Hotels emptying

[cornflakecrunchie]

..of asylum seekers..
On the news. Are we supposed to be impressed? They are just being shuffled elsewhere, aren't they?

ONS identify 2 main reasons for the reported increase in sexual offences. The first is that 2 new offences were included in the official figures for the first time. The second is increased reporting due to changes in police reporting practices and reporting from victims. As it happens I left my kids in the hands of a Muslim all day today. He did do a little bit of torturing, mainly in the form of algebra according to the eldest. But he is a mild mannered Maths teacher so I think it's part of the job.

The traffickers take their documents. They don't let them on the boats unless they hand them over. And surprise surprise, they don't get them back. The asylum seekers I come into contact with are distraught if this has happened to them. They know that without their documents, they're helpless to prove their need for asylum.

I get people want to be kind and accommodate people. But we do also have to acknowledge we are an island and theres 8 billion people on this planet now.

and a sinking one at that! We say we can’t afford to do this and do that. Yet we are spending a lot of money on this because we dont really have a choice. We cant have hundreds of thousands of vagrant men roaming around as thats bloody dangerous.

But it does affect us. I dont see how people can think it isnt. And if we dont some how figure out how to control this then this is going to be the tip of the iceberg.

If you want a direct comparison as to how this affects us. Well everyone going on about wiping student loans. The current rate of spend on asylum seekers is not dissimilar to what it would cost to wipe that debt. Thats 9% additional tax on a huge growing cohort of our population. Thats a lot a lot.

My point exactly.
Immigration is an essential fabric to our society.

The asylum seeker cost is met by the government overseas aid commitment. They've asked to use a portion of it in-country. If asylum seekers stopped coming tomorrow, that money would still not be able to be spent on student loans or anything else in this country. It would go to overseas aid, as it was initially intended to

I do agree with that - going back to my home town I can see why people think things are truly shitty - however I don’t get why they were not making a big deal of it 10 years ago - it was shitty then too - I honestly think it’s the cult of Farage -

I wonder how much student debt would've been paid off if our gov not wasted billions on PPE that we couldn't even use?!

Am pretty sure we waste a hell of a lot in the UK and the corruption is rife with so many fingers in the pie. I don't see though why the only issue regarding UK economics should be asylum seekers.

For sure we shouldn't have so many, it's sad state of affairs that the whole world is going to pot. I'd rather all counties were safe.

And to PP saying that illegal immigrants will become care home workers or nurses. Well that seems unlikely since (from the ONS) "Since 2018, almost three-quarters (71%) of people detected arriving via illegal routes to the UK have been adult males aged 18 and over" and these jobs are predominantly done by women.

It's also likely to be quite immoral to expect genuine refugees who may have PTSD to do care home jobs - these jobs require high degrees of emotional resilience and also very good English. Not just anyone can do them. Expecting 'just anyone' to do them will result in abuse of patients. Real harm and abuse. Why would anyone want that? Why does no-one care about the people in care homes?

This idea we need lots of mostly young male illegal immigrants who are unlikely to want to care for the elderly (particularly at current rates of pay) to solve the care home crisis is so unutterably stupid as to be profoundly depressing.

Well this is a good argument for trying to shut the traffickers down (by not allowing boats to land) and open up more legal routes.

Well maybe we need to think about that.

Seriously.

I am not just talking about that one issue - theres so many issues in this country. I just picked that one because it maths pretty much direct.

The water - also a big one now on everyone’s radar this week. 64 Billion. Yes thats 4x more than the 10 year projected underestimated migrant spend. But thats a one off buy forever.

Do you see what I am saying. I could list a million others we need to urgently spend billions on.

I could introduce you to several 20 somethings who work in care. People who are good at it, kind and compassionate and exactly the sort of people who should be doing care work.

Really hate these generalisations about young people. Even when I was young (20 years ago!) working in care was something only done by those of us actually suited to it.

And now, like then, good carers leave because they can't manage the unpredictable shifts once they start having children (this has actually got worse), or because they can earn more elsewhere and desperately need to, or because they are treated poorly by management or only allowed a 0 hrs contract... Not laziness.

Hmmmm…and who told you that the traffickers take their documents? And why would the traffickers demand their documents? After all, they already have their money so I imagine don’t care what happens to the immigrants once they get on the boats, so why would they remove their documents? All seems to be a very convenient excuse to me….

There was also an Irish man on the train as well who helped. The Algerian man wasn't an unvetted refugee. Also look at the man who did the attack.....

You can't tell for sure. But you can refuse to allow immigration from third world nations such as Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan etc. especially unchecked, unvetted people not pre-cleared by the home office, arriving on a boat

Then we can cut that and use it on our own domestic issues?

I work in this sector.
The majority of asylum seekers arrive lawfully by plane and apply for asylum once here. If they have means to support themselves, they do. Only destitute asylum seekers are housed and fed by the UK state.
They are housed in a combination of hotels, private rental properties/ HMOs and large sites like barracks and halls of residence. Govt preference is for large sites as most efficient, but they attract massive planning challenges that make them difficult to set up. Hotels are not the preferred option because they are costly, but in many cases the contracts to house asylum seekers saves struggling Hotels from going out of business, so does have some benefit to the local community via employment etc. HMOs have quotas in each geographic area limiting the numbers housed, hence using Hotels rather than saturate the local housing market.
Asylum seekers in private rentals receive c£36 pppw to live on- it's not lavish. Those in Hotels are fed and given a tiny amount of pocket money for bus fares, clothing etc. They are heavily reliant on charitable donations for things like warm clothes. Asylum seekers are not permitted paid employment. If they could work we could reduce the cost to taxpayer and 'idle hands' concerns at a stroke.
The majority of claims are successful, so these individuals become refugees with the right to work, access to benefits etc. They would probably integrate quicker and more successfully to UK society if made more welcome and permitted to become economically self sufficient much earlier in the process.
There are detention facilities, which cost vastly more than Hotels.

We also should not be encouraging artificial depression of care home workers wages - again this encourages abuses within the system. Care home work is a hard job and should be paid according to the level of skill needed to do it well - i.e. much better than it is currently paid (there is profit being made, that needs to stop and the money put into workers salaries for a start).

We should think not only of who is doing the job or can be a warm body in a care home job vacancy, but who is being cared for and the quality of care. I've spent more time than I really wanted to in care homes in the past few years. I've seen abusive care home workers - who were shouting at patients, not ensuring food was eaten, leaving patients soiled. And this is before you get the documented more severe forms of abuse - physical and sexual. Why are these human rights abuses just ignored and everyone so focused on the needs of people coming from overseas? Surely charity should begin at home?

Being a care home worker is very hard job to do well and I couldn't do it. I've got multiple degrees but I simply do not have the patience or emotional resilience to do that job. The idea someone who's a genuine asylum seeker has the levels of emotional resilience and patience required to NOT be abusive in this environment is frankly fucking batshit and offensive both to refugees and to the extremely vulnerable and often disabled residents of care homes.

I'm sure there are some exceptional refugees who could do it, but they'll be the exception IMO. I've been in both good and bad care homes. The good staff are miracle workers and worth their weight in gold and not paid nearly enough. This idea because it's a min wage (at entry level) job just anyone can do it is offensive.

Not quite sure here, but I think you're on the right track.

I agree with shutting the traffickers down. But the government needs to provide a means of claiming asylum from another country, if it wants to stop traffickers.

If they agreed to process asylum claims in France, they're be no need for peoples to take that risky journey, and no money for the traffickers to make.

Thank you for saying what I was going to say! I live in a town that is up in arms about a centre being set up ! The ignorance of the protesters is astounding! Can be sure that many people who are protesting are not the best ‘role models’ for their country!

We can't just cut it. Not unless we want to copy Trump, heaven forbid. Each country's contribution is based on an internationally agreed formula. We're extremely lucky to have been allowed to retain some in the short term to deal with this issue.

The other thing that isn't talked about nearly enough is people who arrive here illegally and just disappear and become criminals. We know it is happening. Here someone is interviewed who has been in the UK and had his asylum claim rejected 4 times and yet is still here who freely admits it is tempting to do something criminal to end up in prison. Ok fine, I do have sympathy for him (particularly as he hasn't ruined someone else's life in this way) but what about the victims of the people who DO turn to crime?

Only the feelings and needs and lives of one set of people are ever considered in this debate. Do we think the children raped by illegal immigrants will ever recover? Of course they won't. In the recent cases of child rape by illegal immigrants, some of these men have already been in prison for similar crimes in other countries before they even get here. Not enough is done to identify criminals on entry.

People are disappearing 'daily' from asylum hotels, says whistleblower | UK News | Sky News

So if a few girls were murdered (Rhiannon was), or raped (as those 2 afghans did to that girl in the park) it's just an unfortunate consequence we have to accept?

We can decide not to be a part of it and do what we want. We are a sovereign state you know

So if thousands die in a war torn country because we refuse asylum that’s just an unfortunate consequence we have to accept?

It is depressing, but to move forward in society it’s important everyone sees all views from every side.

I’d loathe a society where we didn’t help those in need. Id also be distraught if I were in that position and no one decided to help.

On the other hand, you must understand the frustrations of others, whether it be right or not. I met a guy in the fish and chip shop last week who was an asylum seeker from Afghanistan, he was going to visit his wife and baby in Pakistan this week, where they safely live. I can see why this would piss people off in a country that’s slowly going downhill.

Unfortunately, when a country is suffering with COL and increase in crime, people need someone to blame. What we need is less propaganda in the media and more money pumped into public services.