To think the most shocking thing about James VDB's death is...

[Hitthebestbooth]

...that a famous actor, recognised worldwide for his role in Dawson's Creek (putting this in the first lines for the benefit of MNetters who love to comment 'who??' on these threads) struggled to pay for his cancer treatment? His death has left his family 'out of funds'.

Now, James Van der Beek had enough fame and affection from fans that a Go Fund Me has raised a lot to support his family already. But there must be countless families across America who are ruined by medical bills - if Dawson couldn't pay for his cancer treatment, how do non-famous people in ordinary jobs cope? What do their families do after they've been crippled by the costs and still lose their loved one along with their homes and security for their children?

As a millennial, I was so sad to read of James' death. I loved Dawson's Creek. But it makes me very afraid for a future where Farage gets his hands on the NHS and we find ourselves in this position too. I have plenty of bad experiences with our healthcare system and am not saying it's perfect. But if I or my husband are diagnosed with cancer tomorrow, we won't have to sell our possessions or ask friends and family for money or risk leaving our kids with no home after treatment costs. There are plenty of wealthy people out there eager to take the NHS apart and sell it off, and for all people say we'd get a European system and it would be improved, it seems far more likely that capitalist greed will win out and we'll actually get an American model.

James Van der Beek's death highlights just how ruinous that model is. He spent his illness selling off memorabilia and trying to raise money. He died knowing his family's finances were left decimated. And he was someone with more resources than most. It's a sobering indictment of how bad things can get, and I am truly afraid that a Reform government would put us all in that dystopian scenario.

There are all kinds of options I could put for a poll but I'm just trying to make it really simple.

YABU - US healthcare is fine
YANBU - US healthcare is a terrifying prospect

You are so right . I wish I could share your post on Facebook so the reformers see it .

I'm an inveterate namechanger but I've been here since the Moldies and participated in many a debate about Brexit back in the day - I've said plenty about Farage here over the years, I can assure you!

Sorry what is this European model? It’s just general taxation right? I hear it said it’s insurance based but I don’t see it. Happy to be shown to be wrong. I believe there is a small national insurance element but that’s the same here.

i also believe there is an element of needing to have contributed to the national insurance to access public medical but that’s not a massive change to here?

these are genuine questions I hear people attack our model and say the European one is better but my little research on Google shows it to be largely the same as here

The NHS are finished and not fit for purpose. A PP states they dont know how much their treatment cost and that is the issue. People dont know or care. When something is free it is grabbed at, there are no consequences if they mess about or they have a 'key' word to enable them to get a Priority Ambulance. The admin people at Hospitals and GP's surgeries are using very old systems who dont talk to each other.

In a previous role I was involved with responding to the an NHS tender for new systems. To say the people on the NHS side were protecting their cottage industries is an understatement. They didnt want to train their people on a new system, they had meeting after meeting talking about shite. They also had a spec that bore no relationship to what was actually needed. They talked endlessly about value for money and many many times it was pointed out that you pay for a low cost service and then try it out is not sensible. Admit that you need a vastly sophiscated system and not try to do it on the cheap.

In the end it was all scrapped. No money apparently and it became a monster project with no end in sight.

I was in hospital with my late Mum and they couldnt find her on the portal. She had been registered with a GP surgery for years. Was getting repeat prescriptions and yet they couldnt find her on THEIR system. Says it all really....

I think the ideal would be a mixture of means assessment; private insurance; employer contributions; government contributions.

But we won't get a European model we will get the US model because that for-profit driven health business is what those who espouse a non-government insurance based NHS are looking to have. It will make them money and they don't give a toss about people not being able to afford health care so long as they make it.

In a documentary about the homeless in the US, several of those interviewed were on the streets after having had to re-mortgage or sell their homes to fund the treatment of a spouse. The ill spouse dies, and the remaining spouse is on the streets, where they are still hunted down and issued collection notices for outstanding amounts. It is very sad.

Employer contributions already fund the NHS. The US model with employer based health insurance stifles entrepreneurship (because you won't have health care if you set up a business so it's a huge risk esp if you have DC) and job moility (because if you have health care needs or DC with health issues you cannot move employers because you will/may lose your health insurance and the new insurers may not cover what the previous one did).

I must say, even though I was sad at his death as Dawson's Creek was a part of my childhood, I was surprised they had 6 kids.

Surely they should have ensured they had enough funds?

If they were on welfare, they would have been called irresponsible but for some reason it's fine when it's the rich.

It's not sad it's outrageous. This can happen if a child dies, too. The parents are bankrupt and still owe the insurers - e.g. a child with leukemia can cost 300k in health costs even if you are insured.

YANBU about the US health system. But YAVU about James financial situation.

Fame doesn't equal money. Not all famous people are multi-millionairs. Dawsons Creek was nearly 30 years ago. I don't want to speak badly of James Van Der Beek but he was hardly mega movie star.

That's difficult in the US with health care since even the well-off can run out of insurance. But true, his DC don't have to go to private schools.

Which begs the question of why did they have 6 kids?

Says underfunding and incompetence of the admin, actually. Sorry about your mum but this was not my experience when my brother (suicide), DH (cardiac arrest) and DM (age and lung infection leading to sepsis) died. Everyone was caring, and information was there. Blackpool ITU and a London hospital, btw.

And somewhat misleading that the Go Fund Me page doesn't say the kids go to private school.

The reality is that many sad fans who would have no chance of sending their own kids to private school will be funding private education for Van Der Beek's 6 children. I don't think that's morally right.

The fact that he moved his family from LA to Texas in 2020 suggests to me they may have already been struggling for money back in 2020. The tax burden in CA is very high and many people in the past few years have chosen to relocate from places like LA to e.g. Austin in TX, where the taxes are much lower. The move could also have been ideological, if they were Republicans, as this is another major reason for people to make that move.

The shocking thing for me is that people are willing to donate millions to this family who are not on the breadline and could sell the huge house and buy a modest one, leave the private schools and attend public ones, etc, but will happily step over the bodies of homeless destitute people discharged by hospitals to the streets.

It's crazy, isn't it?

what is an European style health system?
Evrry single country in Europe has different system.
which one would you recommend?
FWIW I am completely against anything similar to the US healthcare.

But that life insurance only covers the amount remaining on your mortgage. It doesn't cover the cost of raising multiple children, some for potentially 18 years. It also does nothing to address the loss of earnings that the surviving spouse/partner may incur due to caring for someone who is terminally ill, let alone the fact that after their death one person is responsible for the care of their mutual children, and may need to reduce working hours to facilitate this.

The financial burden placed on a single parent following the death of a spouse is significant. All at a time when they are dealing with their own grief, and helping their children navigate theirs.

Some other replies on this thread have me astounded that there is such a lack of care for the welfare of children in society following the death of a parent.

My DH has stage 4 bowel cancer and literally yesterday we were informed that he has "less than six months to live". It's like a black abyss opening up in front of you.

We have done our best to mitigate financial problems with life insurance, and have put me on his bank account as a joint account holder, applied for power of attorney, there will be a modest widows pension - but the truth is that even now, having kept on top of all those financial elements as best we can, we still don't know exactly what those numbers are going to look like when the time comes, or how long everything will take to settle down, or whether I will be left with a monthly shortfall. And all of this has to be sorted out while you are grieving, while you are suffering indescribable emotional pain - how do you do that? I think that if we had had to find money for treatment on top of all of this, well there is just no way. No way at all. We would have had to sell our home probably to do that, we don't have money to spare. I find it horrifying that the US system destroys families financially when they are struggling to cope with cancer treatment, it is completely inhumane. The whole process is hell on earth already without being financially ruined as well. We cannot and must not allow Farage to do this to our country.

Some other replies on this thread have me astounded that there is such a lack of care for the welfare of children in society following the death of a parent.

We're not talking about an ordinary family here though, this was a man with a net worth of millions.

I wouldn’t assume that just because someone is famous that they are rich. He was in a TV show that ran for 5 years over 20 years ago. He’s not done much since then so essentially an out of work actor with six kids to support.

My mum has American friends, one of them had her baby via c section and posted her hospital bill on Facebook, even with insurance she had to fork out hundreds of dollars. Me in the UK with my c section, nada. I was one of those people who barely used the NHS, every now and again I'd get an ear infection, and needed antibiotics, or antidepressants, but not much else. Had a baby and without the NHS I'd be destitute. DS had an MRI last year, I dread to think what that would have cost in the USA.

I can assure you, there are no holidays or meals out either. It’s irrelevant what you pay for insurance. What about those with pre-existing conditions who are turned down for all insurance? DH and I were turned down flat and are uninsurable. DD’s quotes were more than her mortgage and completely beyond her means.