"I'm failing in my duty as a middle class parent by not making DC play an instrument"

[ToothSmush]

This is what a friend said to me (in jest, but it has hit a nerve), when I said that the DC don't get any music lessons.

AIBU to not force the DC into playing an instrument?

This friend has different DC playing flute, guitar, drums etc and expressed suprise when I said I was being led by my DC. They haven't shown much interest in music but are mad keen on football so that is their main extra curricular activity.

Is it true that most middle class parents gently force their DC to play an instrument because of all the social advantages it brings?

Part of this is because I was forced to play the piano as a child, only doing grades - and hated having to play the same classical pieces for months at a time. I gave up as a teen, but ironically I have rediscovered the joy of the piano in middle age and now love trying to play music that I l actually like! I can only do this because I learnt the basics as a child.

So maybe I'm doing the DC a disservice by not forcing them?

Its the fact the PP stated music or playing on phone. Talk about one extreme to the other

If you read my posts I also said my DC do sport and love that too.

Sure, but that is a private matter for the child in terms of any personal qualities they may have developed through learning an instrument, or playing a sport, or volunteering or doing a dram, or whatever grabs them. Those are still not of any interest to a university looking at their application. Unless they’re studying something related.

No one ever said this to me and I'd have laughed and probably agreed with them if they had, but I admit I did feel like a bit of a failure for a while for NOT making my DC at least try learning instruments.

The thing is, neither of them is even remotely musical. DS1 was in the choir for a bit, but this was totally driven by me and he hated it so much that eventually the choir master and I agree he could quit (usually no one was allowed to quit once they got in)! DS2 is tone deaf, just like his father. It's sad, because I love music and am quite musical/have a good ear/can sing in tune/was always in the choir/played piano and violin (the latter very badly). I guess neither of my kids inherited that, and that's okay. They are good at and enthusiastic about other things - mainly sport.

And from what I saw with families whose DC played instruments, it was A LOT OF WORK for the parents. My good friend, who is incredibly musical herself, got all her three DC through Grade 8 on one particular instrument, but the work that went into that was mind-boggling and tbh I'm too lazy for that 😆

We don’t force but we exposed them to instruments. Neither DH nor I play an instrument (though I did at school) so we strongly encouraged Ds to try whatever was offered at school. He did guitar for a couple of years then clarinet for a couple and enjoys it ok - it’s not a big passion but he got a lot out of his first experience of being in a show.
I strongly believe Kids won’t spontaneously develop an interest in something if they’re not exposed to it - arty hobbies, different sports, reading for pleasure, music, outdoor pursuits - all things that kids need to see others enjoying.

Oh well iv obviously not rewired my brain right. I couldnt really learn instruments sucessfully as my hearing range not good enough to hear half the notes. I need an explantion of exactly HOW it intelletectually and physically " improves" people

So how does dance compare? Take ballet for example Endless practise, physically demanding, music involved.

This is wrong though - music grades 6 and above are worth UCAS points. Someone I know missed their offer by a grade at A level but was accepted by their uni because they had enough points via their music exams.

My parents were gifted musicians (on hobby level) and I tried out piano and my brother the violin. I gave up after a year because I felt my fingers were too short and fat😅.

DS went from state primary to private secondary and it's really a socioeconomical question who plays instruments. In his primary there was one girl in his class who played the piano. In his class now there are 1/3 who are playing instruments. It's the same children who are not allowed any socialising and who are afraid their parents will get mad if their results aren't perfect. Anecdotal perhaps🤷‍♀️.

It wasnt you said about music or on phone though so why are you telling me about your kids

You are contradicting yourself. In one breath you say it's not superior. Then go on to say it is "improving in a way nothing else is". Make your mind up....

For kids who aren't musical and aren't interested music would be a chore. Constant parental nagging to practise and study. Yes anyone can probably be competent at anything if they are forced to practise 30 minutes per day over several years but life is too short to spend all that time doing something you really don't like.

Music is this weird thing where people feel they have to evangelise about it, about its benefits, how they couldn't possibly live without it, in a way that parents whose kids do gymnastics, swimming or pottery classes don't.

@ToothSmush I don't understand your language around gently forcing/ being led by your children.

Are they exposed to musical instruments and have said they absolutely want nothing to do with them?

Are you waiting for the children to discover musical instruments and tell you they are interested in exploring them?

Don't most reasonable parents just introduce their children to a variety of experiences and the children carry on if they enjoy something?

I wouldn't be trying to meet any "middle class parenting duties", what on earth? Yes encourage your kids to try it, but not as some one-upmanship performance.
If they want to concentrate on football, let them. I tried my kids with music lessons, swimming, sports, drama, martial arts, not at the same time obviously, but it was for their benefit not mine. I had to be picky as I wasn't able to take them to a lot of things due to working ft.
There was no forcing. It's bad enough doing that for school work. One or two activities persisted long term, which was enough.
Only quite well off people with few or no work commitments can have multiple kids with multiple activities, which is where some of the flexing arises I think. It's a sign of privilege.

Maybe this is a Scottish thing but universities here do not make offers in terms of points. They will say things like Highers at AAABB or A-level at AAB or whatever. So additional points for your dance exams or grade whatever in a musical instrument are totally irrelevant.

Phones aren't the only alternative to instruments! I don't believe forcing a child to play an instrument when they aren't interested will do much for their overall abilities, happiness and skills. It's much better to take your child's lead, see what they are interested in and support them in developing that skill.
Many parents are massively snobby about music, as if it were the secret ingredient to a successful life! It really isn't.
There is a lot of pressure in general to do many extracurricular activities, and yes, you will need to force your child if they don't want to do them. I was forced to learn an instrument, a sport and a craft when I was a child and I enjoyed none of it. I stopped all these activities as soon as I could, and haven't picked them up again 20 years later. The vast majority of adults around me haven't continued with their extracurricular activities, either.
I work with highly qualified professionals and I don't think any of them got where they are now by taking piano and tennis lessons. What's really important in life and in career advancement are social skills, something most adults think their children will acquire automatically.

My kids all did piano and guitar only because that is what the primary school offered as lessons and after school groups.
2 chose to have private lessons. All gave it up when going to high school.

As I said, I know someone whose offer was something like AAB and they got ABB but had several music grades and they were accepted by their university because the points equivalent was the same or similar. Scottish universities are in the UCAS system as well. Just because you haven’t heard about it doesn’t mean it it “totally irrelevant”.

As a kid I was given the option of sport or music and chose sport. Love sport, appreciate music but no regrets at not having pursued making it. Nothing to stop me either should I ever want to do so in future.

I also hated playing when i was a kid but picked it up again recently because finally i can play what i want. Maybe find the right teacher, don't care about exams and see how it goes. My dc like the lessons but don't practice. So I'm thinking off dropping it so they can pick up a different hobby they do like and offers ways to increase a skill

Speaking as a music teacher and parent of musical kids, your friend is talking shite. Yes my kids play instruments but on the other hand they do fuck all in the way of sport, which I think is worse. Music is just one of the ways a child learns skills like patience, confidence, working towards goals etc. sport is another. Neither are compulsory.

When I had piano lessons as a kid, popular music was despised by the teacher and teaching yourself anything was forbidden.

Those sort of lessons have caused thousands of people to shun musical instruments for the rest of their lives.

I can also imagine that the last thing a music teacher wants is a pupil who is only there because their parent is forcing/encouraging it when they have no interest or talent. Must be excruciating.

Yep, it’s the discipline the practice teaches. If they get that through sport or another outlet, that’s fine.

I think it’s slightly a shame that they only have one activity. Kids should experience lots of different activities - team sports, individual sports, uniformed clubs, music, drama, art, dance - as much as possible! Even if only for one term. Unless they try things they won’t know whether they enjoy them or have a modicum of talent. So in that respect you’re doing your child a disservice - why not football plus another activity or two?

It obviously doesn’t have to be music, although both mine did, as did I as a child, and we all loved it. One joined every musical group going, as a teen and at uni and was decent enough to be able to, though doesn’t play regularly now. The other joined nothing, but plays everyday after work and finds it a huge stress reliever.

😂 Dh and I are both very middle class. We both had to learn an instrument as children. Awful. No musical ability whatsoever. We both quit after a few years. We are still very middle class, don’t worry!

They will find their own talents. One of our dc is very sporty and interested in a sports related career. Neither of us is remotely sporty. Don’t quite know how the combination of our genes made that one, but they really do find their way as long as you nurture them to explore their talents.

I think it's a very good idea for kids to have extra-curricular/non-academic pursuits, but why does it have to be music? Art club, ballet, football, swimming, drama group..... all perfectly valid.

I gave my DCs the option to learn an instrument. DS was too busy kicking a ball about, DD1 did recorder lessons for a term, but frankly, she couldn't hold a tune in a bucket, never practiced, and stopped pretty quickly, and DD2 preferred chess club. Not one of them has inherited a musical gene (and you'd have to go back to my church-organist grandmother to find anyone remotely musical in the family), and I certainly wasn't going to force them to learn.