Asked to give up my seat on bus

[Motnight]

On a packed London bus. A pregnant young woman has asked for my seat (only know that she is pregnant from her badge).I've said no, can she ask one of the younger more able bodied people sitting opposite or behind me? There are at least 4 people that are in their 20s / 30s and look physically fit sitting down.

She looked very shocked but just said ok. I am in my early 60s. I fell on ice a few days ago and am feeling a bit more wobbly than usual. Was I unreasonable?

I agree and did this when pregnant. I have to say though that more than one one man was visibly cross to be asked and made a bit of a huffing fuss about giving me a seat, whereas I found women and older people more likely to offer when they saw my bump.

I'd swap my pain, hearing loss, tinnitus and need for medications that will shorten my lifespan by slightly fewer years than it would be shortened by untreated disease for the HG I went through when pregnant in a heartbeat. Yeah, I was puking my guts up all the way to an Hb of 4.2 by the time I ended up in hospital, but I wasn't at risk of paralysis from getting sent flying on the bus because somebody wanting an award for having sex within a couple of days around ovulation decided they were more entitled to a seat.

You probably looked the kindest and not your age.

Pregnancy can make you feel very vulnerable of approaching the wrong person.

60s is not even old. Madonna is 67 and just did a World Tour. Kier Starmer is 63 and running a country, after a fashion. There are no differences between an able bodied person in their 60s and 30s which make one more capable of standing than another.

I'm not saying OP didn't also need to sit down. It's more the tone of how she said it, makes it sound like she thought the pregnant lady didn't need to as well. Would she have responded the same way if someone has appeared on crutches or with a walking stick? Obviously the pregnant lady didn't know the OP was unwell and she might look very well for her age so it wasn't unreasonable for her to ask.

I generally found younger people offered more in London. Especially young women.

Madonna is/was a professional dancer and is absolutely an outlier physically (although going by her movement in some shows, she definitely would still need somebody to offer her a seat these days).

It's the same logic that dictates that because there are world class paralympian athletes who are phenomenally strong, fast and talented, everybody else with a disability should shut up and not expect any adaptations - the exceptional in a category are well known precisely because of their exceptionality. It's no more logical than saying that because Bolt could run 100m in 9.58s, the random bloke down the world would be able to do if he just ate fewer pies and went for a jog in the morning. No, he couldn't - and neither could anybody else.

Because if you're standing on a bus you are more unsteady and also less likely to have a clear view out the window, resulting in nausea. Also pregnant people often feel sick due to a drop in blood pressure and sitting helps with this.

Can't believe I'm having to explain this though.

Sorry, there are significant physiological differences between someone in their 30s and someone in the 60s. Think bones and muscle mass for starters. Think inner ear structures deteriorating leading to balance issues.

Madonna was nothing like she was on her 30s and 40s. She required assistance and didn't do any of the dancing she used to. And she is rich enough to have the kind of health care that keeps one going. Even she almost died a couple years back from a bacterial infection that turned to sepsis.

Most people in their 60s are not frail and infirm. My Dad still runs several miles 3 x a week at 71 and he's not an outlier, just an ordinary fit and healthy man. He would immediately give up his seat for a pregnant lady on a bus. Retirement age isn't even until 68- how do you think all the people in their 60s doing physical jobs that require spending all day on their feet cope? You seem to be confusing 60s and 80s.

I didn't say there was no difference. I said there was no difference that made them incapable of standing on a bus or train. And there isn't.

Re your last point, I noticed this a lot. During my first and second trimesters, I’d see glances at my baby on board badge but wasn’t offered a seat sometimes but this didn’t happen when I had a big bump. But I felt great then yet I fainted on a Tube while standing during my first trimester. I felt well when I was showing.

Did you never have nausea / feeling sick, even if not pregnancy-related? Of course sitting down makes a difference.

He is an outlier. It is unusual for anybody, never mind a man in his seventies, to run several miles a week.

You're just not seeing the people who aren't able to do physical jobs in their sixties - some of them are retired, some are suffering from painful conditions such as osteoarthritis - and some are already dead.

Oh god those bloody im pregnant badges 🤦‍♀️

Neither were wrong here...she asked you politely replied you needed the seat. For those saying fit young people my dh might be seen at such but he physically not able to stand and probably collapse but you not see that if you saw him.

Yes, some people in their 60s have health problems or are unfit. Some people in their 30s have health problems or are unfit. Hence why I specified "able-bodied". I know no 60 year olds who want to be treated like frail little old ladies or men, but apparently, lots of them on Mumsnet who think they count as "elderly" and need a seat more than a pregnant woman just by virtue of their age.

Not as unusual as you think. I've several patients in their 70s and 80s running. Meanwhile my husband in his 40s is struggling to walk. Age is a number. Health is a lottery

Neither of you were.

I don't live in London but have been on the tube, not for a year or so though. Not been on a bus in ages.

Don't agree.. Just said we're feeling a bit unstable and explained..politely.. Pregnancy badge?

DDs are using tubes daily and often see young men looking down at their phones totally unaware of the frail or pregnant who may have a greater need of a seat. They always offer their seats and the young men don’t bat an eyelid.

It’s a TFL thing. Baby on Board.

You could only tell she was pregnant because of her badge. You weren't sitting in a priority seat. And there were younger folk that she could have asked. She walked past all the people sitting in the priority seats.

I would have refused as well.

I'm 62. Over the last couple of years I've noticed a marked deterioration in my balance. Standing on a bus would be very difficult.

You did the right thing. Don't give it another thought.

I disagree. I was diagnosed with an incurable illness at 19. I look perfectly fine on the outside but inside I am a hot mess and disabled. OP clearly is offended the woman asked a woman in her 60s instead of the able young ones. That is ageist as well to just assume they are healthy and able because they are young.

It's fine to not give up her seat, her choice. But implying someone else should because they look healthy is just as absurd and wrong. That is where the unreasonable bit comes in.