To have said that women should be drafted equally to men??

[Pukkajones]

Chatting to a group of friends about the state of the world etc and while in theory I’m against conscription and forced national military service I did say that I think it’s right that there is more equality in girls/women being treated the same as boys/men in the countries that have service.
One friend who has 3 teen girls really had a go at me and got very upset. I have a teen boy and teen girl. While I hate the idea of EITHER being forced to enter the military I think they should be treated equally ( roles allowing - ie some combat roles aren’t open to women) if it came to it. ‘it’ being an actual war with Russia and/or its allies.

it got VERY heated, even though I and another friend pointed out that there are many non-combat roles in the military. And that if we did end up in a World War we’d likely have a role in it regardless of sex or age.

YABU - only men should be drafted
YANBU - in the modern world both sexes should serve in the military.

I think it would be down to population regrowth. If men are being killed in their millions, then they need women to bear the next generation. One man can impregnate many women but a woman can only carry one pregnancy full term in a year.

Yes. I agree that no one should be conscripted, but if anyone is, it should be equal as long as the requirements of the role can be met.

I remember a discussion years ago with a friend who was in the military at the time, and his view was that women shouldn’t be in the infantry because men couldn’t be trusted not to put themselves at unreasonable risk to save women. We disagreed on this - but it’s an interesting example of the various views likely out there on this, as I was totally blindsided by this idea.

I agree. If certain people (men) in charge want to fight then they need to set up some kind of arena where they can do so. Not to drag innocent people into it just so they can play with their fancy new war toys.

what do you mean by " roles allowing - ie some combat roles aren’t open to women"? As far as I know there aren't any roles that aren't open to women, and haven't been for some years? (although obviously there are some roles where the physical entry requirements are so high it's harder for women to attain them).

Your friend with 3 girls sounds like a bit of a hypocrite. Did she give any actual reason for her rationale?

Although tbh it's a bit of a moot point - if it ever got to the stage where the UK joined a war and needed mass deployment everyone would have been nuked to fuck long before randoms off the street got called up and trained.

If anyone had to be conscripted, I'd actually prefer it to be generational rather than sex based. I'm 56 years old and have reproduced and raised my children and had much of my life. Makes far more sense to society to risk me than my DC who are looking after children and have more ahead than behind them. And if the argument is that women can go because physicality isn't important in modern warfare I don't see why not being in my prime would matter.

Absolutely, there is a biological imperative in ensuring that young women are protected. Not that they can’t be conscripted but on a population scale their ability to produce the next generation (if they want to) needs to be kept in mind.

They would just reach the total numbers needed using men and women rather than just men, so a certain proportion of both sexes wouldn’t be needed. I’m not sure how this would be done fairly though.

If conscription was to become necessary, then yes... equally men and woman.

Exemption for the Primary carer of a child, as selected by their parents.

Also... I believe its easy to say no to conscription in peace time. No one knows how we would actually feel in an actual emergency

Women bear the brunt of wars anyway and always have done - most recent example: www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn5wel11pgdo

I agree that there can be a place for national service/conscription, but i think it should be broader and include the health service and other essential services, then both men and women have a choice without having to declare themselves conscientious objectors. If men would prefer to provide nursing care at night on a care of the elderly ward then great, since these jobs are currently disproportionally staffed by, underpaid, women.

It depends what you mean by conscription. If you're saying everyone should be made to have some role in the military to further the war effort then maybe I agree with you. But to suggest that men and women are equal in terms of physical ability and either one can interchangeably perform the roles of an active fighting soldier then you're a fool. In real, on the ground combat women would more often than not be a distraction, a target and a liability. That's just how it is.

And don't get me started on one-sided 'equality'. Women should be exactly the same as men in this specific matter of war. But men are not expected to be exactly equal in terms of the domestic and emotional labour and unequal expectations that prevent women's progress in almost every other faction of life. Come back to me when that little issue is solved and we'll talk some more.

I have DC and in-laws who have all had/have military service. They all had both sexes serving with them and so they should. They have all been paid the same as their colleagues and, again, so they should. I would gladly serve my country, although I’m probably too old, but my DC have the prospect of being recalled, if we go to war, especially as they are now in roles that would help immensely.
How can your friend fight for her DD’s equality if she objects to them being called up?
I had this argument with my best friend many years ago when my DC first signed up and she thought I was mad for “allowing” them to do so!

I don't think it's Putin that poses the biggest threat to Europe somehow.

Equal conscription but first the army needs to sort out sexism in its ranks.

Sure, but I was talking about the whole lifespan. The female ones will certainly have all of that later, very unequally, unless there are major changes in society and young males start stepping up in the home in ways their forebears have so far avoided doing.

What we don’t want is spurious equality when it doesn’t benefit us, but not where it does. It needs to be fair across the board.

Would equal conscription change that? Well perhaps. But I wouldn’t hold your breath.

And for all those people who say that their pet is 'one of the family', conscription should be extended to include them too.

Adjusted for "pet years to human years' of course.
e.g. 1 dog year = 7 human years, so a dog could be conscripted at a little over 2.5 years old (2.5 dog years = 17.5 human years),
a cat would be just over 1 year, as they are more advanced, and canaries conscripted in similar time frame to dogs.

did she explain why she disagreed or did she just get upset and start ranting?

Seems like an extension of the madness that wants to completely ignore any biological differences between the sexes. It might not be popular to say biology predisposes either sex to be better or worse at a small section of jobs, but it's true none the less.

I want a six foot male police officer or fireman to rescue me. I wouldn't mind a six foot similarly strong woman either, but I've seen female police officers (and some very short male ones) lately that would struggle to physically restrain my toddler. I've watched criminals in town literally laugh and skip away from them.

And on the flip side of the biological coin, I would want a female nurse or nursery/primary school worker too, because of the significantly reduced risk that they are a violent/sexual threat to those weaker than them.

Male police officers...have you seen the amount of sexual misconduct that goes on?! The more female police officers the better to try and change the culture of misogyny.

This. I would never send my daughter off to face likely sexual harassment by her own side, knowing she would also suffer hideous sexual violence her brother wouldn't, if captured by the other side.

I think this a failure of the media, to be honest. We've become so squeamish in recent years that the full horror of the sexual violence women face in war effectively gets censored. With the result that a number of women seem to really believe it doesn't happen anymore in the modern day.

Bloody hell
No thanks 🤣
Women have so much more issues than men, why even pretend men and women are the same?
I know some Women don't suffer at all with periods and they wear tampons etc

But I hate tampons with a passion and use only pads so how would I run with my heavy periods?
I like to stay at home on my first day, working is miserable on that day.
Also, men don't get pcos, or endometriosis or periods at all, yay.
That alone should make it an option for women not compulsory.

Hopefully it doesn't come to that at all!
Also, women are more likely to have iron deficient anemia, and many other stuff.
Any woman arguing for conscription should argue for herself alone, do not talk for all women please!

My view is that men should equally not be conscripted. No one should be forced to participate in wars started by aggressive idiots with big egos.

I think when women cause and go to war, then yes. But for now wars can mostly be attributed to violent males and their egos, so no I wouldn’t send women to fight for them

I don’t think you’ll have any choice when the time comes and acting as if you will have a choice is foolish.

Maybe we could all agree that excessive greed should be punished by law in any country. Any man leading a country to war for land or money should be imprisoned and a new election take place. If the country votes for war (unlikely the people who fight it would offer to be the canon fodder) they need to be sanctioned by the rest of the world until the elect someone who isn't going to kill them. We shouldn't be still doing this like neanderthals.