Thread 21 : To feel disappointed - and now disgusted too - after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?

[DisappointedReader]

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The Observer's original exposé: The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

First thread: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film? | Mumsnet

Links to threads 2-16, the other 20 Observer articles and videos to date, Raynor Winn/Sally Walker's statement, our timeline and sources can all be accessed in the OP and first few posts of Thread 17: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5403285-thread-17-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Thread 18: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5422393-thread-18-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Thread 19: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5437058-thread-19-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Thread 20: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5454438-thread-20-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

New posters joining us in the genuine spirit of our civil discourse are welcome. It would be helpful to get the background from at least some of the Observer exposé items before posting.
To all - Please be extremely cautious when it comes to naming or implicating people and addresses not in the public eye or with no direct connection to the story, and around the understandable health speculations, especially where details are unclear or still emerging. Remember, even Hollywood rabbits attract the odd flea. Please do not engage with drive-by scolders and ploppers who seem to have their own agenda and seek to derail. Avoid @'ing and quoting them as - from experience - this will only encourage them back to the threads. Over 5 months we have done amazingly well together for 20 very interesting, very serious and very silly threads so far. I can't be here as much as I'd like so all help with keeping our discussion walking along in our usual reasonable and respectful fashion is very welcome.

Keep to the path. No saltiness. Our Cardboard Mascot Our Simon has had his head stuck back on and is wearing a very fetching tinsel boa. The charabanc is bedecked with fairy lights and very well stocked up. May the seasonal fudge and mulled cider be with you one and all. 🎅🌲🎁❄️🎄

These threads are the gifts that keep on giving:
New:

• Salt Path: A Very British Scandal, available from Monday 15th December Sky Documentaries and NOW TV
• ‘Don’t look for the money. I’ve taken it all’: Salt Path author Raynor Winn’s ‘confession’ that she stole from her family | The Observer

Up and coming:

• Observer Newsroom: The Real Salt Path Story, Thursday 8th January 2026 6.30-7.30pm. More information and to book via this link observer.co.uk/our-events/the-real-salt-path-story
• Podcast series from The Observer's award-winning Investigative Journalist Chloe Hadjimatheou
• BBC Documentary (NB Not involving Our Chloe)

*MNHQ correcting above 'Documentary' to 'Podcast' at request of author

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They will have some people, even if they’re silly hangers-on in America who email them. They have defenders online, they will have them in real life.
Is their daughter back living with them?
If TimMoth is something of a fantasist charmer, he will have many superficial short-term friendships I think. And SalRay doesn’t need anyone but him. They seem somewhat workshy so I suggest being “holed up” together in beautiful surroundings with plenty of cash suits them well.

Good points @Freshsocks . For me I think the health claims are the biggest concern now. Everything else is in the past - the thefts, the false aspects of the walk, the fictitious timeline - but the supposed illness will go on and on. The end of the documentary captured it perfectly when Ruth the author stated that Moth is sort of stuck and cannot enjoy the spoils of their success. Because if he is seen out and is better, people will notice. He is a prisoner. And whatever mad story they concoct to get out of it, too many are watching with intense scrutiny. Their denial of any wrongdoing says it all. That will likely continue too, and no doubt they are planning their next grift.

A recent podcast
https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/this-much-is-true-crime/id1809279318?i=1000741933143

Around the first 18 minutes deals with the Salt Path, then they go on to discuss other cases in the news this year. I haven’t listened to all of it yet, but I will do. Also I think this is also available as a You tube video

It's conclusion is rather strange - that the readers who believed the story in TSP were innately gullible and therefore have no right to be disappointed and angry now the truth has been revealed. You could extend this argument to the victim of many crimes - being scammed, robbed, raped etc. Seems a very strange wsy of looking at the whole saga and forgets the very real victims involved - CBD sufferers given false hope etc

This seems to entirely consist of musings on the written quality of the piece and whether or not the story is a true 'memoir', But surely that is not the matter under discussion here, it could be the best written book in history BUT IT WASN'T HER FIRST PUBLISHED WORK. And THAT is the problem, not whether or not she stole or lied or Tim has CBD or not. As he correctly points out, many of the other nominated books were fiction anyway. It's not a prize for 'best non-fiction book'. It's a prize for best first book. And it was NOT her first book.

That is the problem.

Hello everyone on the charabanc. Been on and off these threads since July with different names (I often delete my MN account too). My granny used to always described our car packed up for camping holidays in the 80s as a charabanc so I've partly followed for that reason!
I'm back to say. I've been gripped by this as I knew it was a load of bull when I first read it. But a lot of people I know loved it. Not trying to sound superior. Just as I said previously I used to work in publishing and then later in fraud related work. I also know several people like the walkerwinns. In my own family I have close relatives in the same kind of codependent relationship. Also by coincidence from the same area of Midlands. Absolutely Timmoth is the driving force here. But Salray has a choice to walk away. She won't as she's codependent and covert narc. Also fraud requires a high level of deception. She very likely sees herself as completely deserving of the money and a victim. What a pair. They deserve each other. Their kids will need therapy.

If Chloe is still reading this thread. The documentary is excellent. I found it an interesting watch and well made/researched. I have a professional interest in this topic as well as personal reasons so it was interesting for that.

Lots of people won't care. But really the fake illness issues are awful. That is really low.

One thing that stood out to me is that people often say there's no karma and baddies frequently get away with things. I really don't believe this. When all is said and done. We all die. Your name and reputation is all you have left then. To be dispised by your family and with no friends having made no legacy other than deception. Well I wouldn't want millions of pounds in the bank. So yes they're not able to enjoy their success even if they think they are. Constantly peddling the story/lie (don't the interviews sound hollow when all together (exact same words each time. Huge red flag). Who cares if Penguin made money. I'm just pleased that those wronged got to have a chance to set the record straight. That is priceless. Worth more than millions. They can't really enjoy it all that's punishment in itself.

We are so lucky to have a country where investigative journalism is able to flourish and truths be spoken. Well done all but especially Chloe.

Oh and I have a Warren Evans bed. I sleep on it every night. It's lasted years (probably not ideal if you need to make money from bed selling). I love it though. It's been the best bed I ever bought. Warren seems like a decent chap. The story though shows they're huge freeloaders. We know they weren't doing the whole path yet they even freeloaded from him while on their 'walking holiday'. That says it all. Most people wouldn't go to a complete strangers and eat all their food etc. What chancers! As my granny would say 'some people think the world owes them a living'. If anyone embodies that its Timmoth with his ridiculous cravats.

Keep being salty all of you. Have enjoyed these threads so much.

I don’t think that’s what he’s saying, more that TSP taps into a more general ‘wellness’ trend and a longtime Western cultural fantasy of a not-very-wild ‘wild’ Nature as succour/source of healing, which predisposed critics and reviewers as well as a more general readership in its favour.

I think some of what he says goes some way to help understand those who still cling to loving the books, despite knowing the reality behind them. For a lot of people, it’s a really appealing fantasy.

He’s right about the Englishness of it all, too (I’m not originally from the UK). And for all SW’s self-positioning as a farmer, deeply rural and someone attuned to livestock etc as well as wild animals, her construction of ‘nature’ in TSP is pretty much an urban/suburban bucolic camping fantasy with a bit of bolted-on poverty and illness. Simon Armitage, writing about the same walk (well, the first part, the bit TSP does in more detail) is much more attentive to the towns and villages on/near the path, and to the less ‘bucolic idyll’ parts, the weird bits where it diverts inland on an unbeautiful route and goes under flyovers, or where you cross golf courses etc. That wouldn’t fit the SW message.

And DB does address seriously, further up, the specific sense of betrayal felt by those who’d believed TSP’s message of hope for the chronically ill, and the worry that it might promote bogus forms of treatment, or cause the chronically ill to self-blame for not exercising themselves into a cure.

One of the problems & he’s not aware. He mentions other worthy nominees & his certainty she would win.

Great post. I would add they’re enjoying their spoils for now but there’s another book next year so it will be interesting to see how the PR machine turns then.

@SlightlyFeckless He’s right about the Englishness of it all, too (I’m not originally from the UK). And for all SW’s self-positioning as a farmer, deeply rural and someone attuned to livestock etc as well as wild animals, her construction of ‘nature’ in TSP is pretty much an urban/suburban bucolic camping fantasy with a bit of bolted-on poverty and illness. Simon Armitage, writing about the same walk (well, the first part, the bit TSP does in more detail) is much more attentive to the towns and villages on/near the path, and to the less ‘bucolic idyll’ parts, the weird bits where it diverts inland on an unbeautiful route and goes under flyovers, or where you cross golf courses etc. That wouldn’t fit the SW message.

Thank you for your writing on this. I wouldn't have been able to pin down what I have always felt about this. I have contrasted how authentic Simon Armitage sounds in comparison to Sally Walker. For me, it isn't 'Englishness' it is the difference between the inland rural and coastal communities.

I'll give it over to Simon to explain further, for me. When he walks the north coast he carefully chooses a holly stick to carry "a representation of who I am, and where I'm from, something of myself". Maybe if I ever walk the Pennines then I will carefully choose a sturdy stick of driftwood.

Whenever, I dip into TSP there is something jarring that does not ring true. Yet the Walkers have perpetrated this fantasy of having walked all of the SWCP and how 'the Path' has changed them. Simon also sums it up, for me, with “Although I got lost in the Pennines sometimes, I did feel at home. I don’t here. I feel like a stranger.”

I think there are many problems as you say, but with a view to the Christopher Bland prize the only disbarring qualification that TSP had is that it wasn't her first published work. Dreadful books win literary prizes all the time - content is totally subjective. There was no reason (other than her being a dreadful thieving liar, and if we stopped all authors who were horrible people from winning anything, the prize lists would become a LOT thinner) for TSP not to be in with a shout of winning. Except that it wasn't eligible for entry in the first place, because of HNTDDD.

It doesn't matter that he thought it was a great book and knew it would win and all that shit (and I would question his impartiality if he thinks that the fact that it's sold lots of copies and had lots of reviews means that it is objectively 'a good book'). What matters is that the book should never have been entered.

Oooh. Turns out this is the hill I will die on!

I don’t disagree, it was another ‘easy win’ 10k. It’s especially abhorrent as the plot retells & relishes (?) in the ‘I got away with it’ ease of the ‘candy from a baby’ deception. Maybe Chloe will circle back here? The promoting at local bookshops gets to me too.

Let us sit together at the back of the charabanc and share our fudge!

There was some debate last week as to the terms of the prize for the year Salray won it, how did that pan out? was it established that a self published book was not allowed? I can't remember if this was double checked, I will happily email them and ask if there is still any doubt.

I think it has always been a prize for the first published book and when I looked at the terms and conditions, even self published work was included. I couldn't see the terms for the year TSP won, but I doubt very much if they would have changed their terms - first published usually means first published in most competitions and awards like this. Otherwise you get very experienced multi-published self pubbed authors competing with those who really genuinely have written their first book and that's not fair.

Unless these were the terms for the first prize, when they saw the error of their ways, but I'm pretty sure it's always been first book, even self published.

But he doesn’t say anywhere that he thinks it’s a great book — he just says he thought it was obvious that it was likely to win the CB over other strong contenders because it had been uniformly rapturously received by reviewers and readers alike, and had been shortlisted for other awards. And in noting that Gillian Slovo, daughter of an anti-apartheid memoirist, was one of the judges, I think he’s just pointing out yet another instance of a well-informed critic/writer liking it.

(Though in fairness, from friends who’ve judged book awards, it’s sometimes come down to how persistent one or two judges can get in the judging sessions about their favourite, or, sometimes every judge is aggressively championing different shortlisted books and the prize then goes to a compromise candidate that most people had put second…)

So I think his point is really that it wasn’t just the gullible ‘ordinary reader’ who was taken in by TSP, but experienced book reviewers for newspapers, widely-read, well-informed literary prize judges etc. And that he’s interested in why that was the case, when it has emerged that this is another in a long line of high-profile literary scams.

Looking again at PSPA's website.

its statement says:

"We were shocked and disappointed to learn of the allegations made about Raynor and Moth Winn by The Observer this weekend. We know the article has taken everyone by surprise and has made people affected by Corticobasal Degeneration (CBD) and Progressive Supranuclear Palsy (PSP) feel angry, let down and eager for clarity."

I didn't remember the highighted bit. Has it been added for clarity, or was it always there?

You are right that he's not extolling its virtues as a piece of work and he's very careful to only quote the positive things that others have said about it without really saying anything in his own voice, other than that it was 'inspiring.' In fact he goes into some detail over all the good stuff that others have said about it, and is rather general in terms of other books that have been found to be fraudulent, without descrying TSP. But he doesn't question its eligibility for the award, which is really the whole crux of the matter.

I totally get that it stings for your fellow authors and you, but I think this is not going to change the decision. Awards are generally about selling more or promoting more in all industries. They have them in my industry. Just spend some time on LinkedIn. So many 'awards'. In any given year awards are awarded to a select group of people and it's never actually fair as completely subjective. Most writers have published in some format. The other book was self published not industry published (there own limited company isn't a publishing company really). Yes she shouldn't have entered but her publisher entered her. Prizes sell more copies. Even being longlisted. Runners up etc all industries. The 'best' doesn't always win. Lots are not even nominated.
I very much doubt this will be overturned as it makes the award look bad and then probably means it won't run in future years. I'm no fan of awards really but they serve a purpose. Usually a PR one. They don't reflect the 'best' and never have. In the scheme of deceptions this is small. I'd never heard of this prize. Books often have 'prizes' on their covers. The well known ones obviously hold a lot of sway but then we've all read Pulitizer prize books that are a bit mmmh. They often date quite quickly and are of an era.

Visit Cornwall's section on "The Salt Path" describes the book as "true", immediayely before a big sub-heading "The healing power of nature". Given the context, that could be understood as suggesting miracle cures to vulnerable people. Troubling.

https://www.visitcornwall.com/things-to-do/walking/the-salt-path

Well, who has, though (outside of us on here)? I’ve forgotten, if I ever knew.

Who has actually drawn attention to the existence of HNTDDR and said in print that ‘Izzy Wynn-Thomas’ is SW/RW, therefore TSP was ineligible for a first book prize?

Well, Chloe seems fairly certain. And I suspect it's going to be raised in subsequent podcasts. And I'm pretty sure that someone has made the CB prize awarders aware by now...

CH has said SW was IWT, yes, but has anyone in print yet made the point that she obtained the CB prize under false pretences? (I mean, to add to the rest of her grime sheet… 🙄)

Thank you @Vroomfondleswaistcoat, my personal feeling about this, Salray absolutely does not deserve this prize, on no other grounds than she has lied in order to receive it. Some people will not care, in the same way that they don't seem to care if Raymoth walked the path or not. Making false health claims and profiting from them, is something more people find harder to excuse or ignore. If she is brought down on this lie, it would be very hard for anyone to still support her.

Salray could come out with all kinds of excuses but I don't think they would wash. Then I think removing the prize would be possible, people would find it hard to keep defending her and I don't think they would want to. There are examples of other authors who have had prizes taken from them, so why not Salray.