Was I unreasonable in what I said and did at the hospital?

[yushsisi]

I had an appointment today at the hospital. Just for a pre op assesment. When I was finished I went and sat on the edge of a 3 seat of chairs outside the accident and emergency department. I had rung my friend and she was collecting me but as it was raining I chose to wait inside and she said she would call when she was 2 mins away

There was an elderly lady sat on the end of the chairs and as soon as I sat she stood. There's a screen opposite us with bus times and stops and when they are due and where you can get taxis from etc. I assumed she was looking at that.
She came back and stood in front of me and said move, I don't want you sitting there. I looked at her and said excuse me? She said I was taking up too much room and how I was sat upset her. Legs crossed with my bag on my knees playing on my phone just for reference.
I told her I wasn't taking up any room and there was enough space for the other 2 chairs to be used. She flung herself down on the chaid where she was previously sat and did a dramatic sigh and pulled a face and told me I was annoying her and inconveniencing her. I ignored her. She started shouting and screaming and she went to grab me. I put my hand up and she yelled that I assaulted her

At this point I just left. A woman at the reception desk mouthed sorry at me but I honestly don't know whats going on. I wasn't hanging around.
So yeah little more of a dranatic pre op then I expected

Rain on your wedding day isn't ironic.

No. Self defence is fine. That’s not what I said, but if you look at the way OP continued in her post as to what she would have done had she been struck, that’s what is shocking.

I work with vulnerable people, including those with dementia and MH conditions. And the fact is that the law does not allow retaliation from anger against someone who is deemed vulnerable, or not responsible for their actions. There is something called appropriate and proportionate response, which includes self defence and calling for help. In this situation, had the OP struck this lady she would undoubtedly have found herself being investigated as to whether her response met that threshold. Retaliating out of anger, or continuing after the immediate threat has passed is assault. Especially when you’re in the middle of a busy hospital department and you can call for help.

Forget about it? The woman tried to assault OP!!
she could have had a knife!!
Oh but that's fine cos she's got mental health issues . The great 21st century get out card 😡

@DotAndCarryOne2 bollocks to that. I wouldn't stand there and let some randomer beat ten bells out of me!!

Definite MH probs I would just ignore

You did nothing wrong here. This lady sounds unwell and you managed the situation as well as anyone else could have done. I'm sorry you have had this experience which sounds very uncomfortable for you. Try to put it out of your mind. It wasn't anything you did.

Did she really scream? If so, surely someone came to see what was happening? Or did she just raise her voice?

She shouted something that sounded like move and as I turned my head to see what was going on she screamed and went to grab me which Is when i raised my hand.

Your mum is lucky to have you, you must know that this sadly isn't the case for everyone

No. You’ve completely turned the situation on its head. We’re not talking about someone in control of their faculties pushing around someone who is vulnerable - it’s the exact opposite. The woman doing the pushing clearly had a problem - from my own experience of my own mum’s late stage vascular dementia, it’s very similar to her behaviour when she’s agitated. And she would certainly be agitated if left alone in a busy hospital department.

I can well put myself in OP’s shoes because I’ve been kicked, punched, bitten, spat at and called the vilest of names by my own mother during the various stages of dementia so I can well understand how OP feels at this treatment. My point is not that people should be forced to tolerate this behaviour, but maybe try to understand it according to the context in which it takes place. In OP’s case, in the middle of a hospital department where help is at hand. There should be no need for the type of retaliation OP describes. And having experienced the panic of my mum going missing having been dropped at a clinic by ambulance crew and left unattended I would be asking why this lady, who clearly has vulnerabilities, was left alone.

I do. But that’s no excuse for someone being left unattended if there was this kind of vulnerability. From the reaction of the receptionist, this lady was clearly known to them so why were they not supervising her more closely ?

Yeah she's was being a rude cow. But it's not uncommon for people in a&e to be in a lot of physical and or mental distress. It can lead to them acting out of character or unpleasantly. So while she was rude I would hope she wasn't always like that.

Not asking you to. At all. My only point is that the response has to be appropriate and proportionate to the threat. In the middle of a hospital department help would be available so physical retaliation should be a last resort.

It's not unusual for people to get dumped by themselves in hospital departments regardless of whether they can manage on their own or not. There isn't the staff to help everyone and there is a lot of hoping for the best in my experience.

Were you making noise with the playing on your phone, OP? Not seeking to blame, but you may have set her off if she’s vulnerable.

ETA Don’t think you’ve done anything wrong and can understand you’re a bit shaken. If you were being noisy, could she have been going for your phone?

Dementia

I'm not going to vote because obviously something was wrong with her and your behavior was not unreasonable.

No noise. Just scrolling Reddit and Mumsnet. She was completely on her own. When I sat down she sighed and stood up but I didn't think much of it. Like people say it's a hospital. Plenty of people coming and going. I would have waited outside but it's absolutely chucking it down

Where there is dementia or cognitive impairment ambulance crews don’t just dump people in hospital departments if they are unaccompanied. They book them in and report the difficulties to the nursing staff, who should then monitor until they are seen and discharged.

Sorry her behaviour rattled you, it probably would me. She’s unwell and it’s no deeper than that. I’m glad you weren’t hurt.

It wasn't ideal, but I am assuming if it was outside A&E there was some mental health issue going on.

I don't think there is a right or wrong way to handle these situations.

Personally, I would have moved for my own benefit, just so I didn't inadvertently get dragged into her drama. But you weren't wrong to have stood your ground.

The difference is you know your mum has dementia so can react accordingly.

From OP’s perspective, she was attacked simply for sitting down, by someone who wasn’t a patient or accompanied by anyone.

You all are expecting OP have reacted perfectly to an imperfect situation.

There should be no need for the type of retaliation that OP describes.

What retaliation?! OP didn’t retaliate, she was very restrained!

People with mental health issues or dementia do lots of things they shouldn't. I'm not sure what you're looking for from this thread.

I'm sure it was upsetting but nothing major happened. You're fine.

I'm not sure I'd choose A&E as a place to wait for a lift in hospital. An A&E waiting room is almost always going to be chaotic and is full of ill, injured and stressed people. Perhaps choose an alternative place to wait like the hospital cafe or main reception area if you're in a similar situation again.