This is the height of lazy childcare and I’m so sick of it

[WizardLizard86]

Just back from a church playgroup and at various points it absolutely reeked with small kids needing their nappies changed. I’m not talking babies, I mean toddlers who at some points are actually waddling uncomfortably with full stinky nappies. The minders seem to just do a nappy change en masse before they leave.

Their ‘carers’ are mainly a big group of childminders (no I’m not slagging them all off just these ones!) who just sit having a chat while their charges free roam and they either don’t check or pretend not to notice. An occasional few are parents who are actually sitting right next to their child but still don’t get up to anything about it for ages.

There’s two changing facilities and a box of spare nappies of all sizes and wipes etc so it’s not that. The changing rooms are just off the hall so no one needs to go anywhere else to sort it, and they’re empty most of the time.

I’m a nanny there with toddler twins and triple checked their nappies loudly to make a point but it doesn’t change anything. (We’re not there anymore and they are napping so I’m not slacking off)

It’s so unpleasant for others not to mention gross and uncomfortable for the child, I feel like they’re should be a sign up or something but it just seems such a basic point of childcare it shouldn’t need to be stated.

is it common at other playgroups? I don’t know what the answer is I just wanted a vent. Puts me right off my coffee and hobnob I tell you.

I'm a childminder, and this is the reason I don't take my little pressure to toddler groups, I'm always the one that actively watches kids so end up being the defacto carer for far more than the three I was paid for... even one time fishing a drawing pin out of a babies mouth (who's mum was going to start with me but decided her friend would be a better choice ironically). I can't stand people who neglect kids in their care.

WTF

We’ve got two local church toddler groups and we stopped going to the one that allows childminders because they were always an absolute nightmare for not watching their kids.

Last time we gave it a go for a few weeks one of them had two 4 year olds and parents were constantly having to step in to stop them either hurting themselves or trampling wee ones. I wouldn’t even have minded if she was tending to one of her other mindees when this was happening but she was sat scrolling on her phone everytime.

The other one we do still go to is lovely though and the one childminder who is allowed to come (because she bring her own granddaughter/ brought her own kids and other grandkids when they were younger) is always on the ball with her kids when she there.

This is quite common but at the village playgroup i went to the mums and nannies were no better than the childminders. I chose my childminder because when I went with my baby i saw her each week at the playgroup and noticed she was attentive, not on her phone etc. Shes eastern european and very helpful on training DC at age 2 and horrified by brits with massive 3 year olds in nappies.

The people who seemed worst for this were the late trainers, huge kids of 3.5 walking round with nappies full of shit and no one bothered to take them to the loo.

It's not 'for hours'

There are several childminders/parents doing this at this church playgroup, not one

You're being unreasonable to expect the OP to go around getting all their contact details.

There are much better ways to resolve this issue.

My nursery has a mix of age staff, and it's very obvious from what my son talks about his day that he is well-engaged there.

I ran an early-years project form the government so was able to chat pedagogy with the staff, and it is a purpose-built building, so has lots of smart design that means that staff can stay engaged and children can learn and move around well safely.

She is saying they put them in a nursery type childcare for 2.5 days a week so they are registered and use their tax free childcare there , but they don’t use it with the op so she isn’t registered and doesn’t work at the nursery so she isn’t further privy to the parents arrangements
op, you’re very patient!

I live in an expensive area and all the nurseries seem to have very young staff and high turnover. So much of what you were paying as a parent was rent on the building, fees to a brand owner, the staff were paid a pittance. Often the "key worker" wasn't even there all the days your child was or would change every year because your child moved room - whereas its better for a child to remain with the same caregiver throughout and form a bond with them.

I also hated the way they had all the babies in one room, toddlers in another etc, its done by age groups so that its easier for the nursery to calculate ratios and maximise children per staff but its not what's best for the children imho.

It's more normal/natural to have a mixed age group of children to care for, with babies hearing older ones speak and seeing them play, and able to chat to older kids while holding/feeding baby etc.

Our childminder was fab. I wish there was more encouragement/state support of childminding as a model, its much more effective to have people working from their homes. It means the childcarer can retain more of the fees (which then attracts better quality staff & reduces turnover) without parents having to pay more simply for a building to be provided.

Thanks, it helps in my line of work 😂

My dc are teens now but I used to hate seeing a toddler with a saggy, stinky nappy. I didn't it see it loads but it does look neglectful and just sad when it's clear they are carrying on playing etc with a poo in their nappy. Especially in a playgroup setting where facilities are there and no doubt spare nappies and wipes if needed - not as if someone has been caught short. I think that would put me off going too.

Oh I just tell people. It didn’t even occur to me to do. I say oh who’s done a poo, I check my kid and then I start asking other mums, it smells like poo, it might be yours, is it elodie? I think she’s done a poo. No it’s Billy!!

admittedly no childminders at my playgroup only parents or grandparents or auntie

Doesnt surprise me. Many childminders are great, but I’ve noticed some do it to be off with their own kids and earn money and don’t really have the right proactive mindset.
Ive seen a group of childminders drinking Budweiser with a lot of children down a park .

I’ve experienced similar and it does put you off using childminders, although I am sure not all are like that.

I’ve a childminder friend who did contact naps with a baby for nearly 2 years- she managed the other children’s schedules so she could meet the child’s needs, as any other excellent childminder would do.

It really isn’t unregulated. We have Ofsted inspections every few years, the same as every other childcare institution - you can see these reports online.

This was one of the reasons I hated taking my kids to soft play when they were younger because there were always toddlers with stinky nappies wandering about, out of sight (and smell!!) Of their carer. Ive got no idea if it was a parent, grandparent or CM but it put me off going because a leak or incident in soft play would be horrible

You both sound very judgemental. How do either of you know if there isn't a reason some of those three year olds aren't potty trained like SEN?

Had the same at a group I was at a few weeks ago. Two little boys with their Nan who was much more interested in chatting than playing with them. Had to loudly make a point of checking my little boys nappy as it stunk. She then checked her grandson and got soooo annoyed! Huffed and puffed, scolded him and declared she “hated this part”. Poor little guy had been tugging at her leg for attention half the morning! ☹️

It’s really hard to see threads like this where the majority of posters are tarring all childminders with the same brush as feckless, lazy, neglectful and now apparently Budweiser drinking layabouts.

There are good and bad people in every profession, but every childminder (unless they’re unregistered, which is illegal) will have had full Ofsted inspections and mandatory first aid, child development and child protection training. Many of us also give up many of our evenings and weekends to do more training to learn new techniques and skills. If you go to a nursery then not all of the staff will have been trained in first aid or child development; agency staff will be used and you have no guarantee who will be looking after your child, as you would if you used a childminder.

Despite being noted to have better outcomes for children that nurseries and school based nurseries, numbers of childminders are dropping hugely in the uk - due to pressure from Ofsted (the latest apparently ‘kinder’ Ofsted inspections have come with a new top grade that childminders have been told we can’t achieve as we don’t have the numbers of children to prove how we handle sen and deprived children- so those of us who have always been outstanding will now effectively be downgraded, which is demoralising), tax changes, constant changes to the EYFS, huge limits to what we can and can’t do and when we get paid now ‘30 funded hours’ basically make us council employees but without the benefits of sick pay etc etc… and threads like this don’t help.

op - you are seeing these people out and about, they are making the effort to go to groups and let their children socialise. I would hope that they would be watching the children, even if you aren’t aware that they are - I sometimes sit and chat with a group of childminders, Nannies and parents at playgroup, as childminding is now really lonely, as there are so few of us in the area now, but I always watch the children even if I don’t have as much 1-2-1 time as I do with them at home for the other 7 hours we aren’t at group. It may annoy you they don’t change the children (it would me too - but I’d say something and offer a nappy if needed). It used to annoy me a bit that a dad would bring his little toddler to a group and then stand at the side with his back to her, while he made work calls, and we had to look after her- but I’m not making a post online about all dads being useless and encouraging other people to agree.

Do people really think nursery staff are perfect (even after that poor baby died after being was strapped face down to a beanbag or the recent case of the man arrested for pedophilia at the bright horizons one?) - the difference is that 99% of the time the children at nursery are behind closed doors, so you don’t see the child left to cry/being ignored or with a dirty nappy.

This is my experience of the child minders at our toddler group too. They sit around chatting and don’t interact with the kids at all. It’s quite big so they can’t possibly be keeping an eye on all their kids. There’s one older boy who is physical and sometimes rough with the younger girls in his group and they’re just fending for themselves.

No one thinks nursery staff are perfect but I don’t think using two tragic cases proves anything other than that awful people do exist, we know this.

How do you think Genevieve’s mother would feel if she read your post? Honestly you should be ashamed of that.

Ugh seeing the way some of my local childminders acted in toddler groups firmly put me off using them! I'm sure some are fine, but most gave me the ick so bad. They rarely seemed to actually give a flying stuff about the kids they were caring for and would mostly ignore them, and then randomly if they for eg saw a kid playing with a blue toy would half arsed say "Olivia, what colour is this?" And then back to ignoring.

I don't think children need to be entertained 24/7 but they certainly needed far more interaction than those childminders gave them. I send both my DC to nursery and very happy with their experience - the staff seem to actually LIKE the kids and care about them, their milestones etc and especially in the preschool room, teaching them very basic things that are helpful. Eldest DDs language exploded exponentially when she moved up from the baby room (she now doesn't shut up but whatever 😂)

I have seen this at parents and toddlers groups. I go up, all smiley, to the childminder and say “oh you maybe haven’t noticed but “Florrie” over there needs her nappy changed now.”
I don’t leave it as an option and am very pleasant but direct. If they don’t react I would say “do you want me to change her for you” it’s only happened once but after statement two the shifted and changed the toddler.

It’s only happened a handful of times (I have been going to two parents and toddlers groups for 5 years in total but I would have to agree some childminders huddle in the corner and chat and pay zero attention to the kids. Stupid really because their potential business, clients and revenue is in jeopardy because the exact people looking for childminders are in the hall watching how they look after the kids they have.

this sort of childminder does a great deal of damage to the whole profession. I've seen too many awful childminders to be able to use one, even though rationally I know there must be very good ones, just like there are good and less good nurseries. I wonder if the best childminders aren't even obviously childminders so you don't clock them as such.

Like many here, I've seen too many childminders meeting up and ignoring their children who are then left to cause chaos/ get into dangerous situations/ cling on to parents who are actually engaging with their children - often whilst being visibly dirty / snotty/ unchanged nappies etc. Even the highly-rated local childminder to me lets the children run off so much further by the busy road than I ever would and has lost children twice in front of me with us all having to help her find them. It's really disturbing to see as you can imagine the parents being told about the lovely day they've had at playgroup etc when the reality is so much less wholesome!