To tell them not to bother coming for Xmas?

[WantToHibernate]

We are doing Xmas dinner this year for my husbands family and my mum and brother. We have a mix of vegans, vegetarians and meat eaters so dinner menu will reflect this.

I’ve been vegan for 20 years and my daughter who is 17 has become vegan this year. My husband and other child eat meat.

My mother and brother have always disapproved of me being vegan. Over the years they’ve told me I’m wrong and will be ill. They also do stupid things like make animal noises when they eat meat which I just roll my eyes at. Now they’ve found out, whilst discussing Xmas dinner menus at our house this weekend, that my daughter has become vegan and they’ve responded as expected, telling her she’ll be ill, that she shouldn’t listen to me ‘brainwashing and bullying’ her, quizzing her on why she has become vegan, telling her she’s mad and no better than them. My daughter remained calm, said it was her decision, that I obviously haven’t bullied or brainwashed her, that she doesn’t think she’s any better than anyone else, she just wants to be vegan. When they continued were quiz her on why she has become a vegan, they called her a ‘typical preachy vegan’. She wasn’t preaching, she just answered their questions.

Things got heated as my mother started shouting. I told her that she doesn’t get to shout at my daughter in our house about this, and that if they both don’t stop the comments they can leave and not bother coming for Xmas. My brother said our mum can say what she likes and that I owed my mum an apology for saying that. My daughter left the room. My son told my mum and brother that they were out of line and went to check on my daughter. My mum and brother left.

My brother text later on to say that when they come on Xmas day they don’t want to be seated by me or my daughter. I’ve not responded as I wanted to cool down before I did, but my husband has said to just uninvited them because they’re arseholes and he’s not risking them upsetting our daughter on Xmas day. My daughter says she isn’t bothered and thinks they’re idiots.

If I uninvite them, I think that will probably be the end of my relationships with them but I think that is possibly for the best. There have been lots of problems with them over the years and I think we may be happier without them. They have had issues with other aspects of our life, choices we’ve made, my husbands family (who are all lovely) who they see as ‘snobby’, so the vegan issue is just another thing. They are ok is small doses. My other siblings have low or no contact with them and although I invited them to dinner too, they won’t come because our mother and brother are coming.

My son told my mum and brother that they were out of line and went to check on my daughter. My mum and brother left.

you poor son having to step in instead of his parents to stand up to his awful grandmother.

how old is your DD and DS @WantToHibernate ?

Definitely keep them uninvited, they sound horrible. Just look at how many people you've got here siding with you when traditionally MN is rather negative about vegans! I'm not a vegan myself but have never had any problem with them and I wouldn't serve dinner to this pair even though it wouldn't make any practical difference to me at all.

From what you say its not about being vegan or not being vegan, its about feeling inadequate for some reason and attacking others for the imagined slight. Sometimes you can maintain a relationship particularly where there is a more vulnerable family member in the mix like a younger sibling, but there needs to be boundaries otherwise the balance could tip. It sounds like this was a tipping point. I wonder if your mother knows you tolerate her for the sake of her brother and has partly wanted the escalation so she could force a choice? I am sorry you have had to deal with this for so long. Holidays and other family events do increase the stressors on relationships perhaps this is also a contributory factor. She may back down but do insist on setting limits. I would be very clear that a family gathering is exactly that, people do not come to behave unkindly to any other guest present including a daughter or granddaughter.

Yes!
A huge parenting mistake for a child to be put in the position of having to defend his sibling against abusive relatives.
Unbelievable really.
So toxic.

And alcohol, chocolate, mince pies and of course cheese and I say that as someone who loves cheese so much that if there was a religion devoted to it, I'd sign up 😋🧀 But it's all the fault of the brazils, the pistachios, the almonds, the macademias etc...😁

Glad you have rescinded your invitation.
They sound awful.
I am sure you will get a horrible reply from them with a big dose of darvo in there so be prepared for that

OP, Duty, Obligation and Guilt are difficult to cast aside but sometimes you just have to weigh up what makes you, and the people you genuinely love, happier.
Maybe your older brother can get through to your younger brother and you can connect again and help him cut the umbilical/apron strings.

What bizarre behaviour by two grown adults. So childish to ridicule your daughter like that. I think you will be better off without them in your lives henceforth.

Just ensure your dd and other dc block numbers if their delightful grandma/uncle have them on there. I massively admire what you've done, OP, wish I had the guts to do similar! I wonder if your db will eventually wake up and smell the coffee?

I echo pp, expect flying monkeys/attempted visits/health crisis.

Only very small minded people attack others for their views/dietary choices because they feel threatened. They sound awful, uninvite them and I expect you will have a much happier Christmas meal.
I experienced a 'friend' verbally attacking me for being a vegan but I didn't give them a chance to to it a second time!

Uninvite they are arseholes

Yup, that sort of behaviour is quite common especially from acquaintances ime. Many vegans don’t mention they are vegan unless it relates to going out to eat, or say in relation to Christmas presents (to avoid being given something unsuitable), so its almost only when we have to. But so many, men especially get on their high horse in a combative and rude manner. They also fail to recognise that a burger is circle shaped, not an animal part, as are many things including coins, wagon wheels, and vegan/veggie burger (its not exclusive to a reconstituted animal product) and that they also eat plenty of vegan food on a daily basis.

Anyone who says they won’t sit next to YOU in YOUR house is nuts. Have a lovely Christmas without them.

Their behaviour is childish and totally unacceptable. Uninvite them without regret.

Even if you did go on and on about being vegan, that does not give them the right to be rude and disrespectful towards you and your family. All they’d have to do is steer the conversation towards other subjects and if that didn’t work they could vote with their feet.
The animal noises are particularly cruel and I think I’d be inclined to do a Mumsnet favourite response “ did you mean to be so rude?”

Excellent stuff OP. On some occasions, the Benthamite principle of the greatest happiness of the greatest number has to come first and feast days and festivals are among them. On the one hand, there's you, your DH, your DC, your in-laws and hopefully your other siblings with any partners and DC. On the other hand, your DM and DB, with nothing to bring to the table but spite and rancour. If they can't see that their behaviour crosses every line of good manners and decency, they should absolutely be elsewhere. Just make sure you have those electric gates of yours locked as soon as all of your invited guests are on your side of them, because boundary stompers like your DM and DB don't take kindly to being told to shove off.

Good for you, op! You’ve done the right thing.

You mum and brother need to learn about kindness and respect. We are all entitled to voice our opinions but this should always be done respectfully. Christmas is a time of joy and making happy memories with those we love and care about. I would suggest your mother and brother spend Christmas day together but not at your house.

Are they a bit thick? Sorry, just tell them you’re doing nut roast only this year and they may wish to make other plans

So your brother still wants to come to your house, to eat a meal you've cooked, but has specified he doesn't want to be seated by you or your daughter.

Stuff that. Tell them where to go.

I tend to find vegans really exasperating (possibly because I knew one who was full-on beee kiiiind while being a complete bitch to her DC and her ex).

But I'm on your side in this. Your mother and brother are being childish and pathetic and behaving in a completely unnecessary fashion. They're the ones driving the wedge into the relationship, not you.

I'm beginning to think Christmas is like weddings and funerals. It brings family feuds and petty spite to the fore.

Your daughter sounds like she handled it brilliantly – she behaved with far more maturity than her grandmother, that's for sure 👑.

Berating your own granddaughter, accusing her of having a superiority complex, demanding not to have to sit near and and STILL expecting to be invited to Christmas lunch? Pathetic.

Definitely don't let those two come and spoil your Christmas.

I really hope you texted..

'Sure, we can make sure you're not sat next to me or DD... or DH.. or anyone else for that matter - you're uninvited, so won't have to even be in the same postcode as us. Do not turn up at our house, you won't be coming in'.

In some families, where for years and years people have got away with jaw dropping disrespect. Until finally the children reach an age when they stand for it no longer. As in this one