AIBU about another parent saying my kid has learning difficulties

[Buyer97462]

Hi

My daughter who is 7 has a best friend. Said best friend came to our house after school today and said his Dad had said she has learning difficulties (I don't know the context of the conversation). Daughter is autistic and slightly ADHD but doesn't have any learning difficulties.

Am I unreasonable to be upset by this? I am hopefully not upsetting parents of children with learning difficulties but my child is perfectly capable they just struggle socially. It's particularly upsetting as she has a very small circle of friends and I do worry this kind of impression will make relationships harder.

Apologies I am not saying there is anything wrong with having learning difficulties and probably not putting this across very well.

Am I being unreasonable at being a it upset?
Edited for typo

That may be true for you; but if you know one person with ADHD and/or autism, you know one person. You cannot speak for every other ND person. DD definitely struggles with academic work and holding down a job due to her ADHD and autistic traits.

She doesn’t understand what she reads, although her decoding is fine. That’s a learning difficulty, isn’t it? It took her seven years to do a three year degree, despite being very bright!

She was diagnosed with CPTSD, after what happened during a previous job, including her employer’s refusal to make reasonable adjustments and tackling the workplace bullying and harassment, she suffered. It wasn’t the first time, she’d been bullied by her manager in work either.

DH, who she inherited this from, also doesn’t understand what he reads, and this is especially problematic with instructions. It’s much harder work for him, in a profession, where most of the information is taken in through reading.

This is not correct. With the exception of a handful of conditions that get worse over time - cancer, HIV, multiple sclerosis - which are automatically covered from the point of diagnosis, no condition is automatically considered a disability under the EA2010 unless it meets the definition of disability as defined by the Act, which is substantial and long-term negative effects on the ability to do normal daily activities. Substantial means more than minor or trivial, and long term means the effects have lasted or are likely to last for at least 12 months.
The ability to do daily tasks like walking, eating, reading, dressing, social interaction and using public transport, must be significantly affected.

This. With the exception of a handful of conditions which meet the definition automatically such as cancer, HIV, MS etc, no condition is considered a disability under the EA2010 unless it meets its definition of disability. As you say, many cases of neurodivergence will not meet this definition.

This.

They may very well have just been trying to help. Do they have a background in this area? Or work with a number of children?

My daughter is on the waiting list for Autism and ADHD assessments. We didn't pick up on a possibility of her being neurodivergent until she was 10. As we didn't know some things, dating back to when she was a toddler, were possible symptoms that now added all together make it increasingly likely. Particularly on the ADHD side. Given the long wait for diagnosis, she will have been coping with minimal, non specialist support for many years. When we had the initial assessment, some people we know who work in the area, or who have neurodivergent kids mentioned they weren't surprised, or noticed signs themselves. We wish they had mentioned it, as we could then be further down the line of getting support for her. However they didn't as they didn't feel it was their place, or that they might have offended us.

I would be thankful for his frankness, as long as it wasn't rude, and ask more about why. Its not a criticism of your daughter, just a potential observation. It may be right or wrong. Maybe ask what made him think that could be the case. It could be easily explained as shyness or social awkwardness. But he may have some useful knowledge to pass on.

I think he worded it clumsily. He was probably trying to be kind and avoid the word disability to avoid having your child's friend repeat it back to them.
I have two ASD children without learning difficulties btw, so am not ignorant about the issue myself.

The amount of ND folk on this post that have such internalised ableism is really sad tbh. How they're having to "prove" they're as worthy as anyone else by how well they do... at work. That is their only measure of success... not how happy they are; the positive impact they have on the people they meet; the incredible personal relationships they have... just.. whether they have a degree and make money. Absolutely grim.

What were the things you missed if you don’t mind?

👏👏👏

She was never good at getting to sleep, took ages to settle, but once asleep she slept well. Often needed waking in the morning. (still applies, late to sleep but struggles to wake even with alarms)

Late potty training, late-ish bed wetter and took a while to get poos right (lots of accidents continued after potty training). Slept through night time accidents, in a wet bed until we noticed.

School reports, from day 1, refer to often being in her own world. Struggle to focus, not disruptive and very happy but regularly day dreaming.

Struggles to make eye contact when talking.

Struggles to answer a question directly, spins it into a random story.

Very small groups of friends, appears confident, sociable and friendly but doesn't make or maintain friendship relationships.

Hyper-focussed on certain topics which has maintained through.

Emotionally immature for her age.

Very easily distracted. I know a lot of kids are, but it is another level (we have a 2 year old and 10 year old and its similar between them at times).

Possibly some fiddling, unsettled, picking, struggling to stay still. I personally didn't notice this, it was the Dr who did.

Pretty sure there's more that I can't remember right now. The biggest ones are the sleeping and potty training. On their own very normal, just combined together with the others (and probably other things I have shelved in my mind right now). Also to note, she isn't diagnosed. She had an initial assessment for autism. The Dr then mentioned he wanted to refer her for ADHD assessment as well. Since then I have carried out my own research which has helped me join dots. I will still have a lot to learn though, and I don't know which symptoms are possibly ADHD or Autism yet. On the ADHD side I have recently started listening to a podcast called Pause Purpose Play which specifically looks at the effect of ADHD on women.

I think you'll find those women are responding to you calling OP's child and all neurodivergent people disabled, when many neurodivergent people do not meet the criteria for disability.

Obviously many people who are neurodivergent are disabled according to the formal definition, but it is completely insensitive to people with genuine disabilities and their lived experience if neurodivergent people who do not have an impact on their activities of daily living start calling themselves disabled when they are not.

It is also insulting for you to think you can meaningfully comment on OP's daughter and call her daughter disabled and tell OP she is damaging her, when you have not a clue about her symptoms or situation and clearly are unable to understand the formal definition of a disability, which (as a previous poster has commented) is based on functional status, except for a few conditions.

Not everyone understands autism and ADHD and people often label these as learning difficulties. I wonder whether this is the case here?

Except...
To get the diagnosis for autism..
Symptoms have to significantly impact daily living.

ADHD IS a learning disability. Trust me. As someone with AuDHD, it absolutely affected my ability to learn in a normal classroom. I have a very high intelligence, but that doesn't change the fact I have a learning disability.

I think its hard to judge for a second-hand statement.

There could be a miscommunication or even the parent could be saying it because theyre ignorant of the facts and mistakenly think autism always has a learning difficulty/disability component. And they might have thought it was a sensible simplistic explanation.

Its OK if it makes you worry, and feel its not nice shes labelled but I think you need to try and avoid thinking the worst

This is a conversation between the 7 year old friend and the father which has later been said to your daughter. Perhaps somewhere in the relaying of conversations words got changed.

There's a difference between affects daily living and affects 'activities of daily living'.
ADLs is a term used by clinicians/social workers etc. to mean certain activities e.g. washing/dressing/feeding self, that are crucial to live independently.

See link:
www.physio-pedia.com/Activities_of_Daily_Living

Are you talking about the DSM-5 criteria for diagnosis of autism or ICD-11? I find the DSM criteria better in some ways, but appreciate that both are used within psychiatry teams and in research.

For DSM -5
Criterion D: symptoms cause clinically significant impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning

There's a huge difference between clinically significant (generally meaning diagnosable in doctor speak) and substantial’ and ‘long-term’ negative effect on your ability to do normal daily activities.

I suspect from the way you write that you do not have a background in psychiatry. If you're looking for further information try NICE CKS guidance, or the diagnostic manuals for psych conditions. Patient UK website has guides for clinicians, but also has simplified information for members of the public.

It is difficult to explain to a child why their friend behaves in a certain way. Could parents of children with autism or adhd give their advice how they would ideally like to be explained to their children’s friends.
I wouldn’t tell my son that a child behaves in a certain way because he’s autistic. I’d never say because he has learning difficulties or label them in any way. I think it’s too complex for a child below the age of 10. I just comment on the current behaviour/situation if my DC asks why is Aidan (6) hitting his mummy or other children - Aidan is still learning how to manage his emotions. Why has Aidan spilt coffee on you, doesn’t he know he shouldn’t do that? Because he needs to learn how to make better choices. And so on. Is that the right approach? Or should we educate children about neurodivergence early in life? I do tell him that some children struggle sometimes and find things more challenging especially when my DS says that Aidan is just a very naughty boy and he doesn’t want to be friends with him. Do I still encourage play dates if the other child’s behaviour is challenging? I still do convince my child that we should give them another chance because my heart breaks to that child and his parents, especially if the parent is doing everything to manage her child’s behaviour and always apologises. But I’m worried I’m also teaching my child that we should be seeing somebody even though we don’t want to.

I don't think any offence would have been ment.

Bearing in mind that ADHD and autism both often cause difficulties in learning for children and they may have special educational needs. Your child specifically may not have any difficulty with learning but lots with autism or ADHD do and lots have dyslexia as well.

I don't think if someone used that term that they are necessarily saying they think they have low IQ or anything like that. I think you may be over thinking it.

My husband is autistic and has dyslexia and he definitely had trouble learning so would say he had learning difficulties but he is very clever!

I was writing simply for a "general public" audience. Personally in my practice I mostly use DSM-5 though...

My 7 year old just knows the meltdowns and arguments are just the way his older brother is, I don’t feel like he needs to know more than that at this stage, and it would be down to each child who they want to spend time with and be their friend (although nether of them have much interest in other people).

I totally agree,as a parent of a autistic child too.

I don’t think there is an easy answer to this. What used to be called mentally handicapped or before that mentally retarded is now termed learning difficulties which takes the hurtful sting out of those terms. However many many people have learning difficulties which are merely temperamental or temporary so it covers far too much to be meaningful. And of course all the terms that are brought in to protect in time also become stigmatised.
I have a granddaughter who has a genetic condition that means as she grows older every year she loses intellectual ability. So from being a very bright and able two year old now at 13 can barely write or speak intelligibly. She is at a special school for autistic children and those with learning difficulties; they are all quite severely affected. I rather like it is called learning difficulties it makes me feel it is less than it is, an absolute tragedy. It sweeps so much under the carpet that the term has become meaningless.
The OP knows it has vast connotations and her child is not intellectually disabled but it is perhaps being implied they are.
So much damage as well as good is achieved by this incoherent washing of disability labelling; masking and denying the real difficulties and help that some need as well as stigmatising those that don’t.

Again there is a difference between learning disabilities and learning difficulties
Learning disabilities affect everything and csn range from mild to profound, my son is also at a special school, he also has a genetic condtions, which is the underlying reason for his autism and severe learning disabilities
Learning difficulties affect a person's ability ti learn but not their IQ.

I'm AuDHD, I do tend to talk about learning disabilities when describing myself as I feel that's what it is - outwardly I seem capable, but I have processing difficulties, difficulties absorbing text etc. I think he was well-meaning, and it's more of an umbrella term