Not wanting to share a toilet with men at work

[Babylambchop]

I have started at a new workplace and its toilets are non-compliant with the law. Ordinary toilets - 3 normal cubicles, not floor to ceiling, with shared hand washing- turned into mixed sex. So all toilets are just 'toilets'. I have tried to get on with it, despite absolutely hating the idea, but last week the seats were all up with pubes stuck everywhere and piss all over the floor, so couldn't even really get to the loo without trousers going in it. Plus kept bumping into male colleagues where we were all a bit awkward. I hate it and I can't get over the fact they're illegal and I shouldn't have to put up with it. Dreading my really heavy period next week. Wibu to complain? In all honesty I dont think I can, but ffs!!!

That’s really crappy (sorry…).

If they’re effectively saying ‘we can’t afford to comply with H&S law, are they a viable business?

Its not a business as such. They don't make any money.

I am 54 and a no more fucks to give feminist, but during your probation no I probably wouldn’t unless there is an anonymous way.

If there is no way of raising anonymously with HR or workplace services then I would raise it with a couple of female colleagues in a “yes settling in well but I little surprised we are not lawful with the toilet situation” then shut up and see how the conversation goes.

The laughably inept GLP. Surely no-one believes anything they say. They were chastised - again - for misrepresenting a judgement a couple of weeks ago.

What don't you understand about many women not wanting to use a toilet next to a man?

How long is your probation period and how much do you value the job? If you think they might be quick to find reasons to get rid of employees during probation then I wouldn't. If you're fairly confident they value you then I might.

Is there an accessible toilet anywhere? The week of my period I would use that. If asked I would say why. Maybe that will make the managers realise that there are times we really do need single sex spaces and we're not just being annoying.

In the workplace it is illegal not to provide single sex toilets and changing facilities. Its not illegal to provide unisex toilets outside the workplace, but if you do provide a single sex toilet by labelling them "womens" toilets ,"womens" means female sex (as clarified by the supreme court) and it must not include any males. So,to be lawful, if you dont want to provide single sex toilets you must not call them/label them single sex.

As a new person, you are going to make yourself unpopular anyway if you walk into somewhere and starting making waves.

If you are sure of the situation legally then absolutely pursue it. I would hate it too. We have a shared single toilet at work which is floor to ceiling door into the basin and floor to ceiling door into toilet.

But just be aware that, even if things change, you may forever be known as a pain, even by those who might benefit and that won’t do you any favours.

If they don’t do it, would you leave?

Yes because if they dismiss you on the grounds of the toilets it is sex discrimination and it is unlawful irrespective of how long you've been there. They might try to find another reason to dismiss you but unless you're willing to put up with this for 2 years when you have more protections legally then you should raise it.

Put everything in writing and everything that is a phonecall you follow it up with an email outlining everything that has been discussed.

You are dammed if you do, and dammed if you don't.

Can you leave?

I can't leave as I've just started. Ive had a walk round and there's loads of EDI stuff everywhere which is all factually incorrect, think getting the protected characteristics wrong, so I wonder if someone is pushing this agenda.

Then I think you are in for a difficult time. However legit your concerns, it rarely goes well for newbies who come in and tell the company what they are doing wrong.

if there are illegal practices, then absolutely report them. But ime, management and staff are going to roll their eyes and put you down as a pain!

Exactly! I need to find a way to get over it! I think the workplace has a lot of problems.

I work in a university and most of the toilets in the building where I am based have been converted to mixed toilets. I hate it. It is awkward and uncomfortable for me. By the looks of other people, some of them are uncomfortable with this as well.

In my experience, the mixed toilets are dirtier than when they were single sex. Toilet seats dirty, unflushed, skid marks etc. They are generally smellier now!

I work on the ground floor but I walk up to the third floor toilets as I know they are quieter and cleaner. At least, I am getting some exercise now though I miss the single sex toilets.

@Babylambchop start looking for a different job, and work out some strategies in the meantime. Reducing how often you need to go, working from home, getting period pants that might last you all day, going out for lunch break in order to access suitable toilets…

Very frustrating.

Do this.

Ask where there are private facilities you can use, and graphically explain why.

You might find you get access to a toilet you didn't know existed (hoping).

Their set up is illegal and Id hate it, but I don't think I would fight it head on and tell them they are illegal during my probation period. Not if I really needed to keep the job.

(Oh and to all the cool girls who think ladies toilets are worse than men's - 🙄
I hate to break it to you but penises are messier than vulvas. But you know this).

It doesn't have to be a race to the bottom.

Sounds grim

is it a male dominated workplace?

i’d start by having a chat with female colleagues and ask them what they think. I’d be really surprised if this hasn’t come up in discussion before

not as easy as all that but I don’t think I could continue working there

Do you have colleagues you feel you can ask about this? I’d be curious what the set up was before, how long ago this mixed sex set up was implemented, and how others feel about it. You can’t be the only woman to hate this.

Are you really asking why a woman doesn’t want a man in her toilet?

I don’t want men to see my bloodied fingers when I have emptied my mooncup or them to see if I’ve bled through clothes
i dont want them to hear me piss or shit, it’s intimate
I don’t want to hear them
I don’t want to risk being sexually harassed in a space where I undress
I value my dignity and privacy
I want my toilet to be clean

Are any of those reasons okay with you?

I actually think you might have more leeway as a new employee to raise this - you can play dumb "Where are the ladies...what do you mean there aren't any...this really isn't legal, are you quite sure, this really doesn't match H&S requirements, everywhere else I've ever worked has required single sex toilets..." etc.

Sometimes it needs someone coming from outside an organisation to challenge something that everyone inside the organisation has accepted bit by bit, like boiling frogs.

Ah I've just seen that there is DEI stuff everywhere. You might have an activist within that has been pushing this....

If there is one stand alone toilet to be shared thats not great but not as bad as a row of toilets being shared. In a loo next to a man. No thanks.

And no you don't have to find a way to get over this!! Activating the bat signal for @KeepToiletsSafe

And also a template email from Sex Matters:
sex-matters.org/posts/publications/template-email-to-raise-concerns-about-workplace-toilets/

Oh, in that case, there will definitely be someone behind this. Is one of the characteristics "gender", instead of "sex" perchance? Or "gender identity", instead of "reassignment"?