To think, actually, hard work doesn’t pay off?

[AkaBaka]

I have had a typical millennial experience. Raised by a single mother in a council house and wanted better, so worked hard at school, went to university, graduated into a recession, built up a career, and bought a house. Am now scraping by in a similar sized house to my childhood home, raising my kids in a similar way as my mother did in terms of hobbies and lifestyle.

I have stepchildren who, much as I love them and they have many wonderful qualities, are lazy and unmotivated with little drive. I am forever telling them that hard work pays off.

But does it? For their generation, especially for non-academic kids like them, there seems little point in striving. Now I have kids of my own, I’m seeing the benefit of working fewer hours with less stress over a “successful career” that doesn’t even give me a very comfortable lifestyle.

AIBU to think hard work doesn’t pay off?

You're right, it is a different point. My SC’s attitude stinks and it worries me.

I do also worry that Gen Alpha have it significantly harder as a cohort than we millennials did though, just like we had it harder than our parents. That applies to my own kids as well as SC as well as the wider UK and western world.

I am a gen x’er and have a good job at a university. I have never been given any money from my family and therefore everything has been a struggle. My ex partner and the father of my children came from inherited wealth and never really had to work much. He recently died leaving a lot of money to our children, they will probably never have to work either. It is clear that if you have to work and don’t have inherited money life is always going to be more difficult irrespective of how hard you work. I believe though it makes you a better person and all the people I know that were like my ex were wasters and not particularly pleasant people.

Have kids young and work on property ownership is my advice. I have my whole life to get a career.
Had my first at 16 and spent years renting the smallest place possible while saving for a family house now I’ve brought one and my life is miles ahead of people my age.
Who spend all their money on holidays and alcohol which if they want to do that fine but then moan they can’t afford to move out?
Im gen z

I agree re homeownership as soon as possible. Take risks with this.

What does your DH say about all this OP? There’s a lot here about your worries for your SC (you sound lovely btw) but what does he say when his kids are talking about not want long to work or only working part time?

That’s the things I’d be most concerned about here…

I often think that one of the benefits of this route is also the timing. You start work age 17 or so, when your expenses are low - often still living with parents, no dependents, and young enough that you're down the pub or doing cheap holidays not wanting flashy meals etc.

The result is that you save a lot in these early years while those who are at uni are not saving at all, and in fact ggetting into debt. Then they come out of uni and 9/10 they are in average jobs (excluding banker/lawyers) earning okay money, but expenses are a bit higher as they're probably NOT living at home, and are now in an age and stage where other costs start increasing.

The result is that the 19 year old appie, come his 25th birthday, has saved enough for a small deposit on a flat, perhaps with a friend or partner and it all continues to grow from there.

Hard work and some smart financial decisions will pay off! I also think consistency is key. Boring jobs, but steadily moving up no career breaks or globe trotting, spending early working life investing in assets like pensions and owning a home.
I know it's an outdated view, but it's working for us.
I'm a bit older- late 40's. DH and I wer mortgage free by 40. We both work around 30h/ week and have a lovely lifestyle with hobbies, plenty of time for each other and on track for retirement in early 60's. We have a summer holiday & city break each year, but have to stick to Europe, which we don't mind. I would say we have a simple but fulfilled life.

I went uni, DH didn't, but now we earn about the same...

You’re right but that advantage is over 10 years later because trades are not well paid and don’t increase significantly with experience. In fact, it’s a young man’s game.

you also have to bear in mind you are unlikely to be able to work to a normal retirement age (some do, but most don’t) and it’s dangerous work that wrecks your body. So you might start early but it can be over by 45.

you really need to have a second later career planned to make any success of this which some switched on tradies do, but with experience that’s not relevant to much else it’s a slog.

Yes there are several aspects to your worries.

They are lazy and unmotivated
Degrees and their value
Generally things are harder for people starting out than they were due to several factors like lack of entry level jobs and housing costs.

I suppose the only one you can really influence is motivation. If you can find something that they feel motivated by whether it is hairdressing, tatoo artist, IT, latin or sports, then they are going to be more likely to succeed working towards that than doing nothing at all.

The good thing about degrees or professional qualification is you can get some real world experience and still do them. Something like half of degree apprentiship go to existing employees.

good point. I think the ones I keep meeting are older... but also very successul and are now, in effect, running mid size construction businesses rather than doing it themselves any more. So that's their second part of the plan.

it's quite interesting as what I've notied as my kids have got older is that the ones with dads liek this we didn't see the dads much when the kids were younger. But now they're around. I assme becuase their working hours adn patterns have changed as they've transitioned out of hands-on work.

Working hard and going to uni are not the same thing. While some people do make sacrifices, studying hard, while maybe working part time, for many others, postponing their adulthood for a further three years to have a jolly interrupted by a few hours lectures a week doesn't remotely compare with working 40 hours a week for minimum wage in an entry level job.
For some in the second group this hard work will pay off. They learn skills and gain experience. They can accrue savings rather than debt, and starting work at 18 may predispose employers to see them as having a maturity and work ethic not shared by their unproven graduate peers.
If your SC are not academic it makes no sense for them to go to uni, and they could do well for themselves working hard in a job instead.

Like everything in life, sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't.
You cannot reduce it down to a "one size fits all rule".

I have done quite nicely but I could never claim to have done any seriously hard work. I just landed on my feet and was in the right place at the right time on a couple of occasions,

On balance hard work might, or might not, pay off.

Doing sod all however, leads to failure ninety-nine times out of the hundred.

No, the next generation will need to work smarter, not harder.

They should invest in stocks and shares early, making use of compound interest. They should weigh up the cost and benefit of a degree and - preferably - choose to work for themselves.

I’m a millennial and similar background to you and making smart decisions is what’s paid off for me.

Only a small number of tradies will ever own small construction firms- that’s unusual.

Being self employed is normal but that’s still poorly paid and poor working conditions.

there isn’t much profit margin in construction so owning a business isn’t massively attractive IMO. But tradies are absolutely the type of people who would struggle to work for a manager/ within a organisation so tend to be quite limited in workplace options.
They are also usually very hard working and like to be outside so adapting to an office or retail environment can be hard.

Being hard-working is a huge asset in your life generally, not just in your career. Working hard at hobbies or DIY or relationships can hugely improve your life. However, you also need to be clever. Knowing where to direct your energies and when to stop doing things is equally important.

You were motivated in part I’m sure because you were raised in poverty. It sounds like your step DC were raised to be a bit complacent but that might still be something you can address.

There's also this too though - DH and his brother were often financially supported by his parents to a level that we won’t be able to provide

your DH parents seemingly had 2 children between them? You and your DH have 5 children between you, surely you can see that the support you're then able to provide is hugely diluted.

DH and I have chosen to also only have 2 children to ensure we will be able to financially support them as they grow, I grew up in massive poverty as one of 4 kids in the late 80's early 90's, think repossessed cars/houses, a life growing up being the kids on FSM with only handme down clothes, mum who didn't work, life on benefits, putting £2 in the car to get us to school scraped out of 5ps from a jar. So 0 parental help in anything.

I left school after year 11 with GCSE's only, but worked in bars up to management level then in my mid 20s moved into admin management. At 40 now I'm just getting my degree (not necessary but for my own personal development) I won't be pushing my kids to go to uni, but into roles which will likely suit them better straight out of college - accountancy, a trade etc. in which degree level qualifications are earned while learning.

DH laughs at them and says they’ll need to work full-time. DH was extremely financially incompetent throughout his 20s and he and SC’s mum were supported and repeatedly bailed out by his parents, so to be honest, I don’t think he has the same depth of fears as me as he’s never been poor, he’s always worked hard, and everything has “just worked out” for him.

But since then, ILs’ business has folded, they still support DH’s brother who barely works, and the money just won’t be there for SC like it was for DH.

I understand what you’re saying but YABU

You have managed to buy your own home, so your hard work has paid off.

Not only do you have equity to fall back on if you needed to but your kids will have money to inherit that will allow them to buy their own home - this alone is worth all of your hard work.

I work very hard and often feel deflated like you because I barely saw my DC as I was working and studying as a single parent but I hope that when they’re adults I will be able to help them out financially more and if I can get a mortgage they’ll have an inheritance which I never had and never will.
I see it less as me gaining from it right now and more about breaking the poverty cycle so my DC don’t grow up in as much poverty.

I don’t think university = high pay though.

And I am frustrated that after years of working FT and studying in the evenings to get a bachelors then masters degree, I will never get to over £37k even at management level in my field and my job is stressful too.
I can’t even get a mortgage on my salary.

I think I will encourage my DC to look for high paying careers, rather than doing a job you enjoy (which I think has been my mistake).

I always prioritised studying, doing homework, revising, getting work experience and working many times to the detriment of friendships or having fun.
I was someone who always played by the rules, always conformed and always got good grades but my life is very similar to those I went to school with who spent more time messing around and having fun. And I'm definitely a long way from the life I was told to expect if I did well and studied hard.

I have a stable job with a good company which I am grateful for but with wage stagnation and increasing costs of living I have nowhere near the standard of living I was told to expect. Increasing costs are also limiting opportunities for promotion and further training with my employer.
Neither of my parents went to university but they both entered good careers and worked their way up. In their early thirties they purchased a four bedroom detached house in one of the nest areas of town and could afford multiple abroad holidays per year. At the same age, I have a three bedroom flat in a town with a bad reputation and can afford a holiday every three years or so.

If I had know this was my future, I would have not worked so hard and enjoyed life more when I was young.

I agree it worked for me to an extent. At 40, I’m in a position where I can reduce my hours to spend time with my DC, and my generation were able to work up the ladder. I can’t provide as I hoped to, but life is easier than it’d be if I hadn’t worked hard.

I think social mobility is decreasing and Gen Z and Alpha won’t have the same opportunities though.

Yanbu
I have worked hard at everything. None of it has paid off. I am still in a minimum wage job and no prospects.
I am a failure, despite doing nothing but work.
We are living pay cheque to pay cheque whilst performing a financial balancing act with absolutely no end in sight.

I think consistency not hard work pays off. It also matters what you put effort into - sometimes there is an element of luck involved. Small conscious decisions make big impact over time without high stakes like thousands of pounds of student debt etc. Some of the most successful people I know were not at all academic, but they had good values and work ethic.

The truth is, the phrase "hard work pays off" is often a comforting myth, especially in the face of widespread economic inequality and systemic challenges. It's a phrase that ignores the realities of luck, privilege, and the fact that the system is not a pure meritocracy.

The way I see it: hard work is necessary, but it's rarely sufficient.

But what is the alternative? I don’t believe a life on UC is easy (or if someone is winging it, I think benefits will have to be curbed at some point anyway). I’d rather be working hard in a caring profession slowly building up a pension and paying off a giant mortgage than doing neither of these things - some people’s retirements are going to be horrible.

This was my mother. I watched and saw her example and got an education so I could get a professional job, which raised me above minimum wage. She had it easier than you have it probably, because she was made redundant younger than I am now, and was unable to find more work and lived the rest of her life on benefits which were almost the same as her work paid. Definitely more than she would have received in benefit now.