Man left his girlfriend to freeze to death

[Trevordidit]

Man left his girlfriend to freeze when she was struggling on a mountain hike.

He's been found guilty of manslaughter.

So many aspects of his account don't make sense - AIBU to wonder if he did it on purpose?

News article

It can, but it doesn't here.

Yep, it could mean “I’m so done with this climb” by itself (fix und fertig), but the “we’re already back down” text is pretty unambiguous in German.

Definitely needs a retrial and maybe a new judge. Would love to know how the prosecution dealt with his vagueness and refusal to answer why he behaved the way he did.

Thanks for all the very informative posts. It seems to make less and less sense and look worse and worse in terms of TP's actions or lack of.

So. Kirsten's text to her mother was a lie. Or she didn't send it. There's no other explanation.

They can check phone ping alerts to see if/when her phone was turned off or ran out of battery. Since saying I thought it was unlikely their phones ran out of juice, I’ve found out that cold can have a severe impact on phone battery life. Knowing that as he must have done as an experienced winter mountaineer, why didn’t he have a charger?

I'm wondering if he told her they were almost down, lying to her, to stop her calling for help. She could have been struggling so much and disorientated that she believed him and text her mum.

I think the experience aspect is almost irrelevant.

There are so many aspects that make no sense at all. Like why he refused so many opportunities for help, didn't try to call, didn't use her phone if his was low on battery, that she was found in totally different circumstances than he claims he left her, didn't make any attempt to keep her warm etc. None of those aspects need experience.

His lead as a climber was crucial. Kerstin had trust in him, despite her previous doubts. Other aspects that you mention support that.

That's a supposition, with all due respect.

What is known are her texts not just on the winter tour but also a text weeks before when she expressed clearly that she had no experience of the tour.

He took the lead. .

Yes from the point of view of her vulnerability.

But the differing levels of experience don't seem to account for the majority of the situation after the accident. If the same things had happened to two people with equal levels of experience I'd still be questioning if something sinister happened.

It sounds more like two idiots that have never climbed a mountain before going up ben nevis in flip flops. No backup phone battery, no food or proper snacks, no safety plan, no attempt at the very basics of first aid or rescue procedures, not using safety gear they had with them. No one is that stupid if they have experience. Not blaming K at all BTW... I wouldn't be surprised if he said he had food etc.

With the ex girlfriends evidence I'd lean towards coercive control being involved.

Complete supposition!

That's all very good except that he had climbed Großglockner 14/15 times before. It's a summit that's 3,798 metres. That involves abseiling and there's a constant webcam directed towards the mountain. Two headlights went up to near summit and one came down.

The highest mountain in the UK is Ben Nevis 1,345 metres.

Webcam here.https://www.grossglockner.at/en/for-your-visit/webcam-weather

I was joking....

What i was getting at is that both their levels of experience weren't obvious from the abundant level of basic mistakes made.

This case has really bothered me.

As someone who used to climb and trek a lot, this looks like murder.

Only having gummi bears to eat for a climb which was at least 12 hours seems bizarre. And the irony of them going via Frühstrüksplatz with nothing but sweets in their pockets and frozen tea (it means breakfast area/place/square)

I do think she died earlier, before he left her.
I don't know how or why, maybe a fall.
I guess time of death can't be estimated in this situation?Surely the headlamp torches etc that are visible on the web cam could tell when they stopped moving and for how long and show when he left her? actually they do have this info don't they?
I also think he sent the text to her mum-again no real idea why!

There's so much context missing.

Did she usually text her mum when she got back from climbing? Or was that unusual? Was her mum an agreed emergency contact? Was she usually reckless with these things or was it out of character to lie?

The ex girlfriend said he did similar to her on the same mountain. Was that the only time he lost temper with her or was there a pattern of that sort of issue (either on mountains or more generally).

Was the police call not recorded? I thought that was standard practise.

Why did the other mountaineers call for help-what exactly was their concern and were they called as witnesses?

It's just all very odd and they seem to have skimmed over much of the evidence.

It was a very starry night but the wind whipped up to almost 50 mph which is a lot on a mountain when the temperature was already -7c, so wind-chill took it to -19.

The headlamps were visible so ascent was measured. It took almost 9 hours to ascend 91 metres.

Agree with this. People are giving him way too much benefit of the doubt. It’s not that complicated. He did similar with a previous girlfriend. Some people are just sinister and if you spoke in depth to people he grew up with and went to school with you’d get a better idea of what he’s like. Too often we are told to ignore gut feelings about people when the gut feeling is very often correct. Will be interesting to see if he does something similar in years to come.

At least Treadwell had the decency to get himself killed along with his hapless, too trusting girlfriend. 🙄

Do they have an exact time of death for Kerstin? I know it is tricky because she was frozen by the time the rescue team found her the following day.

Were they able to narrow it down? I read that the police took the phones and IIRC Apple watches to examine? Did these narrow it down?

Didn't the camera reveal they stop moving as a pair at around 8.50 from their headlamps?

Yes I asked the same thing but I don’t think we have any answers to time of death. Surely the smart watch could show something. Unless not working in the cold or out of batteries.

I think this makes sense that she died before he left her hence the fake text to mum and why he didn’t wrap her up (already dead). They had not been moving for a long time by the time he left. He may have thought it was somehow more socially acceptable or he’d be less to blame if she died when he wasn’t there.

She sent the text before the helicopter rescuers saw her moving with him on the climb.

But what could be the significance of the judge questioning the rescuers about the position she was found - he asked if she could have fallen and they said she couldn’t have and then reiterated that she wasn’t wearing gloves. It’s difficult not speaking the language to understand if there are any implications from this. Then they said it was a miracle her body had stayed in the position it had given the wind force.