To think the most shocking thing about James VDB's death is...

[Hitthebestbooth]

...that a famous actor, recognised worldwide for his role in Dawson's Creek (putting this in the first lines for the benefit of MNetters who love to comment 'who??' on these threads) struggled to pay for his cancer treatment? His death has left his family 'out of funds'.

Now, James Van der Beek had enough fame and affection from fans that a Go Fund Me has raised a lot to support his family already. But there must be countless families across America who are ruined by medical bills - if Dawson couldn't pay for his cancer treatment, how do non-famous people in ordinary jobs cope? What do their families do after they've been crippled by the costs and still lose their loved one along with their homes and security for their children?

As a millennial, I was so sad to read of James' death. I loved Dawson's Creek. But it makes me very afraid for a future where Farage gets his hands on the NHS and we find ourselves in this position too. I have plenty of bad experiences with our healthcare system and am not saying it's perfect. But if I or my husband are diagnosed with cancer tomorrow, we won't have to sell our possessions or ask friends and family for money or risk leaving our kids with no home after treatment costs. There are plenty of wealthy people out there eager to take the NHS apart and sell it off, and for all people say we'd get a European system and it would be improved, it seems far more likely that capitalist greed will win out and we'll actually get an American model.

James Van der Beek's death highlights just how ruinous that model is. He spent his illness selling off memorabilia and trying to raise money. He died knowing his family's finances were left decimated. And he was someone with more resources than most. It's a sobering indictment of how bad things can get, and I am truly afraid that a Reform government would put us all in that dystopian scenario.

There are all kinds of options I could put for a poll but I'm just trying to make it really simple.

YABU - US healthcare is fine
YANBU - US healthcare is a terrifying prospect

Sorry haven't rtft but I don't really think you can compare US with UK or anywhere else. It's an entirely different system and unless we are familiar with the system then there is no point in discussing the financial position of one individual. All I can say in relation to that is that if I was in a country where health insurance was impossible without a regular stable job, then I would have gotten a regular and stable job. If that meant giving up my creative outlet, then so be it. Its simple as that. Most people do that to pay the mortgage or rent.

Im not in UK so won't comment on that either, but where i am the difference in public and private is stark. I have a friend who was a single mum on a low income for years and no matter how bad things got she paid her private health insurance, i appreciate there are those on even lower income that literally can't afford this, but believe me when i say money was tight. No holidays for years and years, sometimes housebound for a weekend because she didn't have cash for petrol. She is very ill now possibly terminal and is getting top rate care privately. Yes she would still get treatment on the public system but given the nature of her illness she would probably not have detected it without immediate intervention so its very likely she would not have survived so far. Her careful financial planning is what is keeping her alive for now.

Yup. It's not as appealing as it used to be, obviously, but why anyone would think it's the land of milk and honey is sorely mistaken

@user37597473785 well thank god someone as brick headed as you isn’t in charge. Anyone with a current chronic illness would either be gouged or uninsurable for any cover right now.

Because of my illness 20 years ago, and its complexity, I cannot get life, health, critical illness, income or travel related insurance. I have used brokers, I’ve gone directly, I’ve consulted specialist firms. No one will touch me despite the fact my condition has meant I get incredibly thorough check ups every year and have a better picture of my health and future outcomes than most people.

Now think about people with asthma, diabetes, PMS, PCOS, mental health issues - under a mandatory insurance system they are screwed on premiums. Did you know that even getting a positive change result on a smear can invalidate all health related insurance packages?

Health insurance, especially under the US model, is a money making business. It will seek to screw you over in every way it can before it has to cover any cost. It’s about as supportive to health outcomes as those ads promoting the health benefits of smoking were.

Does the NHS need support in restructuring - yes. That restructuring is not because of ‘immigrants’ coming and treating it like a health spa. It’s because of purposeful, chronic under investment by the previous government specifically to run it into the ground and break it into parts for private firm shareholders to pick up.

I agree re awful situation with US insurance.
The only problem is nhs care is pretty crap. Do we really think we would even have found his cancer before it was terminal. In USA they can have the checks that may have found it early, yearly colonoscopy
Here im sure it mut be at least 50 and probably 1 check?

On an inidividual level paying in uk for private medical insurance probably makes sense.
In uk i cant get treated for pcos/my throid. My kid is on a 3yr + asd waitlist. Waited 3 years for adhd diagnosis and now another 3m++ for meds.

A relative had a stroke but obviously didnt get diagnosed for days (probably partly because he didnt want to wait in a&e if it wasnt that. )

Its the meds mostly keeping older people alive here

@Over40Overdating This is also cost-related, but having lived in the US for several years now, I will say that the preventive care is much better than in the UK. We have annual physicals, mammograms offered every year from 40 onwards, plus it’s much easier to see a consultant. My children are registered with a pediatrician, for example, they don’t see a GP.

Of course it’s designed to save insurance companies money as conditions will be detected and treated early, I.e., it’s less expensive.

I'm so sorry that you're going through this.

Well his cancer wasn't found until Stage 3 and he obviously couldn't be cured as he died within a couple of years of diagnosis, so in terms of detection and prevention the US system didn't work for him. He became an advocate of early screening but clearly it was not a routine thing for people his age - he found out due to a change in bowel habits, not via screening. I have been languishing on an NHS waiting list for a gynae issue (women's health is shocking) but when I had a cancer scare I was seen immediately and my mind put at rest straight away.

@Hitthebestbooth 45 is the recommended age to start routine screenings in the US (it used to be 50) so he probably hadn’t been screened yet as he was only just old enough, poor man.

It’s like being offered a smear test or mammogram, it’s optional and not everyone chooses to be screened if they don’t think they’re high-risk.

People should have kids. Perhaps they thought they could afford them? I doubt they expected to be struck down by bowel cancer - and the US system doesn't seem to do preventive medicine or early diagnosis very well.

Article explaining why James VDB didn't get rich from Dawson's Creek:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-15553215/Dawsons-Creek-contract-clause-James-Van-Der-Beek-no-money-reruns.html

DH and I watch a lot of Medical Detectives/Forensic Files stuff and he commented today that an awful lot of these perpetrators clearly have serious mental health issues.

It occurred to me that they probably don't have medical insurance, don't visit a doctor, and that even if they've been diagnosed as needing psychiatric help or meds that they probably don't have the ability or funds to pay for these. If you are a paranoid schizophrenic and are unmedicated due to lack of income in a culture that makes it easy to obtain guns it's a total recipe for disaster.

So if he wasn't rich, then he's an example of a person with an ordinary amount of money and he struggled to pay for his cancer treatment - the point I'm making is still the same. Perhaps only the wealthy can afford cancer treatment and he's a well-known example of a non-wealthy person so a helpful illustration of why the US healthcare system is so frightening?

Like I've said, however much money James VDB did or didn't make from his TV and film career, he had access to resources most people don't in terms of celebrity connections (the New York fundraiser held by the cast last year), sponsorship deals, reality TV shows that he appeared on in the past couple of years and memorabilia to sell. But having cancer still put him under considerable financial pressure that's been well-publicised because of his profile.

Some people seem to be arguing that no one should be self employed, in a creative or otherwise unstable career in America or have multiple children just in case they get a disease. But plenty of people are in precarious situations, or jobs that don't come with good health insurance packages, or they have children when they are expecting to live a long time and have good earning potential. So if these people get cancer, what do they do? Apparently they might lose their homes and all their savings to pay enormous costs for treatment at risk of bankrupting themselves.

It's not about James VDB in particular; he's just an example because we happen to know his story. On this thread people swing between saying he was worth millions and people saying he was unemployed and on the skids - I don't think it really matters either way or in between. The point is, it seems like very many people in the US are absolutely fucked financially if they get cancer and I don't want our healthcare system to go the same way.

I don’t think he is/was fucked financially by the system.
He had high outgoings with low income. That was his choice.

The high outgoings that fucked him were the costs of cancer treatment. Not really a choice?!

Private education for children and running a mansion is not cheap.

Would he not have earned enough to buy a home. I wonder what he chose not to

Loved Dawson's creek and James Van Der Beek really evolved as an actor. Really sad and shocking news.

The sad thing is Reform will destroy the NHS, bringing in an insurance based model, and the very people that voters for them will likely suffer most.

Annoying that the rest of us, who are not racists, will also pay the consequences of their uneducated choices..

I don't think we really know the details of his children's education or what his house cost, but the point is that he could afford those things. Then he got cancer and had to pay enormous bills. People in America face huge medical bills whatever their income. So whatever anyone thinks about James VDB's financial planning (based on the scant information we have about his affairs) my point in starting this thread was to say that medical care in the US is unaffordable for many people, as we can see from what has been shared about him. There are millions of people in the US with poor or non existent health insurance, and many people with reasonable health insurance that still throws up large bills that put financial pressure on people. People go bankrupt because they can't pay medical bills and people die because insurance companies won't cover the treatment they need. It's a scandal, and something we need to prevent happening here in the UK.

I think some people on the thread have said he owned a place in LA that he rented out, and he was renting the house in Texas as they had decided to move states and I suppose renting was a temporary thing. Then I guess he got diagnosed and perhaps if they had plans to buy in Texas, those plans changed maybe because of medical costs - but it's all speculation.

I've read it was for his cancer treatment as well, but I take your point.

That's referring to the repeats of Dawson's Creek. He still made millions of dollars from the show.

It really should be mandatory for actors, particularly young ones, to have a media lawyer when signing agreements.

I agree. He made millions in his lifetime and I'm guessing he sold the Beverly Hills house in the summer of 2020 after not working for months during he pandemic, and lived off the proceeds for a few years (not a huge amount which wouldn't have gone far with six kids to support and a house to rent). If I'm wrong, then it's appalling that the Go Fund crowdfunder started.

You have no way of knowing that and it is pretty common for people in America to start Go Fund Mes in the face of crippling medical bills.

That's why I said "I'm guessing'. But I think that's probably what happened, if you think it about it logically from the perspective of someone who had a huge asset, didn't work much and had to support himself and seven others.

Also, most people don't earn millions of dollars in the period of five or so years.