To say that most people in the UK want illegal immigration to stop

[Sleepysleepycoffeecoffee]

I recently commented on a Facebook post to say the majority of British people are against illegal immigration. I was asked by several other users what survey I based that opinion on. I responded with the question ‘do you think most people want illegal immigration to continue then? Because if not, then surely they want it to stop?’ I didn’t receive any responses to that.
Without getting into any political arguments or name calling and giving no ifs, buts or reasons for your view, please vote as follows.

YABU - I want illegal immigration to continue.
YANBU - I don’t want illegal immigration to continue.

Yes this. Folk have got lives and can’t be bothered arguing with randoms on the internet who proclaim anyone who dares disagree are racists, bigots and the like.

People don’t need to comment on here they’re simply voted and it clearly shows 4 out of 5 people are fed up with it so a clear an significant majority

Where we live now is very diverse, and I love it. However, my experience may be different as we're a mixed race family and we've also both lived abroad in a country where we were both visibly different from the majority of the population.

Perhaps those experiences make it easier for us to integrate across cultural boundaries.

Does that study look at:

a) Arrests of migrant MEN vs locally born MEN

or

b) Arrests of migrants vs locally born men AND women ?

The reason a lot of these “migrants are worse” claims relying on per-capita are flawed is because they actually don’t compare like-for-like. Young migrants seeking asylum & work here are overwhelmingly men, for well-documented reasons.

The same people I’m blaming while the boats are coming in. 🤷‍♀️

You do know what governments are for don’t you?

We need more workers than we currently “birth” to pay for our ageing population.

They have to come from somewhere.

Our EU membership gave us valuable supply of near-neighbours to fulfil that need. Brexit killed that stone dead.

But the irony is that we still need those workers from overseas - so we need to look further.

Brexit was pushed upon us by oligarchs who told lies which were lapped up by the more gullible and lower IQ members of our society. They had a many reasons to do it, but here are a couple:

a) Oligarchs want to pay as little as possible for labour. The EU workers could command more than those from further afield. The oligarchs wanted to shift immigrant labour even cheaper - to improve margins, company profits, and secure their own wealth. Brexit achieved that for them, Boris Johnson being their PM who brought in this wave of replacement labour from further afield.

b) Oligarchs want as little regulation and rights protection as possible so that they can exploit the workforce. Removing EU protections and laws enables them to change the rules which protect us once they gain full power in parliament as they have full control (sold as “sovereignty” to the gullible). This is also the reason they want to remove our third party protection from the ECHR and HRA.

Anyone who aligns themselves with Reform, anyone who voted for Brexit, anyone who thinks stripping our protections to stop “migrants” is useful, anyone who thinks Farage / Lowe / Tice / “Tommy Robinson” and the rest of that clown act have our interests at heart is deluded.

Don’t sell us out to oligarchs, campaign for fair pay for all (regardless of origin), safe working conditions for all (regardless of origin), enforcing the tax burden on the ultra wealthy. Do not - whatever you do - allow yourself to be fooled into entrenching inequality. Do not be duped into thinking migration is “the problem”.

Britain changed the rules from 2000 for safe routes.

so some chose the back of a lorry.
some came on the channel tunnel.
some came on boats.

now it’s worse for folks fleeing.

They may not be allowed to work but plenty do in the black economy. The recent publicity around the ‘subletting’ of uber eats and just eat food delivery drivers was an eye opener.

Why would something in 2000 have anything to do with Brexit? As per your pp

Worded badly as I was talking about things recently but then it was asked why come in lorry’s before Brexit because the British government changed the rules and kept changing them.

Worded badly as I was talking about things recently but then it was asked why come in lorry’s before Brexit because the British government changed the rules and kept changing them.

Ok so in your pp where you mentioned Brexit cutting off safe routes it was really an Act in 2000 that limited them

Migration would only ease the pressure a bit but wouldn't be a solution. You can reform pensions, perhaps have tax breaks for married couples and be pro-natalist so that we have higher birth rates. If we need immigration, it should be limited high skilled immigration from countries that also more culturally compatible for us.

The rich pay a lot of tax already. Illegal tax evasion dwarfs legal avoidance. Most tax evasion is from small businesses.

Yes I think that’s the crux of it. I swear a few years ago we needed a million new houses. Now we have a few million extra people.

Honestly where do people think they should live?!

I studied landscape architecture. This country might look green but pretty much most of it is being used. Hence why it’s a nightmare to try to do anything.

We have to make a decision about what we want this country to look like and you have to be realistic. If you want detached houses with drives and gardens as a continued norm 100 years down the line then it is not sustainable to have immigration at this rate. If we want to turn into a series of purpose built high rises and flats with a balcony if you are lucky and walkable cities/ public transport then fine. But it will have a city feel to it. An island of strangers or blocks so to speak.

There’s nothing wrong with higher density apartment living. Much of the rest of the world does it. Including Switzerland for example, where I have lived extensively over the years.

In the UK, living in flats is stigmatised because of the “Englishman’s home is his castle” bollocks, and because everyone thinks of the brutalist deathtrap towers thrown up in the 1960s. But it can be much nicer than that.

This always comes up. If people want to live in flats they can. Most with families prefer a house.

That needs “nudging” then.

By far the biggest use of land in the UK is agriculture. Not sure how genuinely productive that land is though. We’ve conditioned ourselves to believe that farms are “nature” which doesn’t help.

Switzerland? A country 90+% white?

Better place to have a family and raise kids

We need food to be made. Farms are good.

No it doesn’t need nudging. Let people choose where to live without piling up with more high density flats.

Exactly.

Then expect - and allow - some agricultural land to be built on. The population has to grow either through increased birth rate or immigration in order to pay for our ageing demographics.

There isn’t enough non-agricultural land to allow this. If we’d prefer brownfield or redevelopment - great - but there’s very little of that available, so it absolutely MUST be higher density in order to deliver the housing we need.

‘the population has to grow’

Is there a point where it doesn’t have to keep going up?

In your view where is the population at in a couple of decades and past that in numbers? Is it just steadily upwards

To keep pace with state pension benefits, amongst the lowest in the G7. the population does need to keep growing. Unless we prefer a period of deflation, which is not generally recommended.

This is a conundrum everyone tries not to think about.

If we can get onto a strong economic footing, we can raise NI (because better wages will allow for that) or implement another mechanism for state pension support without population growth. These are the only known alternatives.

So you and pp are advocating for population growth. When they age do you keep going up?

How do you get away from that requirement? Unless you do see that the population needs to just keep going up steadily

Where is it in numbers in a few decades and past that