Stag do plans and suspect abbreviations

[WestlieJ]

DP is joint best man for a close friends Wedding in early summer and the stag is abroad next month. DP sorted the logistics of booking, chasing everyone for payment etc (there is 16 people going). The other best man has put together a ‘plan’ for the long weekend and sent to DP for his approval.

I’ve seen this because it’s saved to iCloud and we can jointly access that through the iPad we share to watch Netflix etc.

It’s all fairly standard stuff, but the final section is titled ‘expected costs’ and lists things such as a beer, meal in restaurant, etc, to help people budget. Within this section there are abbreviations, which I’ve taken to be ‘dodgy’ given they are not written in full and one is fairly obviously a strip club, although no idea on ‘MP’.

Ive got it in front of me as took a photo so have written out exactly:

SC - Ent: €10-20 / PD: €50-70
MP - €50 / HR +€30 / OWO + €40 / PM,SO +€50 / FS €100

I have already asked DP who said he scanned over the main itinerary and didn’t even realise that last section was on there and has no idea what it means. He also said he never has and never will step foot in a strip club.

Am I being naive to think DP was unaware? And does anyone know what the last part means?

If his response is not to pull out of the whole thing and not go, then he is not a good man. The other "best" man is definitely not a good man. Good people do not want anything to do with the sex trade, where most workers are either trafficked or from a young age recieved the message that their value lies solely in being used by men.

Your DP needs to pick a side - either he believes in the full humanity of women and not only wouldn't set foot in such a place but also wouldn't be friends with men who think otherwise, or he is on the side of the misogynists, rapists and incels. He can't keep a foot in both camps paying lip service to women's rights but going along on a stag do like that pretending that it's some kind of virtue to sit out of just the bit where his friends are doing this.

@28andgreat would you be happy if it was the same stag do, or they were partaking of similar items on the list?

(1 in 6 I think a previous poster stated is how many men have raped or would rape).

1 in 6 have.

Would is even worse.

The amount who said they would commit rape, If they knew there would be no consequences to them for doing so, was 1 in 3.

Think of how many men you know. How many you work with. How many you pass in the street each day. One in three.

It's no wonder women so often shut down and not-my-Nigel rather than look at that head on.

I wouldn’t be thrilled no, but I prefer to let my partner make his own choices and go from there rather than make a bone of it before I know if anything would even happen.

I have no issue with Strip clubs in principle, not my cup of tea but it is for many so each to their own, but I would be LIVID at him paying out money for something he could get at home for free! 🤣

Im quite positive that if the grooms 'bride' saw the list, she wouldn't be pleased either, also the wife of the other best man ... I would be putting my size 6s down and saying u ain't going ... sorry but would bhe let u go if a list arrived for your friends hen do like that? Weather u trust him or not, once alcohol & a load of lads are involved.. I would say he would go along with it too ... what happens in Benidorm, stays in Benidorm an all that!

To follow that up - obviously if he engaged in anything with a prostitute then that would be the end of our relationship.

my partner has had absolute zero say in anything stag do related, Infact he’s muted the group chat of it, he really doesn’t want to go - Benidorm being a shithole being one of the main reasons.

Messages on the group chat? Or messages just between themselves, set up after a panicked call from your DH?

Aren't stag does supposed to be all about the stag?

the other best man sourced the details from an ex-pat working over there who is strictly independent

I read this to mean that the other best man has a friend who lives and works out in Benidorm and that person is independent of the stag party I.e not involved or invited

The fact is, by going on this trip, the partner is complicit in the exploitation of women. Whether he personally uses them or not, he knows what is going on. And OP is also complicit in not calling it out and putting up with it. Of course she should tell the bride and other partners. What they do with this info is up to them, but she shouldn't just collude with exploitation. Do the right thing OP. Ffs.

Totally agree with this, @allchange5 . It would be a deal-breaker for me if a partner went along with it, even if I honestly believed that they wouldn't participate.

This exploitation, and enabling it by participating, is tantamount to rape imo. The women may appear to be consenting, but they have no agency so what may look like "consent" is meaningless.

OP's partner needs to read this thread imo, and to vote with his feet.

Are we learning nothing from the Epstien Files revelations?

People who condone and socialiise with the participants of the abuse of women are as guilty as the participants.

It's not about "letting" him go it's about getting the ick about being in any kind of relationship with someone who is ok with going on this holiday.

It's not about "letting the groom down" when the activity the groom is happy with is abusive. There is no way of participating in the sex trade that is not abusive.

he’s made clear he won’t be partaking

I wonder if any of the 16 men involved when questioned by their partners, would say they were planning on partaking in this "entertainment" that's been planned, abbreviated and costed out to a painstaking level?

Only people that are involved in the industry would understand the abbrevaitions. If the Groom and others aren't, then how would they understand what they were reading? Why would the person that wrote it expect them to know what it meant?

Of course they are all involved. Of course they all cover each other's arse if busted. It's a massive industry, billions of pounds change hands in this country alone every year, and yet 'Not my Steve", would need to literally be caught in the act with his pants round his ankles and even then there would be some story about how he didn't realise and it wasn't his idea, backed to the hilt by his "mates".

He can force you to do any of those things for free on a whim then go immediately back to drinking with his mates? Right.

Another one who doesn’t seem to understand the power trip they get out of it. They’re not doing it because they can’t get it anywhere else for fucks sake.

As for muting the group chat and talking Benidorm down, that’s classic 🤣. You don’t want the Mrs thinking you’re looking forward to it or the sex menu popping up on your screen!

It’s all part of the sex tourism prep.

Blame the single lads you barely know for the shit choice of destination, after all, you’re mature and settled and “past all that”. Of course you’d prefer a walking trip in the Lakes.

Mute the chat. Any prick who lets his Mrs see it on the cloud better sort it now, and fuck me, make sure there’s a message from the stag outlining he isn’t involved. Don’t need the wedding off!

Save the excitement for the airport. Lads time. If she thinks you’re not arsed she won’t mither you every 2 minutes. Don’t forget euros either, no doubt the Mrs will be checking your statements. How much is bareback again mate?

Seen it all soooo many times. If he didn’t want to go @28andgreathe wouldn’t go!

If that was my husband, he would know if he went, he would not be coming back, at least not to my bed, even if he says he wouldn’t join in, which he is bound to, he’s still associating himself with the type of people who will. Eww

Actually, I think she may be sitting at home trying to get her head around this.

Some people struggle to grasp the concept that consent is only valid if it's freely given and that when women are trafficked or coerced, it's not freely given. I only grasped it myself from reading feminist writers in the 1970s.

Who hurt you?

THIS ^^ right here is the truth of NAMALT.
HE doesn't "indulge" therefore he's a good guy. Except he also doesn't call this horrible behaviour out. He condones it as "there (sic) choice.

He refuses to see the exploitation, doesn't acknowledge the trafficking and rape of the women involved.

And is happy to gaslight women that their partners wouldn't lie to them about cheating and exploiting women.
NAMALT my arse!

Mumsnet is so mental sometimes.

posts not even mine, don’t even know if it’s the same stag do yet my partner is being slated for something that is not even in existence 🤣

I’ll be sure to be on top snooping behaviour, checking all messages, checking bank statements because of course all men cannot resist shagging a prostitute and will cheat at every given opportunity.

oh lord, my dads going too - do I need to worry about a possible orgy?!
bites nails

🤦🏽‍♀️

One of the reasons I loathe the NAMALT thing. No, it’s not all men but it’s always men and it’s far too many of them.

It’s staggering isn’t it, that he can’t seem to understand he’s part of the problem. Shocking.

And so depressing. Even the men who think they are ‘good’ don’t call out or even judge (his words) other men for paying for sex despite it being an industry built on abuse, rape and trafficking. Despite men never being able to truly know if the women they pay for sex with are abused or trafficked. But being willing to take the risk to get a blow job or sex. Jesus.

Ah now I KNOW he's lying.

Why exactly are they going there in the first place if it's not to avail themselves of the amenities?
There a lots of places they could visit but the groom himself chose Benidorm. Hmmmm.

As for the shared iCloud. He forgot you could see it, or he didn't expect you to look at the private chat on there.

All this "why would I incriminate myself?" bollocks is standard gaslighting. They ALWAYS say that when they've been careless and get caught out.

Hmmm. My brother would quite happily lie to me about this if a man I was with asked him to.
Most men would. You are too trusting.

Pretty sure people can have a stag or hen night in Benidorm without paying for sex - they could do it anywhere. Glasgow. London. I don't personally believe that every stag or hen night ends up in a situation like this. Some will of course

Ah here. Hes hardly going to admit to taking part now is he.
How does that go exactly?
Course ill be partaking love but sure its a col crisis so ill just get a basic bj sure is that ok?

Hes lying.
He knew.
He will be indulging.
He is disgusting.
You are enabling.

Thats it in a nutshell.

When you saw the itinerary, I think you posted on MN, because the abbreviations (subconsciously) troubled you. It’s your business whether you trust your partner, but what do you think about the bride’s right to know? She hasn’t really featured in your post and I wonder what she will feel reading this list?
A stag weekend is what exactly? It could be a group of friends, not strangers, not mere acquaintances, spending a couple of days together, before the BIG DAY. The Day the bride and groom make very serious promises to one another about how they will live the rest of their lives. Central to those promises are to act with respect and integrity. The witnesses at a wedding are there to support the couple, and to witness their public declarations of love and fidelity. They are not there to snigger about all the shagging and exploitation that occurred on ‘the stag’.
The men going to this stag, have signed up to a sex tourism trip, the focus of which will be swigging cheap booze, in an affordable location, probably taking other substances and then hunting down trafficked women and girls to use their bodies as a receptacle for semen. What other activities have been planned to fill their days? Activities that couldn’t have been accessed in dear old Blighty? Thought not.
Ask the bride how she feels about this?
If you had asked your husband to explain these abbreviations, and waited for his answer, I suspect you’d have had greater concerns about what is really going on. He got a free pass when you gave him time to come up with the ‘cost of living crisis’ nonsense. Sadly I think that you are easily fooled.
The lads are going to be bragging and boasting about their sexual exploits, the idea that the groom and his best chum will be quietly disgusted and embarrassed by such antics, would make for a truly weird dynamic, don’t you think? I mean what would be the point?
It isn’t good enough to say ‘well of course I thoroughly disapprove of the sexual exploitation of women…but I don’t want the lads to see me as a killjoy’. Character is destiny, and after numerous pints and plenty of egging on, do you really think that your partner will exclude himself from the group? How many men delude themselves and others with the excuse that they didn’t have sex, they just had a blowjob…and after all it’s not an affair…she’s just a prozie who was paid for the privilege. Standards of behaviour with horny drunk men who see women as second class citizens are v v low, and bear in mind, he’s going away for a few days, it’s not just an after work ‘do’ where he can hop in a cab and get home. He’s in the thick of this sleaze.
If the bride and her parents don’t mind…well you’ve done your bit, but you should ask them first before MN.

I really hope OP has shared this with the other partners/wives because they deserve to know that their other halves are planning on getting up to and what kind of men they are in relationships with.

Fair enough OP if you genuinely believe your partner isn’t going to partake, but do the right thing by all the other women. You can’t keep this to yourself.