DD’s birthday was an utter disaster

[bendmeoverbackwards]

It’s DD’s 19th birthday today. She’s ASD and has been out of education for a few years.

Last couple of birthdays have been disappointing to her and I know this one brought up a lot of emotion not just about birthdays but also her situation in general.

I asked her a few weeks ago if she wanted to see a particular show and a meal at a steak place. She just said no but gave no other suggestions. I then asked last week of she wanted just a meal out and where - no response. So I decided to book a local restaurant just in case as Saturday nights get busy, with the option of cancelling if she didn’t want to.

When I told her, she wasn’t happy and said she couldn’t do it now because I’d chosen it (autistic brain). I asked where else she’d like to go but didn’t get a reply. I suggested a takeaway, took hours of questions about this, she didn’t see a takeaway as a birthday celebration. She eventually decided on pizza.

I also got her a beautiful personalised cake. Last year for her 18th, I got her a nice chocolate cake with her name on but it didn’t have the same personalisation as her older sister’s 18th birthday cake (which was celebrated in lockdown so I pushed the boat out a bit). Also the board base was accidentally thrown out when there was a tiny bit of chocolate left on it. She complained about this for months. I said I would buy her an extra cake (cheapy supermarket cake) but I forgot.

Now she says she can’t have this year’s cake because of the lack of the other one and it would be in the wrong order (autistic brain again).

Choosing presents is also difficult for her so I chose a few small gifts and paid in £50 birthday money into her account. She didn’t like this either, she wanted to choose her own presents (but from past experience she takes ages to choose, months and months, so I thought I’d make it easier by giving her money).

Written down, I realise she sounds like a spoilt brat. But I didn’t do some things that I said I would eg buy her an additional cake and take her for a belated birthday meal (from last year).

The evening ended with her sobbing in the kitchen and me losing my temper 😢

Time to stop pandering to her now. At 19 she's not a child and even with ASD, needs to be told when she's being ridiculous. The time for lovely birthdays and presents galore has past, she's an adult in her own right and needs to be told she's lucky to have anyone make such a fuss of her and she needs to be told to be grateful for what she's given or she won't be having anything next year! Sorry OP but I feel you've made a rod for your own back and your DH is right. She needs to fit in to this world not the world bend around her, ASD or not. She has to learn now or she'll have great difficulty learning later when you aren't there to fix everything for her. I say this as mum to two ND teens so have experience in this area. It's not easy to navigate but you need to have the same expectations of your DD as you would for any NT person. Good luck!

Oh FFS, here we go, Reform have arrived.

FWIW, I have 2 ASD kids, one also has PDA.
At 19 the one with PDA was probably acting like OPs DD with regard to demands placed on her.
With proper understanding, and proper communication she is now earning over £60k a year in a field that suits her and is understanding of her needs (data).
DS is 23, has ASD and on £55k (AI).

They aren't and never have been on benefits.
So what is your answer to this perceived ASD workforce crisis?
Beat the ASD out of them?
Tell them that it isn't real?
Or work with them to improve knowledge of their condition, improve communication techniques, make reasonable adjustments, and harness talent.

This.

When you said in your first post OP that written down you know she sounds like a brat, that’s your answer Op.

I appreciate she has to deal with austism, but she is clearly very well able to communicate so I can only assume v high functioning (sorry that language may be outdated).

You as her parent need to prepare her to live in the world. I get that you feel for her and I do too tbh, but you need to decide where the line is and stick to it.

The lockdown cake thing sounds like regular sibling rivalry. The conversation about it ends now. You tell her that you doing your best. There was a valid reason her sister got a more OTT cake. It doesn’t mean you were playing favourites and end the conversation. She takes what you are offering now or she goes without.

If she didn’t take you up on offers to buy certain things that’s on her. No more endless conversations.

If you want to give her something, offer it, if she can’t decide etc give her a defined amount of time to and then stop talking about it.

You have go teach her to function in the world. Is she still going to be crying in your kitchen about cakes at 29?

This all sounds so difficult. Is pandering to this behaviour helping? I have no knowledge of life with an autistic child, but my instinct would be that your daughter (especially given her age) needs to learn that life is never ‘perfect’. You did your upmost to make her birthday special and she still wasn’t happy - I feel you’re setting yourself up for failure by trying to meet her expectations - and more importantly not helping her to see that her expectations are unreasonable (and her reactions too).

I think people want to try to do the right thing by people who are ND or mentally ill, but it’s difficult, and just “be kind “ doesn’t cut it.

Tricky

….so not part of the workforce crisis whatsoever? Functioning members of society as many people with additional needs can be with the right guidance and adjustments? Exactly what @Playingvideogames, who you’re berating and accusing of being ‘Reform’ (weird one), is advocating for?

I think there comes a point when if your suggestions are rebuffed & no others are given you have to leave it at that.

Is this resentment that her older sister got a "better" cake for her 18th?

I totally agree with this. The most controversial opinion I have is that autism is NOT a disability at all but a different way of neurological processing. I strongly believe that many of the most successful, richest and talented people in human history were all autistic. They were obviously never diagnosed because their achievements eclipsed the need for an explanation into their behaviour.

Autism can go both ways depending on the individual and it's very hard to predict how it affects the course of one person's life. The problem with too much autism accommodation is that it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy (or manifestation or whatnot). If a child grows up knowing they have a condition that is supposed to hinder them, they internalise that belief and don't end up achieving to their full potential even with all accommodations given.

Our entire family is almost certainly autistic but with high achievers who fall through the gaps of diagnosis. DH has a habit of befriending other high achievers who are clearly ND and it's almost comical to me how he doesn't seem to realise this. When a person has enough money, autism actually becomes enjoyable because there are limitless ways to accommodate your own needs but still be part of mainstream society. There are loads of extremely successful ND people so they tend to form their own cliques where nobody needs to mask as much and they don't struggle with the unspoken NT social rules. And they break the NT social hierarchy because having wealth or success means they get accepted within most groups without having to fight for a place.

I know this doesn't really apply to OP's situation but it's important to know that autism is not a disability. It's a huge disservice to compare it to being "in a wheelchair" when it was probably responsible for some of the greatest advancements of humankind.

I have to say I agree. And i have an 8 year old with ASD.If she behaved like this even at her age I would be calling her out for being ungrateful- mild autism should not excuse continued rudeness or a consistent disregard and lack of consideration for others feelings.It sounds like you have tried your best to be caring and empathetic, but unfortunately overdone it and this has turned into enabling her to behave that way and disrespect you with you excusing actual bad behaviour due to her ASD and she is used to holding all the control.
Fair enough give her some basic choices but the line has to be drawn somewhere and she needs to accept that.
In future give her afew options/choices regarding birthday presents/cake but if she cannot decide or does not like any option, you choose and she needs to be grateful for the effort you have made.
Not suprised you lost your temper to be honest!

She sounds really ungrateful. You sound a lovely Mum. I wouldn't make an effort next year

I think saying ‘the world can’t change for neurodivergent people’ is taking it a bit far, we ~should~ always be aiming to be more inclusive, but it ~does~ have to be reasonable.
Children I think do need special accommodations, BUT in some cases the focus needs to shift to their long-term welfare rather than short-term wishes.

I wouldn’t have had your patience to begin with! Not surprised that you were sobbing. Please cut yourself some slack - you went above and beyond by the sounds of it.

Absolutely spot on! You explained it so well. My own comment was a blunt, emotional reaction to the whole situation described (and exacerbated by comments like the one about only autism mums getting to have an opinion). But your comment actually sums up the problem properly - mums think they have to make perfect memories all the time, but no-one seems to remember that around an individual there is also society. We can’t just all have things exactly our own way all the time, and parents don’t just need to make their children happy all the time, through cakes and presents. They have to help to produce a next generation of useful, functional adults, yes they should also be supported to have good mental health and should be allowed to strive for happiness and fulfilment, but this is not achieved by just letting children be exactly the way they feel they want to be at any moment and making excuses.All children and young people need guidance and boundaries. This may look different but endless cakes and perfect birthdays are not that important if you can’t help your child build coping mechanisms & resilience.

It’s not autism, it’s her age, she doesn’t want you to fuss over it. By 16 my “typical” dd made all her own arrangements, I’d ask my autistic dd but she never wanted to do anything so I would just say we are going out for dinner with grandparents and not make a big thing. Was her birthday last week, older now, and I booked afternoon tea, low key place which she enjoyed but not “for your birthday” talk and I give her money

If your still here op which I doubt as people are so mean and clearly no understanding of demand avoidance or pda

what aren’t doing for you? You need support for yourself in order to be strong for your daughter. You haven’t failed.
id look at ways you can get strength and something back for you. Parenting a young adult with autism is tough.

inlnow meds arnt always the answer but I cope much better when in a low dose of antidepressants for myself. It’s stops
me doom
mongering and I do more for me and less guilt. I also see a therapist once a month and get a 6 weekly massage. Obviously that cost money so not for all but a lovely walk or something that makes you happy.

I second discussing stuff (or communicating) via a WhatsApp with you, DH and DD in. Takes the heat out of it.

Just pay the money into an account - either a "pot" in something like Monzo, or name the transactions, ask once (message) about preferences a month or so before the occasion then drop the rope.

Probably better do the same for the other sibling.

And I am going to take my own advice for my own child who to add to the fun, has a Boxing Day birthday!

I get that Autism can be challenging for both the sufferer and also everyone around them. But it seems to me that your DD is so wrapped up in how she feels that she is selfishly ignoring the impact that she is having on people around her.
She is an adult and like it or not needs to understand that she is not the only one to have disappointments in life. You do, your DH does, she does and everyone around her. We all have to live with things not going the way we want them but we can't all blame autism because we are not all autistic and don't have that as an excuse for irrational behaviour. I know autistic people and brains work differently but that doesn't mean that they can continually have their behaviour enabled.
If she does not respond to requests for birthday ideas (or anything else for that matter) because it's too much pressure - then don't do them. When she does eventually come up with something - work with it then - if she complains - turn it back on her that it is or was her problem that she didn't act upon it but now that she is ready you will do whatever she has finally suggested. She needs to take repsonsibility for her actions and behaviours and not throw a wobbly because in her eyes it is all wrong. You can't do right for doing wrong - so put it on her consistently so she can learn from it.

@MothersDaughter007 exactly. I work in mental health with very severely mentally ill people, and I tell them too: your illness is not an excuse to be rude to me.

You did your best OP and shouldn’t feel bad.

Your daughter sounds v difficult.

It's not weird at all.
Reform have stated that they want to cut funding for SEND and the costs of welfare.
The whole "we need to stop pandering to them" trope is becoming quite dangerous. You can't get rid of PDA by telling people to man up.

What we need is proper funding and support for mental health, and reasonable adjustments in educational and work settings. That is not pandering to people.

Agree with this - and it becomes an cycle. The more parents pander at home and then press for accommodations, the more people in school etc will bend and accommodate them; the more they then continue to demand at home and then expect in the workplace/school. And the less capable they become of dealing with adversity and disappointment.

My DD has had a nightmare at uni because she expects to be forgiven attendance because she AUDHD and is tired/has a headache etc… the automatic assignment extensions are given at the outset. She is brusque to the point of insensitive and rude as a 20 year old in a way she absolutely was NOT at 12 or 13… and then wonders why her flatmates (who tbh really are being absolute c*nts, and not only to her but a couple of others in her halls) do seem to have targeted her and upped the ante due to how unreservedly prickly she can be. She has had to move out this week because guests asked if she was the ‘retard’.

Not forgivable in the least in terms of ableist bullying… but she expects the world to bend around her, feels that with her diagnosis of Autism she is no longer required to even try to ‘mask’ anymore as she has a life-long get-out-of social-niceties card, (again, note, having been a lovely, considerate and polite child prior to covid/puberty). I am now having to forcibly push back because I realise we spent the last decade tip-toeing around her, trying to avoid the melt-downs [and the pain and disruption to family life], when I should have been setting harder boundaries and reminding her of how [she knows] to behave. Yes at 20 she is legally an adult; yes she has the emotional development of a 15 year old with a near genius brain… but I enabled and facilitated her becoming - well - a rather self-centred and entitled young adult. It’s on me to come down harder, which we are now trying to do. We know she is a great kid really, but unless other people can see that, she will be very lonely. We’ve done her a disservice by not pushing back sooner. As an AuDHD person myself and with a DS who is also AuDHD, I know that she is in part the way she is because we have been fearful parents, not because ‘she is autistic’.

As a parent our job is to scaffold our kids into independent adulthood, to help them become likeable compassionate people so that their lives are proliferated with OTHER people who will love and support them - first, along side us and, later, when we are no longer there.

Pandering and adjustments are different things entirely. OP has pandered. A workplace makes adjustments. Pandering is no use whatsoever and adds to people being unable to exist within the world around them.

Apologies that I haven't RTFT, but I wanted to ask: have you posted about this before? Last year's birthday or Xmas, perhaps? It sounds quite familiar.

I think autistic people can be areseholds just like like NT people can. I think you need to start drawing lines in the sand because she sounds exhausting with her contradictory demands.

Could you try (for future) a clear statement of your intent? So, DD, this is the cake, this is the plan. If you have another cake or plan in mind let me know by (date) and we will do that instead? Because some of the stress here seems to be about her struggling with the 'what do you want?' aspect.
As for the past cake issues, I think rather than trying to rectify them so they stop being issues, you may need to accept that for DD they will remain issues, you can't 'compensate', so the focus should be on her managing her feelings around the past disappointments.