To think this is utterly disgusting?!?

[LucyWestenra]

What is wrong with people??

Talk about adding insult to injury!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15602697/amp/Green-Party-spin-doctor-denies-women-raped-October-7-attacks.html

I have now seen you have now confirmed that you think the war started on Oct 7. I wasn't invested in your posts, someone said no one thought that and i said that I thought that you had said it (which you have now confirmed).

The 2005 bit was a reference to your reasoning, as I understood it.

I have already posted about what this thread is about. At length. I will post a link to the Al Jazeera investigation which coverd these issues too later. I don't have time to do much now other than post links.

Yes you have. That is exactly what you have done, and you should be deeply ashamed.

I refuse to feel shame for something I haven't done.

The ones who should feel shame, imo, are the ones who have blatantly ignored the plight of the Palestinians in Gaza in this thread, downplayed the genocide there, and who have unquestioningly taken Israel's side in this conflict.

Anyway, I'm done with this conversation. The OP wants to discuss the Green Party and their spokesperson and I don't want to get in the way of that discussion any more than I have done already.

No mystery, they don't care, unbelievable though that seems to most of us.

People should be ashamed to take Israel's side?
Yet you're the one accusing posters of "bias".

You keep saying you are leaving the thread, please just do it. And yes, I realise you are incapable of shame. Very sad.

I'll leave as soon as people stop referencing me / talking to me! :-)

Luckily it's a quiet day in the office, so it's easy for me to respond to posts.

Unquestionably taking either Israel or Palestine's side = bias.

I've been at pains to point out where I feel Palestine/Hamas have committed atrocities - like the Oct 7th attack. Therefore I don't think I'm guilty of bias, no.

There was a suggestion that I thought that the Israelis killed/raped/taken hostage on that day were not innocent, which I was happy to correct.

Some posters on here ( I can't remember their names ) HAVE said they disagree with some of Israel / Netanyahu's actions - that suggests to me that they are similarly unbiased.

Others, however, seem to think that Israel have done absolutely nothing wrong here - now, THAT is bias.

Blimey … this thread isn’t even about Gaza and I thought you had accepted that the legal position on whether it’s a genocide or not is yet to be determined - and won’t be ruled on by an international court for years probably. Until then, it’s just opinions we all have on the subject.

Anyway, thank you for acknowledging that OP & most of us want to talk about the Green Party, the title of the thread.

No. You've used the term "feel shame" about people taking the side of Israel.
That's "bias" to use your oft quoted word.
Who on here has said Israel has done no wrong?
Don't use the word "ashamed" against anyone supporting Israel to any degree.

I agree @OrangeAxolotyl
Nobody, including myself (with admitted bias towards Israel) has said Israel has done no wrong. Even Israelis themselves have admitted that, although not on this thread as it is not what the thread is about.

I do feel that anyone unquestionably backing Israel on this, and therefore ignoring the plight of the innocent people in Gaza, should feel shame, yes.

Some people on this thread have done that. One poster even referenced ' the difficult conditions that IDF soldiers have to work in ' ffs! Yeah, killing unarmed civilians is a really challenging working environment...

Others have been more even-handed, and I applaud them for it.

No-one is unquestionably backing Israel. I think you need to read posts more carefully. I think you need to unpick your own bias and I think you need to question why you have associated any support of Israel with the term "shame".

@IcyPlumShaker nobody on this thread has 'ignored the plight of the innocent people of Gaza'. You are just making things up.

I was someone who said I have disagreed with some of Netanyahu’s decisions. That doesn’t make me unbiased though.

Just saying I can see both sides doesn’t mean we are without bias, a lot of which is unconscious. Who we tend to believe tells us a lot about where our unconscious bias lies. I tend to believe Israel over Hamas when they have different versions of the same event. I assume they are telling the truth unless evidence comes out that suggests they were lying.

People who tend to believe Hamas version of events without questioning it have a bias too.

Thank you 👍.
Not one of us. There are some issues here with comprehending posts, or perhaps they're just not being read properly?

Anyhoo - in the interests of harmony etc - it seems like we can all agree that a) what Hamas did on Oct 7th was an atrocity, and b) Israel have also done terrible things in this conflict.

If we can all agree that, then I will happily back off and let you all continue trashing the only UK political party that actually cares about poverty and the environment. :-)

Respectfully, I don't believe that to be true.

Sadly it's certain posters on this thread who are making me want to dig my heels in and 'unquestionably back Israel' especially when my Israeli family is spending time in safe rooms while Iran (who wants to wipe out Israel completely) sends missiles over their heads. It's a great shame that there are no safe rooms provided for either innocent Iranians or Palestinians.

In the interests of harmony & returning to the original subject of the thread, I can agree with that. Though it’s not “Israel” as a whole country, it’s the current Israeli government that I am agreeing have done some terrible things in this conflict.

No-one is "trashing" the Green Party - such bias!
We are questioning the controversial claims made by the party spokesperson.
We are allowed to question this. The Green Party cannot be above reproach.

I would agree. I have absolutely no respect for Netanyahu and his ilk.

Respectfully, show those posts then. I'm intrigued. Even I, with my bias, has never stated that as it is just not true.

'The only UK political party that actually cares about poverty and the environment'
Now you taking the pi$$ @IcyPlumShaker.

Yeah, that made me laugh! However, everyone is entitled to a political opinion, and feel no shame 😉