AIBU - sparklers indoors should be illegal following Crans Montana deaths

[Onemorechristmas]

I know that there are specific indoors sparklers that are legal (and it is illegal to use outdoor sparklers indoors) but wouldn’t it be much simpler if all sparklers were illegal for indoor use? Isn’t it asking for trouble to say some are ok and some aren’t?

I’m being unreasonable - current legislation is sufficient
I’m NOT being unreasonable - legislation should be simplified such that no sparklers may be lit indoors

You would think common sense is enough but sadly no

Ummm... I don't know enough about this case to say. Does anyone know if they were legal indoor sparklers or illegal outdoor ones?

I know they keep being called "sparklers", but they're not the ones on a stick that you used to have as a kid.

They're more like a firework.

Either way, cladding the ceiling in foam, not having a sprinkler system or adequate means of escape are equally to blame.

i agree that the lack of sprinklers fire escapes and flammable foam is the reason. Is there no fire safety there or did the owners just ignore it? That should be the focus not the sparklers. They should be prosecuted

Several fairly jaw dropping issues involved I think.
Lack of robust health and safety laws being implemented?
Lack of effective management.
Very young teenagers plied with alcohol.
But most of all a complete lack of common sense so sadly.

Don't make me tap the sign again 😂

Such a shame you didn't tell the Swiss Government this a few weeks ago, if only they knew.

It would be ridiculous to ban something based on an isolated incident. In any case, it was the speed at which the fire spread that appeared to be the reason for so many deaths and casualties. However, we won't know until it has been fully investigated.

Surely the venue wasn't in line with fire safety regulations in the first place. Even my small 1st floor flat is more fire-safe than that, as per the rules in the UK.
Switzerland isn't exactly a third world country, I'm sure they too have health & safety requirements. I don't think the sparklers are the main issue here, just the trigger.

It's like saying that electric appliances should be banned in buildings after the Grenfell.

Seeing as the owners of the bar are being investigated for culpable homicide I don’t think this is a necessary thing to do. The message will be getting through loud and clear.

There seem to be so many of these basement bars around. I used to go to this kind of place in my 20s. Searching for ways to stop this kind of thing happening, I guess. Like people have commented, there were loads of factors, not just one. Dreading the day my own children go to places like this….

The onus remains on competent bar owners and managers not to clad their ceiling with flammable materials tbh. And the various authorities to inspect and enforce the laws around fire safety accordingly.

I haven't worked in a night club in the best part of 20 years, yet I have never forgotten the footage of that horrific fire in the USA in 2003 where 100 people died because of flammable materials used around the stage and pyrotechnics. Every bar and club in our UK city checked, changed and made safe everything they could. I was also trained to check fire escapes and escape routes were clear every shift, even as a teenage barmaid.

How the ever loving fuck we have such a similar fire happening all these years later is beyond me.

Allow the proper investigation to happen before leaping to conclusions and nanning things.

I’d counter argue that they should be absolutely legal.

A premises constructed with appropriate fire retardant materials, with fire compartmentalisation in place, adequate and sizeable fire exits, clear evac plans, fire fighting equipment and trained staff, should be appropriate mitigations for stray flames.

I’d like to see the risk assessment for the girls carrying the champagne sparklers as they did (I suspect there wasn’t one), but ultimately the biggest failure in many small ones here appears to be in the building and it’s fire risk assessment

Sparklers indoors are ridiculous, but equally, sound insulation cladding, there's that word again, that catches light so easily and spreads so quickly is equally ridiculous. Thought the Swiss had higher standards than this.

Horrific for those who were caught up in it and also for their families of both the injured and dead. The bar had allegedly passed 3 inspections.

Couldn't believe the number of people in the bar filming the fire when it started rather than getting out.

I worked in hospitality from around 2008-2019 roughly and I've lit hundreds of these bottle sparklers and carried them through incredibly busy bars. I'm only 5"2 so often when I was holding them up, they were level with people's hair.
I hated them then and I hate them now. I avoid places that have them.

Think they thought at first, that it was part of a NYD show.

@JoshLymanSwagger I didn't know that, I kept thinking about the little ones you played with as a kid. Off to look at outdoor sparklers

I cannot believe it happened in Switzerland of all places

It's so sad.

I remember sitting at a trampoline park and the table beside me whipped a cake out of a bag and lit multiple sparklers protruding from it. This was on a mezzanine overlooking a huge foam pit in which kids were playing. Absolutely crazy.

People lack imagination. And we normalise so much. Because those sparklers are so common, people lose sight of them as sparks and flame.

I really hope the owners get sued and have to pay all their money as compensation to the victims and families.

Don't think that's completely fair for people just trying to run a family business. What about all the safety certs that were signed off by their council equivalents, or the builders that installed the lethal foam cladding, again, presumably signed off by authorities ?

Did they tell the inspectors they regularly hold parties with those sparklers held so close to the ceiling?

And they’re not just a family business, the press are reporting that they are very powerful in the Swiss hospitality sector.