leave three out. I'm not sure how teachers could do that.

I don't know how many students are involved and I haven't read all posts but having a cap of 37 when there are 40 kids in a class is nonsense.

Having a cap of eg 10 kids in a group of 40 is very different from 37 out of 40 and those numbers are made up just to make my point.

Then when you add the fact that it looks like the kids selected will have to practice during break or is it lunch for the next 9 months, how does that make sense? So only 3 kids will be left to spend each lunch break together while the rest practice for the next 9 months?

I suspect there was a limit placed by the organiser and the whole choir could not take part.

Honestly, I think it is horrible to see your child upset but if she wasn’t included in a selective process, I think you have to take it on the chin and try to support her through. Definitely speak to school re the issue re not having anyone to be with at lunch etc, but you can’t expect everyone to be prevented from doing something because your dd isn’t chosen. It’s not reasonable, though I understand the impulse to protect your child.

The other aspect I wonder if you have overlooked- how many in year 5 were chosen? Perhaps it was a case of “all of year 6 and 20 from year 4 and 5”- rather than a specific proportion from both year 4 and 5. I.e. the entire group from year 4 & 5 were treated as one, rather than 2 separate groups? Which would change the proportion of those chosen vs not included, so perhaps that might explain it. So instead of only 3 out if 15 interested children not being picked it could be more like 10 out of 30 or 15 out of 35 or even 20 out of 40 (as op says her dd’s year is unusually small, suggesting other years are larger).

They didn't leave out only 3. Presumably some year 5s were not picked too.
I do feel sad for the op's dd, but I'm sure the school haven't set out to upset anyone, and i think picking all the year 6s (who won't have anothwr chance) and auditions for the remaining spots sounds fair and reasonable.
I hope the op does not make s bigger thing of this than it needs to be. Little disappointments occur in life and havingbthe resilience to deal with setbacks is so important.

It isn't just for Year 4, it also includes Year 5 and Year 6. It sounds like they want more Year 6's because they didn't have to audition so I'm assuming that is what the TV show wanted which is out of the schools control.

This same choir won their event at Eisteddfod last year.

@Ilovelifeverymuch It isn't for 9 months. Most likely it will be recorded in May/June based on typical Christmas shows. Especially since it involves schools.

Of course it's likely the organiser picked a random round number - the school in the position of excluding three could have negotiated. Often these things are more flexible than one thinks.

Maybe they tried. OP doesn't even know how many Year 5's are doing it so it's really hard to say.

Came back to find out if OP ever heard back from the choir teacher? Any update OP?

Even if the TV company has a super strict cap on numbers, I still think the school handled this badly. There's only a very small handful of kids who missed out, by the sounds of things - why can't they still practice with the choir as understudies or something?

At the very least, the school should've had the brains to realise that a tiny number of choir kids wouldn't be picked for the TV production, and that there were bound to be some sadness and hurt feelings. The music teachers (or whoever's in charge) should have given those kids feedback, acknowledged the situation sucks, helped them work through their disappointment, maybe found a way to get them involved in some other capacity etc. Rather than just effectively saying "Sorry, but we've ranked you as being the bottom 20 percent of singers in your year, so no TV concert for you!" and leaving them twisting in the wind.