DD’s birthday was an utter disaster

[bendmeoverbackwards]

It’s DD’s 19th birthday today. She’s ASD and has been out of education for a few years.

Last couple of birthdays have been disappointing to her and I know this one brought up a lot of emotion not just about birthdays but also her situation in general.

I asked her a few weeks ago if she wanted to see a particular show and a meal at a steak place. She just said no but gave no other suggestions. I then asked last week of she wanted just a meal out and where - no response. So I decided to book a local restaurant just in case as Saturday nights get busy, with the option of cancelling if she didn’t want to.

When I told her, she wasn’t happy and said she couldn’t do it now because I’d chosen it (autistic brain). I asked where else she’d like to go but didn’t get a reply. I suggested a takeaway, took hours of questions about this, she didn’t see a takeaway as a birthday celebration. She eventually decided on pizza.

I also got her a beautiful personalised cake. Last year for her 18th, I got her a nice chocolate cake with her name on but it didn’t have the same personalisation as her older sister’s 18th birthday cake (which was celebrated in lockdown so I pushed the boat out a bit). Also the board base was accidentally thrown out when there was a tiny bit of chocolate left on it. She complained about this for months. I said I would buy her an extra cake (cheapy supermarket cake) but I forgot.

Now she says she can’t have this year’s cake because of the lack of the other one and it would be in the wrong order (autistic brain again).

Choosing presents is also difficult for her so I chose a few small gifts and paid in £50 birthday money into her account. She didn’t like this either, she wanted to choose her own presents (but from past experience she takes ages to choose, months and months, so I thought I’d make it easier by giving her money).

Written down, I realise she sounds like a spoilt brat. But I didn’t do some things that I said I would eg buy her an additional cake and take her for a belated birthday meal (from last year).

The evening ended with her sobbing in the kitchen and me losing my temper 😢

You have a volatile, hostile, abusive young women who has tantrums for a year over cake. You claim she can't work or be in education but is an education snob. Yet won't go an work for a university placement. You think this is someone to be responsible for vulnerable children?? What if they tell her No?

If she can be responsible for babysitting, you are a mug. Stop treating her like a toddler. She needs to grow up and you need to stop supporting her to do nothing. She either goes to college or gets a job or moves out.

Ignore this for starters.

Its not too late, its a good time to transition away from supporting your DD as a child to supporting her into adulthood- building her coping mechanisms and resilience while putting your boundaries in place and not allowing her to treat you badly, speak to her dad rudely, and blaming you for things in the past when you have done nothing but try to help her.
Find a mantra to repeat that confirms you love her, you’re on her side but she has to work this out / speak to you respectfully/ take responsibility for her own actions and responses.

You can do this and she will be better in the long term because of your love

No it’s not too late but now is the time to act before it gets too late. That’s why waiting for a spontaneous recovery seems risky to me.
The longer the current status quo continues the more it will just be the norm and will be harder to change.
It’s about the trajectory isn’t it?
It might take her longer to get somewhere but she should be making some progress even if it’s small. She should not be going backwards at least.

You have enabled your daughter so much that she’s now unable to thrive. If she’s able to babysit for other people children then she can do a childcare course? And stop her allowance. Then she will have a motivation to earn. She may be autistic but she does have capacity to learn. And if she’s disputing that she is autistic then you tell her she’s an adult who has to earn her own way. I’m assuming you do everything for her too?

But a wheelchair worker isn't abusing people by needing a ramp or a wider door!!!

I don’t think l ever said burnout requires a period of doing ‘fuck all for 5 years’

My dd got GCSE’s in severe burnout. Was very ill for a year, including self harm then started to recover. She’s still in and out now but at university. The entire cycle from entry to exit takes 5 years. If it’s bad.

And even though it doesn’t ’exist as a diagnosis’ she was diagnosed by the children’s neurodiverse service at out local hospital. A huge building full of specialist nurses, psychologists and pyschiatrist. All use the term freely. Didn’t even know what it was until the senior pyschiatrist and senior pyschologist told me. Specialists and experts in ND.

Op mine did an Access course after being too ill for A levels. She’s still had an EHCp but it made no difference. There was no support!

Shes at a redbrick now. It can be done. It was the hardest 5 years of our life. And it still is very hard. She’s yellow with exhaustion a lot of the time. But she was determined to go.Your dd sounds highly anxious. That’s what’s causing all the refusals to see medics/go back to education.

I’d start by talking about anxiety first.

My 7 year old is autistic and a lot of what youve said sounds like it could be our future. I set deadlines for telling me what he wants for birthdays/Christmas and thats working so far. Birthday plans are a nightmare, he wants a party but cant make up his mind then complains for years that he'd have rather had a different party that he hadn't even thought of at the time of the party 😂.
I now show him all his gifts from me before the day as surprises cause him so much worry. He can accept surprises from others if he knows his main gifts.

I think you need to explain to your DD how her reactions to everything around her birthday make you and DH feel. Go over basic boundaries again like conversations have to be paused if she starts swearing/being rude to people.
Tell her you arent willing to 'owe' her things for years and that you are human too and she is also capable of politely reminding you if you have forgotten something like the cake. Out of interest does she do anything for your or her dads birthday? Sometimes its easier to learn by doing/learning to think of others.

I vividly remember our school careers advisor telling us that in his many years of experience, there are always some young adults who don't cope with university and need to come back home. Back then (late 90s early 00s) it was just framed as a "thing" which apparently was very common and almost to be expected.

So unsurprisingly, about 5% of all the people from our graduation class ended up quitting their first year of uni due to MH issues, moved back with their parents and ended up doing something completely different. However it was very similar to your story...nobody hit rock bottom and ended up isolated in the room without showering or human contact. Most decided to pursue an easier degree closer to home or learn something less demanding or get a job.

Looking back it was clearly obvious that those were undiagnosed ND kids who crashed out after leaving the routine of school life. Most had to move away from home and live alone in a different city or even country so it was a massive shock. I was lucky to have been in a larger city where several friends from school were also studying and we formed an informal "support group" to survive the first year. We were all (undiagnosed) ND as well. I recall the first year being very shit, calling my parents up crying but muddled through somehow. None of us were good at cooking or cleaning but thankfully meals were cheap back then so we just went out to eat or shared takeaways most of the time.

I've just had a read through your old threads OP. It was a bit sad, multiple threads asking if you have made a rod for your own back as your DD is not getting up for school and refusing to give you her devices while swearing she isn't on them, only for you to find out she is messaging friends at 3am. Calling her older sister 'it' and 'thing' and ringing you from upstairs during a meal so you will bring her a plate of food as she won't eat with the family.

You mentioned on one of your threads you had a difficult relationship with your own mother. You are terrified to say no to your child in case she stops liking you, and have been fr, far too permissive. It's salvageable, but you need to stop the pandering right now, stop giving her money and tell her firmly that she's an adult, she can behave with decency or she can find somewhere else to live. You asked on several other threads: 'have I made a rod for my own back?' - yes you have, but you can fix it.

I know this is controversial and I honestly don’t want to traduce your DDs experience but I do feel a bit compelled to add that there was a whole huge building of specialist Drs, psychologists etc at the Tavistock who insisted that affirming gender dysphoria in neurodiverse youth and giving them puberty blockers was a good idea. It’s often important to exercise some scepticism about expert opinion where this is in advance of scientific evidence.

It's not your fault, it's not her fault. It just is what it is and all you can do is try your best and carry on

I would be seriously circumspect if a psychiatrist told you that "burnout" was a diagnosis.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow what did these psychiatrists tell you they meant by the word "burnout"?

I am very open to changing things actually and am reading every post. I’m just scared. Scared of making things worse.

The other thing is that dd often says I’m the only thing she’s got in her life which is very sad. She’s very dependent on me emotionally. I’d love to cut the apron strings a bit but I worry that this might push her over the edge into a dark place if she feels she’s ‘lost’ me. Ideally I want to toughen up a bit but still do it in a loving connected way.

OP’s dd hasn’t been diagnosed with burnout. She’s got an autism diagnosis she refutes. No treatment or medication.
If she’s doesn’t believe in her diagnosis then she doesn’t need to disclose it. Her prerogative.
You haven’t mentioned how she fills her time Op?
Would an online access course be an option? Or self study for A levels. She must be bored out of her mind.

She doesn’t generally do much for our birthdays, however this year for mine she made me a cake from scratch, she was up till 2am decorating it. I was shocked and hugely touched ❤️

She doesn’t do much all day sadly. I’m not really sure because I’m out at work most days. She makes herself some brunch late morning then goes back upstairs. Comes down for dinner and sometimes watches TV with me and dh, sometimes we play chess (she’s very good). It’s a miserable existence, I can’t imagine having nothing to do all day. She sees friends but only occasionally.

What is she doing in her room. Presumably down a rabbit hole of social media?
Diagnosis of autism or not anyone would feel shit holed up in a room doing nothing but sitting on phone all day everyday.

I also agree that meditation might be a good idea. But she just won’t see a doctor to discuss or investigate it. She says she is traumatised by medical professionals.

You sound lovely but your daughter is walking all over you. But it's never too late to change. 💐 It sounds like she's actually pretty capable when she chooses to be, which is a good sign. In your shoes I would try a completely new approach, as the no demand stuff clearly isn't working. I'd stop her allowance and stop buying her things. Just cook her basic food, buy her supermarket own brand basic toiletries, literally just enough for her to stay fed and clean. No more paying for cosmetics, hair products, treats. No new clothes; she can wear her current ones. If she wants anything more she can pay for it herself from babysitting or getting another job as well. It sounds like she does fine caring for children, so she could get a job in a nursery or as a nanny? Or if she decides to go back to education and do an access course or an NVQ or something you could restart a modest allowance contingent on her sticking to the course. Or she could look at the Open University. I studied through there and you don't need A-levels or any qualifications to enrol, she'd be able to start a degree straight away. Obviously it's up to you, but that's what I would try in your situation. All the best. 💐

I thought low demand parenting was supposed to be to help a burned out child stabilize. After that, even for a child with PDA, bringing in natural consequences bit by bit is the way to help them build the skills they need to get on in the world.

It seems like your low demand gave her the space to develop some skills as she can cope with the babysitting etc. But instead of building on that everything's just stayed the same and she isn't being given the opportunity she needs to build further skills.

Being unhappy in her situation isn't at odds with her also being comfortable. Comfortable in this context isn't equivalent to happy - it means she is in a world she knows inside and out. Everything works as she expects it too, even if she doesn't "like" it, and she does not have to adapt or do new things. But at this age that is inappropriate. She needs to be developing, not staying the same or she will be stuck in perpetual childhood. So withdrawing some of your support so she needs to find ways to provide her own would be a good first step. You can collaborate with and scaffold for her if she wants it, but she needs to take responsibility.

If you just keep up the low demand and let things go on, she may eventually come out the other side, very very slowly building skills. But even if so, she will have lost years of her life and that loss will impact her for the rest of her life.

You can't win for losing here, and it's nobody's fault.

Put it behind you.

Don't do anything next year.

Focus on getting your daughter to get medical attention.

Other people have also mentioned a childcare course but dd is an academic snob and sees it a beneath her. She also loves animals; a while ago I found a brilliant animal care course that was equivalent to 3 A levels. When I told her, she was offended that I’d even suggested it.

I’d draw a line in sand and set out your expectations going forward, present a united front with her dad.
Be clear you aren’t interested in dredging over past. Follow up by a clear message.
I’d cut any spending on her except absolute essentials. I bet no working phone or WiFi at home in day forces her out of her room for a start.
You can’t force her to see gp, enroll on a course, volunteer etc. But you don’t have to pussyfoot around her. Make it clear she needs to be doing something, living at home doing nothing isn’t an option anymore. You can’t wind clock back but you can be clear with your expectations going forward.
How do you react when she’s snobby?
Time for bluntness. She’s clearly not afraid of speaking her mind. Speak yours. I know what I’d say to an unemployed 19 yr old lazing around all day while I was working.