Men still have the control, how is this ok?

[Unad11]

I have had various experiences with men, some good and some bad. But the reality of how men still control the world really hit me when I had DD.

DP left me during pregnancy after a four year relationship. Things that followed…

Called CMS and was spoken to like shit, had to call constantly to get anything done. Told they would ‘do what they can’ (spoiler, that’s very little).

When he was forced to pay, he did. But he can have a 24% increase in his pay during the year which isn’t taken into account for any increase. He did actually have a 20% increase and he pocketed it all without giving any extra towards DD’s life… this despite the fact that the nursery bill alone was more than double his contribution from CMS.

When he had more involvement in her life it was on his terms. He was often late. I did all the hard yards of keeping her up to date with vaccinations and enrolling her in and paying for nursery.

Then I had the role of being there 24/7 if she ever needed collecting from nursery. It was me who had to ask favours of my manager, me whose career was affected, me who shouldered the financial penalties.

And the real kicker? If you dare to talk about money, you’re a gold digger, you’re all about money or you’re reminded that the money is for DD and not ‘for you.’ That’s ignoring the fact that the lovely gentlemen paying the maintenance is receiving thousands from you in unpaid childcare… if he isn’t parenting 50% of the time (ie his share) he’d have to pay a nanny… but oh wait, he doesn’t because the woman is expected to do it all.

And the next kicker… if you dare to complain that you’re doing it all, don’t you WANT to look after your DD? What a terrible mother you are!

The reality is, money matters. Money protects, money gives you control. Men need to pay up, properly. Men and women need to stop shaming women for speaking up.

I also want to add to my rant that I think nursery is the only place where you hear people talking about it like it’s a charity… (when they’re not)… if it closes or there’s a shut down, no you shouldn’t have to pay to ‘ensure the staff are paid.’ Only in a childcare context is it that the women are supposed to be grateful for the service being provided in return for huge fees. Imagine a gym closing for a day and people (men) being told shut up and pay because the staff still need paying. Women are always supposed to be grateful, we are outsourcing our job to earn money, when that’s shameful remember (..!!) And yes I know the ts and cs often say you must pay when there’s closures but that’s not the point, the point is it’s the only industry where that’s supposed to be accepted. Women you must be grateful even if you are paying through the nose for the childcare.

I sound bitter and twisted (because I am) but I am (very luckily) financially secure and mostly protected from this shit these days (DD now 5).

But… I want to help make changes. I don’t know where to start. Any ideas thoughts or comments very much welcome. And I’m bracing myself for the usual misogynistic posts too, of course.

I disagree. The men who have control are only those who are prepared to walk away from their children. Women happy to do the same would be equally in control. There’re just fewer of them.

If parents want their children, it’s actually women who have more control - there is still a natural bias towards mothers, in the law.

We all need to be more careful about who we procreate with.

I do think there needs to be a change to how child maintenance is calculated. A proportionate share of nursery fees needs to be taken into account if the child is at nursery as its often unaffordable on one salary. This means that women are forced out of work. There also needs to be a way of making self employed absent parents pay a reasonable share. It should also take into account inheritance and pther passover income so you don't get absent parents having an amazing lifestyle but not paying anything to their children because its not a salary.

I'm not sure how you sort out the issue of men not taking emergency leave etc for children's sick days but think that things could be done.

One of the beat things we could do is give men a take it or leave it paternity leave. Studies show that people who do this and countries that implement this have a lot more equal split in tasks between men and women, less chance the woman is the default parent etc. But people here struggle to see the link between starting off being the sole carer and always being the sole carer - its not womens fault but I've heard plenty of mothers saying no way they'll be giving up any of their maternity leave so their husband can have a few months off etc.

Could you tell me some of those biases in the law?

The only ones I can think of are:

That a woman can register a child without the father being present, whereas a man has to be married to the mother to do so. (although it's not hard to be added later)

I suppose you might view the fact that a newborn wouldn't be expected to have shared custody with overnights - although only if that newborn is being breastfed, and the mother will still be expected to facilitate access, and that's more about the newborn than the mother.

@SunnyViper your perspective here is the root of the issue. Why is it a woman’s role to
navigate the shit behaviour of men? The point is that men can and do walk away, do the bare minimum, don’t have any shame for doing so… that is the issue. The issue is that the world makes women solely responsible for everything, as your post demonstrates.

I disagree. If I buy a new car, I research it and check out reviews. If it is second hand, I check it has an MOT, service history and I get it examined. That is for something that is not so important. For a relationship that hopefully will be lifelong, my discernment and due diligence will be much higher.

The problem is that people jump into relationships and then do not have in depth conversations about values/beliefs, gender roles and expectations and what you are bringing from your family of origin that you want to integrate into your new family, to name but a few things to discuss.

It is totally women’s role to navigate men’s shit behaviour and avoid it as it is men’s to do the same. Engaging in a lifelong relationship and having kids without building sound foundations is asking for trouble.

Men lie about it all the time though because they know how much most women want kids. I think the only way to know their true feelings is to say you're on the fence/childfree and gauge his reaction. I would hazard a guess that most men would accept that and not have a burning desire to have kids. Whereas a woman would probably leave a partner if he said he didn't want kids because it's THAT important to her.

I'm praying for beautiful abundance in your life. May 2026 be your best year, and around every corner magic and delight.

That's AWFUL. 😡

Never mind, DS2 will realise who has and hasn't been there for him when he's older. Funny how these awful men never seem to realise that children grow up and become adults, and they don't magically forget their childhood - quite the opposite.

Very admirable but not sure living your life like some sort of human version of “Which” or “What Car” is always quite so linear as you’d have us all think

I don’t think @SunnyViper is wrong, as there are conversations that could be had about values and attitudes before committing to a relationship or having children. This kind of content used to be part of marriage preparation courses run by churches, so a secular version would be a pretty good idea!

But the issues are that the people who would benefit from such input probably wouldn’t engage and that relationships often happen very quickly due to overwhelming sexual attraction, as nature intended!

I have written this on here before, but my advice to young women would be to look carefully at a man’s habits, even at a young age, because they will likely remain much the same. If he habitually drinks, games and lolls in bed a lot as a student, making excuses as to why he can’t attend lectures, cook a meal, tidy up or travel home to see his parents, he is unlikely to suddenly transform himself into a hardworking, family-focused husband and father. Everyone has a lazy day, of course, but it’s the habits that are telling.

Oh please
My ex was none of the things you describe as telling in terms of bad habits: quite the opposite in fact but turned out to be extremely abusive and dangerous as well as highly controlling.
equally so there are literally thousands of young men who do all those things you would have us believe are red flags but turn out to be great fathers and husbands in years to come.

I am sorry that you went through that. It sounds awful.

However, if we are talking about effort and the work of family life, I still stand by my view (also based on personal observation) that men who are lazy of habit and have a poor attitude in early adulthood rarely undergo a personality transformation in later life. They may be able to hide it in the workplace (where they are getting paid and rewarded with status) but it will come out in their home life, especially when a woman comes along to do the hard work of running a home. Social structures also reinforce this pattern.

If they do decide to change they will also have an uphill battle to fight. Habits and lifestyle are hard to change. Why else are books about motivation and avoiding procrastination such huge best sellers?

The same applies to women of course. Laziness, in anyone, doesn’t bode well for a successful relationship or family life. The only blessing is that laziness is easier to spot than other flaws because the person in question is generally sitting in front of you doing nothing.