Elder daughter father giving rules about my younger kids

[Dazedandconfusec]

My elder daughter is 12 and Grade 5 piano and flute and began guitar in an afterschool club at school last year. She gave up violin when the teacher moved house but still has two violins which she occasionally gets out.

My ex has facilitated her music and has bought all of the instruments and paid for lessons but I obviously had to facilitate the lessons for flute; the piano teacher comes to the house.

My younger daughter elder daughter’s half sister, has now started piano at school. Elder daughter has locked piano as her dad has instructed that my younger children cannot use the piano or have use of the other instruments.

Op has to make judgements based on her actual reality, not her or your preferred one. She’s the one that has to live with the real-life consequences of whatever action she chooses to take, and she’s not going to die on this particular hill because strangers on mumsnet think she should. She said more than once that your preferred ‘solution’ to this would result in the outcome she least desires, that she’s unwilling to countenance. That isn’t being a doormat, that’s being prudent.

Her ex is backing up his child, who doesn’t want to share the piano her father provided for her. He’s not being unreasonable to restate to OP what was established when they agreed on the piano being at her house in the first place. It’s not there to be communal property for her family, it’s there to be used by their daughter. This wasn’t something forced on her.

What happens if the younger daughter progresses? Well, then she’ll have to reconsider getting another piano.

The DD spends more time at the OP’s home than her fathers because he is too busy and its not convenient for him to do otherwise. The OP may be happy to have her DD with her most of the time but don’t pretend its for any reason other than the DF’s convenience.

Piano’s are not “damaged” or affected in anyway by more junior learners playing on them. Ask any piano tuner - the biggest factor in a piano going out of tune quickly is insufficient use not over use. Any child learning piano knows that its an instrument which is conventionally shared and played by others - even when they are a professional, you don’t pack up your piano and ship it to the Carnegie Hall, you play the instrument which is there.

I would never have let him manipulate me into hosting a sodding great piece of furniture for him but if its there, its needs to be there on the basis that its shared. Its not a barbie doll or a 1/4 size violin which can stay in her room therefore it needs to be for family use. Problems of being in a blended family are being created by the DF with this ridiculous rule - how on earth can she build a positive relationship with her siblings when her DF is behaving like this?

The idea that its the OP’s fault because her house doesn’t have spare rooms for multiple baby grands is ridiculous. The DF is using his money to control the ex’s family (did you miss the bit that he objected to her having other children at all?) and putting his daughter in the middle.

This pretty much stops OP's younger children from learning the piano though. Who has room in their home for two full-size pianos, one for OP's elder daughter and the other for OP's other child who is now learning the piano?

The only way to resolve this is for the original piano to be kept at OP's ex-DH's house and for OP to buy a new piano for the whole family to use.

If the OP is so certain of the correct course of action then why did she start this thread? If, as you say, she is reluctant to ‘die on this hill’, I wonder whether that is because she fears retaliation in other quarters. Which is a sad way in which to live one’s life. I’d rather my dd went without a couple of luxuries than I made my household walk on broken glass to accommodate the whims of my ex. And let us not forget that this ‘luxury’ in question is a slight better piano for a grade 5 beginner who will never notice the difference if a cheaper one is purchased for her (unless it is pointed out to her).

That the DD wants the piano to herself too is irrelevant, do you let your children run your household? My own DS got a new piano as one of his birthday presents last year, but if he tried to stop his younger siblings from playing on it he would get short shrift. Thankfully he never would.

The only circumstance in which I would accommodate the ex’s request would be if he also subsidised a house that was large enough to have a dedicated music room for the dd (which obviously isn’t going to happen).

If this was a Stradivarius then there would be no issue, that is a personal instrument and I would be happy for a child to keep that locked up in her bedroom. But a piano is furniture. It’s massive. It is to be shared. If the ex want to take the piano back now then fine, it was quite generous of him to provide one in the first place (although I suppose it was compensation for being a bit of an absentee dad). The OP could get a really decent acoustic piano for <£1k, people are just giving them away. Can she not afford that?!

The OP is reluctant to move the piano because she fears , probably rightly , that her daughter will vote with her feet . However this is a 12 yo , who basically is dictating what 2 adults / 2 children can / cannot do in their home , where will it end ? Unless she always cedes to her eldest child’s demands on everything the child will potentially walk , this child now knows this as she has won the battle of the piano . Eventually , in the near future there will be a hill the OP has to die on .

The reality is that the child cannot vote with her feet because its not convenient to the Ex to have her even 50/50. It is apparently convenient for him to have the OP store a baby grand in communal space and dictate how the household uses that space.

The 12 year old needs to learn to share, a half way decent father would teach her that instead of using his oversized “gift” as a way to control the OP’s family.

‘Fears retaliation’? Sure. She knows she’s not entitled to get precisely what she wants here, and she’s not going to pursue a course of action that will result in something she’s explicitly said is the last thing she wants.

Presumably at the time OP started the thread she was pissed off and unsure as to what to do. She then updated, having come to a decision, and then left the thread because she had zero interest in defending that position or debating it any further.

She’s accommodating what she and her ex agreed on. They’re accommodating their daughter, not each other.

You wouldn’t have agreed to this in the first place? No shit. You are however not OP, who did. You may be prepared for your child to go without ‘luxuries’, but the degree to which you can enforce that is dependent on you being on the same page as their other parent. OP can choose not to provide them herself, but she cannot prevent her ex from doing so. She cannot make her daughter share her opinion on the matter, and she cannot prevent a 12 year old from deciding to spend more time with her father or at her father’s house. Again, OP is looking at the reality of her situation and what is within her control, not what you think the reality should be, or the level of control you think she should have.

‘It must be shared’. Nope. Evidently not.

If that were the case she wouldn’t say that would be the outcome of removing the piano.

Right now they coparent well and the situation pertaining to their daughter’s residency suits them all. This can change, and if the daughter wants more time with her father, or to be able to access his houses even if he’s not there, there’s nothing to say he wouldn’t be willing or able to accommodate that.

The DD spends more time at the OP’s home than her fathers because he is too busy and its not convenient for him to do otherwise. The OP may be happy to have her DD with her most of the time but don’t pretend its for any reason other than the DF’s convenience.

Don't let the facts get in the way:

He sees her often, they have a good and close relationship but and I have to confess I am delighted, that he can’t have her 50:50 as I want her with me.

It's nothing to do with damage and everything to do with ownership and boundaries in a blended house. Most people resident in a home would buy a communal piano. The exception here is that a non resident person has made the purchase and agreed for it to be situated in the OPs home for use of their shared daughter. They have no paternal or financial responsibility for the OPs other children - they have their own father.

It's not the OPs fault for not having extra bedrooms. But it was her responsibility to consider this eventuality when discussions around the piano initially happened. Failure to plan is to plan to fail.

The OP has admitted that she took her eye off the ball with her daughter, its hardly a shocker if the Ex mentions this. It's a direct result of the family blending and new children being added.

Who said anything about a full sized piano? Uprights are available for free on Facebook. Her husband already suggested getting another piano, so apparently they do have the space for one.

It’s up to OP and her husband to support their child in learning the piano, it’s not the responsibility of either her daughter or her ex.

Hmm.

1. the piano moves straight to his house & he will facilitate the piano teacher to come and teach at his house
2. you get your own piano for both your children to share 😊

You think it’s ok for a household to fear retaliation from an ex? I’m of the opinion that it is better to live a slightly more frugal yet independent life than be beholden to a controlling ex.

I used ‘luxuries’ in inverted commas because I really don’t believe a 12 year old grade 5 pianist needs a £9/10k piano over and above the welfare of her family. I got to diploma level on a piano that would probably retail at <£1k today. Our family piano is worth <£3k even thought our household income is over £300k. The OP bending over backwards to accommodate her ex is insanity.

What’s next? Is he going to buy dd a pony and expect OP to muck it out every day? Maybe a set of gymnastic equipment that takes over the entire garden and no one else can use?

Did OP agree to this in the first place? I can’t remember her saying so, it seems to have come as a surprise to her.

The reason he can’t have her 50/50 is that it doesn’t fit in with his lifestyle/career.

As per the OP’s posts.

But don’t let facts get in your way.

Lets face it - we can guess how this went. Disney dad buys unsuitable gift for child. RP knows that to say “no” makes her the bad parent. This is hardly a new scenario, especially with high earning NRPs who are too busy for 50/50 and throw money at the child instead of being there for the hard yards.

I would have said “no" to a relative wanting to buy something this size for exclusive use of one child but most parents after divorce struggle to do this for good reason. They don’t want the child to be in the middle of an argument or to be the “bad” parent. I’ve seen this exact situation play out over and over, not usually with a baby grand but certainly with buying unsuitable gifts.

The OP really needs to state her own boundaries - stuff in communal space has to be communal or removed, not pandering to an ex trying to control her family via the DD. Its mostly unhealthy for the DD in this situation and her future relationship with her siblings.

Did OP agree to this in the first place? I can’t remember her saying so, it seems to have come as a surprise to her.

How do you stealth move a baby grand in? 😂

She did agree and the piano has been there 2 and a half years already.

You are clearly not musical 🙄 an upright piano still takes up a huge amount of space and costs a fortune to move. I agree that the OP could get one to accommodate both girls but not in addition to the baby grand - to replace it, if that’s what the ex dictates.

FYI - baby grands are often cheaper to buy than uprights because they are so much harder to accommodate.

Obviously I don’t mean that (I think that was me!) I’m referring to the agreement that no one other that the elder dd is to be allowed to play it. I don’t think there is evidence to suggest that the OP knew that was what she was signing up for at the time of the piano‘s arrival.

You can have whatever opinion you like. I think it’s fine to consider the consequences of your actions, yes. Sensible, in fact. Whether you, I, or anyone deem it ‘okay’ or not is irrelevant. Philosophical musings as to what should be do not change the material reality of what is. Nor does it matter that she doesn’t ‘need’ a baby grand - her father is able and willing to provide one for her, and her mother is able and willing to house it. She doesn’t have to ‘need’ it in order to have it.

OP has had the piano for years. Her youngest daughter only recently started using it, and prior to this the younger children had only been allowed to use it on a couple of occasions when their sister invited them to, and supervised them. So yes, it was clearly established that this wasn’t ever intended to be a communal piano for OP’s family.

He expects OP to stick to what was agreed. If he and OP decided that he would buy a pony and OP would muck it out, then why would it be unreasonable for him to expect her to do just that? He didn’t force the piano on OP and it’s not there for his benefit. They agreed together to do this for their daughter.

Lol. My mother had and has her own piano, and my brother and I were provided with our own (unfortunately, we didn’t get our own harp, but alas). Mine wasn’t and isn’t the only family I know that did and does the same.

How convenient it is that OP doesn’t require your agreement.

If the OP really agreed to this arrangement when the piano arrived then fine, although more fool her. Did she though? I must have missed that post. She seemed quite surprised that her ex was objecting to the younger dd learning to play on it. Very different to allowing a toddler to tinker around under supervision vs an older child taking lessons. In fact, I’d say the latter is far safer in terms of protecting the piano, which just goes to show how petty and vindictive the ex it being. He is punishing the OP for daring to have more children.

I value independence. Obviously you and the OP do not.

Wow, so you had 3 separate acoustic pianos in your house growing up, one for each of you? Amazing. Coughliarcough.

Ah yes, ‘anyone who says they had a different experience to me is lying’. A classic.

No, we had two. My brother and I shared one.

That it hasn’t been treated as a communal family piano for the years it has been there does rather suggest she was aware.

He’s not ‘punishing OP’, he’s supporting his child. OP said she knows her daughter doesn’t want to share it, but that she wouldn’t feel able to tell OP that. So instead she went to her father, who could and did.

He said that her having more children had disadvantaged their child at a time when OP readily acknowledges this to be the case.

I say this as a person with half siblings and as the mother of children who have half siblings. You are a meanie.

100% this. He needs to remove his property from your home.

It hasn’t been treated as a family piano because until now nobody else played the piano . You seem to know an awful lot about the ins and outs of this family @InterIgnis are you a relative ?